Chicken or egg (QB vs Receiver)

[jrry32]

Which players, realistically, will be sitting there at 15 for us?

If a QB (Lynch) is there and they feel he is clearly the best value/need player, take him.

But if a terrific WR (Treadwell) is clearly the best value/need player in their mind, then he should be the pick.

So it's more about which specific players are there, rather than which position has a higher value.

It's about both. Treadwell can become the best WR in the NFL, but if Lynch becomes a top 10 QB, it was a major mistake to take Treadwell unless we drafted a top 10 QB later.(unlikely)

Remember two very possible factors in their thinking. They may feel that Treadwell is the safer pick in terms of his likely probability of success vs a QB. That's huge, imo. And they may also have their eye on another QB that they really consider a good fit and that they feel will be there in the 2nd round for them.

I disagree. Being a safer pick at a far less valuable position doesn't make enough of a difference. You take Lynch if you think he can be a franchise QB. No ifs, ands, or buts about it.

I've evaluated the QBs that might be available in Round 2...unless they're hoping Cook falls to their pick, they'll be shit out of luck. The best options after the top 4 are Brissett and Jones. Both need time to develop.

My point? Their draft strategy has multiple facets and is very nuanced.

Not unlike a chess game.

And like chess, you don't take a pawn over a queen.

 

[-X-]

And like chess, you don't take a pawn over a queen.

You must not play a lot of chess. There are many instances where you take a pawn off the board instead of the queen.
If the pawn is one move from being promoted, taking the queen instead only removes it for one move.
if the pawn is forcing check, you get rid of it and leave the queen alone.

 

[jrry32]

You must not play a lot of chess. There are many instances where you take a pawn off the board instead of the queen.
If the pawn is one move from being promoted, taking the queen instead only removes it for one move.
if the pawn is forcing check, you get rid of it and leave the queen alone.

I mean when you're getting a piece promoted. That wasn't very clear. My mistake.

 

[-X-]

I mean when you're getting a piece promoted. That wasn't very clear. My mistake.

I love it when people make mistakes in chess.

So I guess we've boiled this discussion down to the Rams staying at 15 and being presented with the option of Treadwell or Lynch. I don't think there's a right or wrong answer to that selection, and here's why. Snead and his scouting department have already scouted both and Fisher/Staff have a handle on which would provide more of a boost to the offense. I know where you stand, and you know where I stand. Now we need to figure out where they stand.

 

[jrry32]

I love it when people make mistakes in chess.

So I guess we've boiled this discussion down to the Rams staying at 15 and being presented with the option of Treadwell or Lynch. I don't think there's a right or wrong answer to that selection, and here's why. Snead and his scouting department have already scouted both and Fisher/Staff have a handle on which would provide more of a boost to the offense. I know where you stand, and you know where I stand. Now we need to figure out where they stand.

Not quite. I'm still in favor of trading up for Goff if the price is right. But I'm good with Lynch at #15.

 

[jrry32]

Bradford had a worse offense around him in 2010.

 

[-X-]

Not quite. I'm still in favor of trading up for Goff if the price is right. But I'm good with Lynch at #15.

I'd be fine with that too. The Goff part, that is.

 

[DR RAM]

Without taking the easy way out (BPA, Both), I'm going with receiver first and QB second. If you're able to shut down our receivers with single coverage, that allows the defense to allocate more resources to stopping the run and/or rushing the passer. If you have to double or roll coverage to a dominant receiver, then that's one extra guy off the line. And sometimes one extra guy off the line is sufficient enough to sustain blocks. And if a defense decides they need to commit more defenders to getting after the run or getting after the QB, and they leave a guy like A.J. Green alone, then that's a jump ball 100% of the time. And any QB can throw a jump ball.

Can we throw a jump ball to Britt or Austin? Maybe Quick, but I don't get the warm and fuzzies about his aggressiveness in those situations.

I think that in current FA, and draft possibilities, that Josh Doctson would be a the receiver that I would target, even if in a trade down. He's my guy, right now. That being said, if Goff, or Wentz were available, I don't think they will be, I'd take them.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Love 'em both. Not sold on either though. Freaking Rams should have listened to me in 2010. We'd have had a bridge QB, Cleveland's entire draft, and Dez Bryant. Once it became clear that we weren't dealing our pick, I was 100% in on Bradford. Now he's an Eagle and Dez is still where he started.

Interesting to think about what could have been. But when you don't have a franchise Qb and you have a chance to get one.......you take the chance and risk along with it.

Remember two very possible factors in their thinking. They may feel that Treadwell is the safer pick in terms of his likely probability of success vs a QB. That's huge, imo. And they may also have their eye on another QB that they really consider a good fit and that they feel will be there in the 2nd round for them.

Treadwell very well could make Keenum's job easier and make the offense a little more potent, but he doesn't change Keenum into a better player. He is still Case Keenum, just with a better weapon. To me that does not solve anything.

 

[-X-]

Interesting to think about what could have been. But when you don't have a franchise Qb and you have a chance to get one.......you take the chance and risk along with it.

Yeah, and that's why I understood (and supported) the decision.

Treadwell very well could make Keenum's job easier and make the offense a little more potent, but he doesn't change Keenum into a better player. He is still Case Keenum, just with a better weapon. To me that does not solve anything.

Well if he makes the offense more potent, then he makes Keenum better by extension. Whereas if we get Lynch, and he's slow to pick up the offense and/or struggles mightily right away, then that doesn't solve anything either. It's a 50/50 risk with both scenarios, imo.

 

[RamFan503]

Bradford had a worse offense around him in 2010.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Yeah, and that's why I understood (and supported) the decision.


Well if he makes the offense more potent, then he makes Keenum better by extension. Whereas if we get Lynch, and he's slow to pick up the offense and/or struggles mightily right away, then that doesn't solve anything either. It's a 50/50 risk with both scenarios, imo.

My earlier post didn't get much play, but I reiterate that if you look at it from a business stand point, then the teams (Kroenke/Demoff/GM/Coaches) focus is probably on a date closer to the stadium opening. Stan may be giving them the old.........I expect a winner by 2019, what happens before that does not concern me, speech. Which buys them time to bring along a guy like Lynch.

The 49ers stadium opened and then they lost/jettisoned Harbaugh and the team was clearly on the slide. How much better would that have been to have all cylinders hitting at the same time?

I think Fisher and Snead have the length of their contracts to get it figured out, so unfortunately forcing a trade to #1 or #s4-5 may not be in the cards.

As fans we look at every season as win now. I don't think an owner does, especially if his team just increased in value 3 fold.

 

[-X-]

My earlier post didn't get much play, but I reiterate that if you look at it from a business stand point, then the teams (Kroenke/Demoff/GM/Coaches) focus is probably on a date closer to the stadium opening. Stan may be giving them the old.........I expect a winner by 2019, what happens before that does not concern me, speech. Which buys them time to bring along a guy like Lynch.

The 49ers stadium opened and then they lost/jettisoned Harbaugh and the team was clearly on the slide. How much better would that have been to have all cylinders hitting at the same time?

I think Fisher and Snead have the length of their contracts to get it figured out, so unfortunately forcing a trade to #1 or #s4-5 may not be in the cards.

As fans we look at every season as win now. I don't think an owner does, especially if his team just increased in value 3 fold.

Anything's possible.

 

[Corbin]

I love it when people make mistakes in chess.

So I guess we've boiled this discussion down to the Rams staying at 15 and being presented with the option of Treadwell or Lynch. I don't think there's a right or wrong answer to that selection, and here's why. Snead and his scouting department have already scouted both and Fisher/Staff have a handle on which would provide more of a boost to the offense. I know where you stand, and you know where I stand. Now we need to figure out where they stand.

Although I'm in love with treadwell I see no way in hell we'd take treadwell over lynch. The fact of us making QB moves recently suggests they know it's a position of need still and I'm sure all parties involved aren't happy with the current production at that position.

No way bro! A rookie and heathy Sam would of put up nasty numbers with the 2016 roster!

Not quite. I'm still in favor of trading up for Goff if the price is right. But I'm good with Lynch at #15.

I honestly don't see us trading up for Goff but I do see us trading up for either Lynch or Wentz though. And this has me self debating.... How do either one of those two compare to Mannion? Will Mannion be ahead for sitting a year and preparing or will natural talent and a fast learner win out for 2016?