Should we build O-line and WR corps around Keenum?

[TexasRam]

It's asinine in my humble opinion to evaluate a QB behind this Oline and with the WR cast.

Build the Oline and get some WR's.

 

[jrry32]

It's asinine in my humble opinion to evaluate a QB behind this Oline and with the WR cast.

Build the Oline and get some WR's.

Asinine is blaming the WRs and OL for the QB's problems. You can evaluate each of them. None of the groups are playing up to par...but the worst of all three is the QB group. And that happens to be the most important position on the field, bar none.

Here are some incredible stats for you...this is where the Rams rank in each passing category as a team:
Attempts - 29th
Completions - 32nd
Completion % - 32nd
Passing Yards - 32nd
Yards Per Attempt - 32nd
Passing TDs - 32nd
Interceptions - 17th
Passer Rating - 32nd
Fewest Sacks Allowed - 1st

Now, don't take this as an endorsement of the OL. The biggest reasons why we have the fewest sacks allowed are our lower number of attempts and the QBs getting the ball out quickly. The OL isn't playing well.

But the OL isn't BY FAR the worst in the league. Our QBs are. In fact, our OL when relatively healthy (i.e. when it was only missing Saffold) has actually done a solid job of run blocking. What have our QBs done a solid job of?

The WRs/TEs and OL need work. But they're a lot closer to respectable than our terrible QBs. I'll state again...WORST IN THE NFL.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

If the Rams don't have a shot at a better QB in the draft then they have to build up what they have. Oline/WR. They still could do better in Free Agency at the QB spot though. And if they are willing to swing a trade can move up for a top three QB.

Is this plan guaranteed to get the Rams a franchise QB? No, but it will get them a better QB short term and long term.

 

[NateDawg122]

I noticed you changed the subject quickly when I pointed out the inaccuracies.

Yep, I'm completely aware of that. I also watched both of those games. He played quite well against Michigan. And calling every other team he played "cupcakes" is pretty inaccurate. But that doesn't address the point that he's consistently stepped up in big games while at Michigan State. Nor does it give me much confidence that you've seen him play.

Have you watched and evaluated Cook? Because I'm more interested in reading analysis than stats that can be found on google in 10 seconds. Sorry if this comes off as brash or blunt but I'm interested in analysis. Not debating box score stats.



Each and every one is better than Keenum. Except possibly Mettenberger.



Every single one I listed is a better prospect than Mannion was.

How exactly did I change the subject? We were talking about QB prospects, you made a claim that Cook played his best in big games, I refuted that claim. He has a very poor completion ratio and it dips significantly when he plays quality opponents. And who, outside of Iowa and Michigan, is a good team that he's played this year? Name them.

Do you really want a guy like Kaepernick in the locker room? That's not a good idea. I would be extremely happy if we got Fitzpatrick. Brock Osweiler will also be a FA but he'll be a resigning priority for the Broncos and possibly even tagged for next year. I mentioned Mettenberger because I think he has some upside and the arm strength to push the ball down the field.

It is unlikely that any QB in the draft outside of Lynch and Goff would beat out Keenum/Mannion/Foles for next year. We should build up the line and WRs so when we can Draft our QB of the future we can put them in a solid situation.

Don't get me wrong, if Goff or Lynch falls to us I would snag them immediately. I just don't think that's going to happen as of now.

 

[Merlin]

We see it every draft, tbh... All of us have our favorites at QB, some of us don't like any of the QBs, and the Rams inevitably have more important things to draft than QB. But the bottom line is if you don't have a QB you should be drafting one every year until you get it right. The position is that important.

Nobody thought Carr was a first round pick. Raiders got him in round 2 and right now he would probably add more wins to this team this season than any other player taken that year. Are other players better? Sure. The guy the Raiders took that year, Mack, is better at his position in relation to the rest of the league. But Carr is the reason that team really has hope.

People called Aaron Rogers a "System QB." Ridiculous moniker too, that ensured a good team like the Packers could snap him up late first round. Same BS is being said about Goff, but largely because of Rogers and that comparison the kid will likely go 1 overall if not top 3 at the least. Bortles was raw coming out, and did not win right away, but the dude is starting to come into his own now and people are seeing the wisdom of taking a QB with his talent up high where they did. Lynch has a lot of similarities, with a bit of Kaepernick athleticism to go with it. Cook is maligned by many, but he's a guy where the more I watch him the more I like what he brings to a team. He's got some similarities to Eli Manning, unquestioned talent, and is going to start in this league.

This is a good draft to take a QB. There are good, legitimate options up high at the top, and some intriguing guys with legit talent that should go rounds 2-3. IMO we are not in a position to turn our nose up at the position as if none of these guys are good enough for us. We need one, and this org better get it right this time around. IMO.

 

[jrry32]

How exactly did I change the subject? We were talking about QB prospects, you made a claim that Cook played his best in big games, I refuted that claim. He has a very poor completion ratio and it dips significantly when he plays quality opponents. And who, outside of Iowa and Michigan, is a good team that he's played this year? Name them.

No, you didn't refute that claim. You made another erroneous claim. And didn't address the fact that you earlier erroneously claimed that he played in a spread offense.

If you watched the Michigan game, you know he played well. Not to mention these four big games:
http://espn.go.com/college-football/boxscore?gameId=333410127
http://espn.go.com/college-football/boxscore?gameId=340010127
http://espn.go.com/college-football/boxscore?gameId=400547958
http://espn.go.com/college-football/boxscore?gameId=400610179

So the only game you can really point to is the Iowa game...and it's kind of hard to ignore the fact that Cook was playing through an injury to his throwing shoulder.

Well, Michigan State did play and beat an Oregon team currently ranked 15th earlier this year.

But there's also a difference between good teams and cupcakes. Mediocre Big 10 teams aren't cupcakes. Cupcakes are teams like FAU or UTEP or SMU. Teams like Rutgers and Nebraska aren't cupcakes.

But again, have you actually watched and evaluated Cook? You never answered that question.

You keep talking about completion % but you're not actually offering any analysis. And based on your claims that he played in a spread offense, it would lead me to believe that you haven't seen him play. And frankly, if you haven't sat down and really evaluated a QB, you don't know enough about him to be calling him incredibly overrated.

Do you really want a guy like Kaepernick in the locker room? That's not a good idea. I would be extremely happy if we got Fitzpatrick. Brock Osweiler will also be a FA but he'll be a resigning priority for the Broncos and possibly even tagged for next year. I mentioned Mettenberger because I think he has some upside and the arm strength to push the ball down the field.

Yes. I am fine with Kaepernick being in the locker-room.

It is unlikely that any QB in the draft outside of Lynch and Goff would beat out Keenum/Mannion/Foles for next year. We should build up the line and WRs so when we can Draft our QB of the future we can put them in a solid situation.

Don't get me wrong, if Goff or Lynch falls to us I would snag them immediately. I just don't think that's going to happen as of now.

You need to take some time and watch the other QBs in the draft if you think none of them outside of those two could beat out Keenum and Foles. Keenum and Foles have set an incredibly low bar this year.

 

[JonRam99]

You're gonna make me cry on a Monday??? don't ever post an "UP" gif again!!!!

 

[MountainRam]

No QB will solve the Rams perennial 7-9 record problem. It's a philosophical problem. I see some Martz in Fisher. One is known for offense and other for defense. Each so arrogant in their own ways to prove their system works is the commonality. Both have egos the size of Rockies. Neither is a bad person.

Just like martz, Fisher will admit some mistakes 10 years from now. As Rams fans it will be too late for us. By then, I hope we will not be yearning at Fisher's era.

 

[NateDawg122]

No, you didn't refute that claim. You made another erroneous claim. And didn't address the fact that you earlier erroneously claimed that he played in a spread offense.

If you watched the Michigan game, you know he played well. Not to mention these four big games:
http://espn.go.com/college-football/boxscore?gameId=333410127
http://espn.go.com/college-football/boxscore?gameId=340010127
http://espn.go.com/college-football/boxscore?gameId=400547958
http://espn.go.com/college-football/boxscore?gameId=400610179

So the only game you can really point to is the Iowa game...and it's kind of hard to ignore the fact that Cook was playing through an injury to his throwing shoulder.

Well, Michigan State did play and beat an Oregon team currently ranked 15th earlier this year.

But there's also a difference between good teams and cupcakes. Mediocre Big 10 teams aren't cupcakes. Cupcakes are teams like FAU or UTEP or SMU. Teams like Rutgers and Nebraska aren't cupcakes.

But again, have you actually watched and evaluated Cook? You never answered that question.

You keep talking about completion % but you're not actually offering any analysis. And based on your claims that he played in a spread offense, it would lead me to believe that you haven't seen him play. And frankly, if you haven't sat down and really evaluated a QB, you don't know enough about him to be calling him incredibly overrated.



Yes. I am fine with Kaepernick being in the locker-room.



You need to take some time and watch the other QBs in the draft if you think none of them outside of those two could beat out Keenum and Foles. Keenum and Foles have set an incredibly low bar this year.

Fine, you want analysis? Here it goes:

First off, it was my mistake when I mentioned him playing in a spread system. I have no clue why but I was thinking of Baylor instead of Michigan State. Now on to the analysis:
Positives:
1) He has great arm strength and size.
2) He shows good mechanics when he has a clean pocket and time to throw.

Negatives:
1) When on the move he tends to display poor mechanics and use only his arm to get the ball out. It's almost like he tries to imitate Stafford in this respect but Stafford keeps better form and has a much stronger arm.
2) He tends to panic when he doesn't have a clean pocket. This is where his mechanics falter and he will sometimes throw into traffic.
3) It's been reported that he has an abrasive personality. Look at the way he disrespected Achie Griffin after the Big Ten championship. I think there is a reason he has never been voted team captain in his 4 years there.

As for his competition, they are not good teams in my eyes. Oregon is not what they once were and their defense has never been impressive. Rutgers is NOT a good team and neither is Nebraska. Mark my words, he will struggle mightily against Alabama in the playoffs. He will not have the clean protection he has had all year and his mechanics will get worse and worse as the game goes on.

 

[ChrisW]

Allow me Den.

 

[JonRam99]

Sorry.... BPA. The Rams had no business taking Donald in 2014... turned out pretty well, eh? We also had no business taking Gurley this year either. ditto. Both are generational talents that you just don't pass on, regardless of needs. You make the team fit your best players, and that's what Snisher committed to; I think our new OL studs they drafted after taking Gurley (Brown, Haven, Wichmann, even Battle) are going to be plowing gaping holes for TG2 by 9/2016. HOPEFULLY, they'll wind up being pretty good at pass pro.

So, if a BPA QB happens to fall within reach, I'd rather take him than reach for an LT / WR who doesn't have the talent to match the draft position. But OTOH, if the BPA is an absolute stud WR or OL or even a DE (gasp), we take him & build the team around them & try to develop Mannion or get a decent F/A QB. I'm hoping one of Goff, Lynch or Cook falls in our range, but if they don't, or if they just simply aren't the best players to be taken with our 1st, then just go BPA.

 

[BriansRams]

I know a lot of people are talking about taking a QB with the 1st pick and I'm considering it myself. However, I honestly don't see any franchise QB worth taking outside of MAYBE Paxton Lynch. He and Goff should be long gone by the time the Rams pick and I don't think much of Connor Cook.

Now that I've seen more of him I do wonder how good Keenum can be if he has a stronger O-line and a better WR corps. He will never be an elite QB and is not a long-term solution but maybe he can be a solid game manager. I'm thinking we should take Treadwell in the 1st and take some linemen in later rounds to build depth ( I REALLY wish they had taken a chance on La'el Collins in the 7th Round last year). I also think we should pick up 1 or 2 veteran linemen in free agency, specifically Wisniewski at Center. Brown, Havenstein, and Wichman can all be solid especially with an off-season of training.

So those are my thoughts about the Ram's current Draft situation. What do y'all think?

Hmmmm. I vehemently agree with you that we should have rolled the dice and grabbed La'el Collins last draft. That was a huge mistake not to. (and by "roll the dice" i mean take a chance that he refused to play for us)
Regarding Keenum. I like him. He's better than Foles. I think with a better OL and a WR he could get us into the playoffs, but I don't think he'd get us through the playoffs.

 

[jrry32]

Fine, you want analysis? Here it goes:

First off, it was my mistake when I mentioned him playing in a spread system. I have no clue why but I was thinking of Baylor instead of Michigan State. Now on to the analysis:
Positives:
1) He has great arm strength and size.
2) He shows good mechanics when he has a clean pocket and time to throw.

Negatives:
1) When on the move he tends to display poor mechanics and use only his arm to get the ball out. It's almost like he tries to imitate Stafford in this respect but Stafford keeps better form and has a much stronger arm.
2) He tends to panic when he doesn't have a clean pocket. This is where his mechanics falter and he will sometimes throw into traffic.
3) It's been reported that he has an abrasive personality. Look at the way he disrespected Achie Griffin after the Big Ten championship. I think there is a reason he has never been voted team captain in his 4 years there.

As for his competition, they are not good teams in my eyes. Oregon is not what they once were and their defense has never been impressive. Rutgers is NOT a good team and neither is Nebraska. Mark my words, he will struggle mightily against Alabama in the playoffs. He will not have the clean protection he has had all year and his mechanics will get worse and worse as the game goes on.

Yep. I'd rather read this. Don't agree fully but this is a lot more useful for me.

As for him struggling with Alabama, we'll see. Depends on his health. He delivered great performances in 2013 and 2014 in their bowl games against top teams.