One has to ask the question.... Westbrooks?

[Ramathon]

Mac,I don't doubt any of your analysis there of what you saw on film,in fact I honor your work, I haven't forgotten you insistence on Alshon Jeffrey and how so many of us whiffed on him (including our Rams)but I still have a very tough time accepting the idea that Sam is near third round talent . His combine numbers weren't that lofty first of all.and second but even more important to me ,the implication as to why he fell.

You make a primafacia case for the entire league to be homophobic as well as many tallent evaluators and I have trouble leveling those kind of charges against anyone until I know it to be the case,charges of racist ,homophobe,sexist are so serious in my mind and get thrown out just to gain sway in argument in such a cavalier way ,once that bell gets rung you can't unring it and IMO are more hurtful to the target than any epithet because of course thinking people know the epithet really reflects upon the issuer and doesn't REALLY diminish the target . Once labeled that way where do you go to get your reputation back ? We must consider the humanity of all parties here before we give in to our own prejudices.,NOT BTW saying you are giving in .

I think Mike Sam was drafted about where his abilities dictated , his quickness is good but the bulk of you analysis was against far inferior competition to what he will face in the NFL and although he shined against that competition he's just a little small and not the freak athlete a guy that size has to be to be productive at this level the way a third round talent can and often has been.

It is my experience that in matters of sexual orientation attitudes are polarized towards over reaction in both directions ,people tend to have near militant attitudes in reaction to the polar opposite and rare is the unbiased opinion of one another,I won't let myself believe this whole league was afraid to draft that kid for the talent he possesses ,I can't write that many people off ,I have to examine anyone on a case by case basis before I make those kinds of judgement ,I just do.

Maybe I'm naive , but I have to believe in the good in everyone first until they prove me wrong.

I don't think it's hard to believe that Sam's 'coming out' impacted his draft position. And it doesn't require everyone in the league to be homophobic for it to occur. And certainly not a conspiracy to push him down in the draft. All it takes is at least one person with 'juice' on each team to have a Dungy-esque "I don't want the distraction" mentality for it to occur.

Remember, this is the league that hem-hawed f-o-r-e-v-e-r about blacks as starting QB's before it finally happened.

It's also the league that had to institute the Rooney Rule to insure minority coaches were at least given an opportunity to be in the discussion for head coaching vacancies.

In neither of those cases would I say the entire league and everyone in it was rascist. But there certainly was enough of a herd mentality, or an 'old boys club' mentality, to impede qualified candidates for a long time.

So, I don't find it the least bit difficult to believe Sam's draft status was impacted by his announcement. I don't know that it occurred, but it wouldn't surprise me in the least.

 

[AnarchyRam]

Just why did the Rams draft Michael Sam and NOT Westbrooks?

I would LOVE to hear the "real" answer to that one though we know we'll never get it.

I mean they offer Westbrooks a LOT of $$ as far as UDFA's go, and he certainly looks the part.

So WHY didn't they draft him instead of Sam?

Maybe cuzz Sam was SEC DPOY? Looking at Sam play, he should have been a 3rd to 5th rounder. He's got like 2.5 sacks in these 3 games.

 

[junkman]

Not to derail this conversation, but Westbrooks saw a ton of 1st quarter action in yesterday's game, waaay before Rams players started dropping like flies. Even with Sam's two sacks (the 2nd was really a team sack imho), Westbrooks is clearly ahead of Sam on the depth chart. Anyone notice when Sam came into the game?

 

[CoachO]

Not to derail this conversation, but Westbrooks saw a ton of 1st quarter action in yesterday's game, waaay before Rams players started dropping like flies. Even with Sam's two sacks (the 2nd was really a team sack imho), Westbrooks is clearly ahead of Sam on the depth chart. Anyone notice when Sam came into the game?

Can't PFF can tell us exactly when he came into the game!!!

 

[AnarchyRam]

Not to derail this conversation, but Westbrooks saw a ton of 1st quarter action in yesterday's game, waaay before Rams players started dropping like flies. Even with Sam's two sacks (the 2nd was really a team sack imho), Westbrooks is clearly ahead of Sam on the depth chart. Anyone notice when Sam came into the game?

Sam came in on, I think manziels second drive.

 

[Memphis Ram]

Not to derail this conversation, but Westbrooks saw a ton of 1st quarter action in yesterday's game, waaay before Rams players started dropping like flies. Even with Sam's two sacks (the 2nd was really a team sack imho), Westbrooks is clearly ahead of Sam on the depth chart. Anyone notice when Sam came into the game?

Westbrooks seems to be playing the William Hayes role on this defense.

 

[junkman]

Can't PFF can tell us exactly when he came into the game!!!

Lol. I know you're just playing with me (hence the blue font). PFF (at least at my level) doesn't say when he played, but it can say how many snaps he got. PFF stats on the game haven't been posted yet.

 

[junkman]

Westbrooks seems to be playing the William Hayes role on this defense.

It might just be me, but Westbrooks looks like an NFL player now, even when he's playing against the #1s. Surely not a finished product, but not intimidated out there either.

Same thing with Alex Bayer (even though he lost his block on that one run, Faulk called him out on it).

 

[Mackeyser]

I want to confront an issue without confronting posters. As fans, we see that the Rams CAN carry from 8 to as many as 10 DEs, so we see the numbers and see the simple, linear competition as Ethan Westbrooks versus Michael Sam.

However, I would disagree that this is the case and even go so far as to say that Fisher, without committing to anything, is dropping hints that this is not so.

These two players, as noted several times, do NOT play the same reserve role. Ethan Westbrooks is along the lines of a William Hayes who bounces inside and out. Michael Sam is very similar to James Hall and would fill the role now filled by Eugene Sims who plays both DE positions.

Playing them against one another is an abstract exercise that I don't know has any anchor in reality. It may, but I honestly do not know if Fisher's D staff is looking at it that way. I mean, THEY KNOW about Michael Sam's weight and him being lighter than Westbrooks. Sam was initially HEAVIER than Westbrooks at the beginning of OTAs, but they asked him to lose weight to make him faster because to increase the chances to stick, he'd have to play STs. So, all of that is being taken into account.

BOTH are very good players. The Rams will have decisions to make and if one or both don't make it, there will be plenty of factors at play, but the "competition" between Westbrooks and Sam will likely have had VERY LITTLE to do with anything.

Their production on the field, contribution to their units and flexibility they provide will be much more prominent factors.

I just think that pitting them against them one another both diminishes them and forces fans to take sides and to discount to some degree the accomplishments of one of these young men in order to advocate for the other.

I'd rather just celebrate them both and trust this coaching staff. I really don't envy them this roster decision and not just with respect to DL.