One has to ask the question.... Westbrooks?

[Alan]

Thordaddy looking at it without an agenda to push:
Hell Al the whole draft boils down to opinion

For sure. As I said in my first post, the question made no sense to me.

 

[jjab360]

Hell Al the whole draft boils down to opinion ,that's why there are so many busts, I agree it's opinion on all our parts EVEN that Westbrooks is better,but it's unquestionable he's more versatile just because his beam is wider.

A lot of people were of the opinion RG was going to be a world beater,Manzeil too, Ryan Leif, but from the way they outbid the Cowboys I get the drift they were pretty high on Westbrooks and took a chance not drafting him and did draft Sam, partially for reasons I've stated and I'm glad they did for our team, but from the beginning I've thought it was a move that might not have been in Sam's best interest because he was destined for bubble status due to our depth

But this raises the question of why the Cowboys didn't draft Ethan Westbrooks over late round picks Ken Bishop or Terrance Mitchell? If teams really thought he was the better prospect, how come he wasn't drafted and Sam was? Is it because he was the first openly face tattooed player to ever enter the draft? Is there actually more than one conspiracy brewing here? :eek:

 

[jjab360]

I firmly believe they drafted Sam as a favor to the league for sure, and maybe to silent Stan as well.

The confusing thing to me is why with so many late picks, that they did NOT draft Westbrooks.

The confusing thing to me is why does it matter?

 

[Ramatik]

Here is my theory. Michael Sam had a draft able grade. The Rams really liked him. I feel the Rams may have had Westbrooks higher. Fisher did not want the NFL to look bad. He knew the media blow back would be harsh, and since they liked Sam and had a draft able grade on him, they picked him.

Sam hasn't disappointed, Westbrooks is just better. I think we keep both.

The guy with the face tattoo has been a pleasant surprise.

And it is completely ridiculous to not think that there was more going on then just a regular old draft board talk with the pick of Sam.

 

[Ramatik]

? Is it because he was the first openly face tattooed player to ever enter the draft? Is there actually more than one conspiracy brewing here? :eek:

That is your opinion! :fighting:

I don't know why people are prejudiced against the tattoo-faced.

 

[-X-]

I firmly believe they drafted Sam as a favor to the league for sure, and maybe to silent Stan as well.

The confusing thing to me is why with so many late picks, that they did NOT draft Westbrooks.

I don't think that was the case. It was reported that in the War Room Fisher said, "Guess what I'm gonna do? Whatever the fuck I want." right before they picked Sam. One could also make the case (since we're speculating) that he was pressured to NOT draft Sam, but did anyway. And I don't find it confusing that they didn't draft Westbrooks and instead signed him as a UDFA. If he was so highly coveted, then why did he go undrafted? He was simply another guy this team scouted and knew would be available after the draft. Nobody, including you, knew for sure he would be good enough to make the 53.

 

[LesBaker]

I firmly believe they drafted Sam as a favor to the league for sure, and maybe to silent Stan as well.

The confusing thing to me is why with so many late picks, that they did NOT draft Westbrooks.

You would.

 

[lockdnram21]

Because they Had Sam ranked a lot higher and were weary of Westbrooks because of competition

 

[JackDRams]

because there are about 28 or so teams that Sims could start for......easily.

Dont get me wrong, I love Sims, but this statement is a huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge reach. Sims could start for maybe a handful of teams. In a worst case scenario. He's a perfect rotational depth guy. But I would be a little concerned starting him. I would like to see if he could handle that, just not as a Ram. So if Sam does take his spot in the future, I'll be keeping a close on on Sims. Just like with George Selvie. Maybe they can start together with the Cowboys haha.

 

[LesBaker]

Dont get me wrong, I love Sims, but this statement is a huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge reach. Sims could start for maybe a handful of teams. In a worst case scenario. He's a perfect rotational depth guy. But I would be a little concerned starting him. I would like to see if he could handle that, just not as a Ram. So if Sam does take his spot in the future, I'll be keeping a close on on Sims. Just like with George Selvie. Maybe they can start together with the Cowboys haha.

Thats fair I think, he'd find a job but he wouldn't have two dozen teams calling his agent.

The Cowboys and Packers would for sure be calling LOL.

 

[shaunpinney]

The draft is a black art in itself, you win some and you lose some, personally, I don't think we'd be having this discussion if Sam hadn't disclosed his sexuality pre-draft, because he would have been just another DE - both guys have talent, Westbrooks has made the most of his situation recently, however, there does seem to be questions about his motor, below is excerpts from their draft profiles...

Westbrooks
Talented, enigmatic Division II edge rusher who marches to the beat of his own drum, but has intriguing, raw, natural ability to harass quarterbacks. Motor runs hot and cold (disappears for stretches). Does not consistently dig in vs. the run. Wild-card prospect with diamond-in-the-rough characteristics if a defensive line coach is able to refine the technical aspects of his game and stoke his fire. Accumulated nearly 30 penalties in two seasons at WTAMU, including 15 offsides flags.

Sam
A productive, 4-3 weakside rusher who came on as a senior and it made his last season his best. Could fit most ideally as a 3-4 outside linebacker in a zone-blitzing scheme like the Steelers or Ravens. Plays hard -- gives great effort and competes every down. Good on-field intensity and demeanor. Attacks the edges aggressively and motor runs hot. Outstanding weight-room strength -- can squat a small house. Very durable.

Here's the big question in my mind, is there room to keep them both??

 

[DCH]

I firmly believe they drafted Sam as a favor to the league for sure, and maybe to silent Stan as well.

The confusing thing to me is why with so many late picks, that they did NOT draft Westbrooks.

So, despite the fact that we ended up with both Michael Sam and Ethan Westbrooks, you're concerned over the order in which we took them? Seems... kinda silly.

 

[bluecoconuts]

As to why Sam over Westbrooks, Westbrooks has WAY more red flags than Sam does. The penalties, issues he's had, all that stuff can really hurt a team.

If he's past all that (but the penalties could be an issue) then we likely have a steal. If he's not though..... it could be really damaging. Imagine week 17 it's 3rd down on the 50 and we're holding onto a narrow 2 point lead for a playoff spot during and a defensive slugfest. Westbrooks, who again has had these issues, ends up going Incognito on us, jumps offsides and gives the Hawks a first down.

Now imagine the same situation, or maybe it's 3rd and long since Sam is likely more to be used in obvious passing downs if he makes the team, and Sam gets washed out of a play because of his size. Maybe the Hawks convert for a first down there too.

Does that mean we need to dump Westbrooks? Of course not, but the coaching staff would be foolish not to factor in their college tendencies if (and I stress if) the battle for the last spot is that close. And depending on different things they could determine they would rather risk Westbrooks jumping offsides over Sam being smaller, or vice versa.

I think the competition is very close, I also think right now Westbrooks has the edge if it does come down to them. However I think the Rams are going to factor in every little thing when it comes down to trimming the roster, and the intangibles may sway them towards who they keep or not. However they drafted Sam over Westbrooks for a reason, and whatever that reason is, it's bound to have an impact during the roster cuts.

I guess what I'm saying is don't get too attached to any late round/UDFA during this time, who knows. Maybe they keep one, maybe the other, maybe both, hell maybe neither. Whatever happens I wouldn't get too worked up over it, because they did it for a reason. Next year there will be a shiny new toy for everyone to talk about.

 

[LACHAMP46]

Your whole premise makes no senses to me. Why does one have to ask the question? Because Sam is gay? Because we might have lucked into a good player in Westbrooks?

Sam was the SEC Co-defensive player of the year and Westbrooks was a player that nobody in the league wanted to draft. That's a tough decision to make isn't it? More importantly and more to your point, why did the Rams draft Van Dyk, Rhaney and Bryant instead of Westbrooks? Do you really think the Rams would have had to ante up a "LOT of $$" to sign any of those guys as UDFAs?

Sorry RFIP, but your question begs a different question, why did you pick Sam instead of one of the other players I mentioned? Because he also plays on the D-line? When you're that low in the draft you draft BPA don't you?

Not only is hindsight 20/20, but the Rams decision to draft Sam seems to have been a very good one as he has an good chance to make the final 53.. Can you say the same about any of the other 3 players I mentioned? Why did the Rams draft Rhaney instead of Bonds?

point well made, however Bond, I believe is of the 2013 class....Van Dyk & Rhaney were drafted? Really?

 

[Akrasian]

Anybody available at that point in the draft has question marks - generally very significant ones. Westbrooks was intriguing but had questions about competition, play against the run, and his motor. Sam was a tweener who had fallen further than his performance in college warranted because of an off field issue that Fisher was not concerned about. Neither were overly needed by the Rams, since DL is their deepest unit, by a large margin.

The Rams were spending most of their late round picks getting guys who might help weaker units - but Fisher decided with picks running out to take a guy who had fallen, who was more of a sure thing, and who also sends a message and makes the team look good. Then they can try to sign the other guy - who they don't actually need - as a UDFA.

So yes, the likely tie breaker was that Sam would be the first openly gay player drafted - and forevermore the Rams would be associated with that. But it was NOT the case that Westbrooks was a sure or even likely stud.

Oh, and it's not at all clear how well Westbrooks will keep on playing. One of the question marks is his motor - just because when his career is on the line he has played hard that does not mean that he will always play hard if he is confident of having a job. That question has yet to be answered - and one has to ask the question.

 

[LACHAMP46]

That is your opinion! :fighting:

I don't know why people are prejudiced against the tattoo-faced.

It's scary....

 

[ZigZagRam]

Much less impressive resume
Level of competition
On field discipline concerns
Character concerns

Seems pretty damn obvious to me.

 

[Thordaddy]

The confusing thing to me is why does it matter?

I guess that's a question you need to answer for yourself ,why does it matter someone has a different view from your's such that you bring all these motives, characterizations and even political affiliations into it, it's just a bunch of guys spitballin.

Why did we draft Sam, cuz we wanted to,why we wanted to is

Much less impressive resume
Level of competition
On field discipline concerns
Character concerns

Seems pretty damn obvious to me.

Length of contract maybe