Fitting Tavon into the run heavy offense

[CoachO]

I don't read too much into what the Rams are doing except having flexibility offensively. Too think because they have Gurley means they go strickly to a power running game is basically jumping the gun.

Fisher is a "ball control" guy...but he also knows this is a passing league. The Rams are being built to be able to do both.

They are NOT specifically going to be a "power running" team.

While I agree with the premise that should and will be able to throw the ball, I believe Fisher wants to duplicate the type of offense that Seattle has been so successful with.

While Seattle has a very effective passing game, they have had the least amount of passing attempts in the league since Wilson took the reigns.

I think Fisher and Cignetti will take their shots, but the running game will be first and foremost the foundation that everything works through.

 

[BuffaloRam]

While I agree with the premise that should and will be able to throw the ball, I believe Fisher wants to duplicate the type of offense that Seattle has been so successful with.

While Seattle has a very effective passing game, they have had the least amount of passing attempts in the league since Wilson took the reigns.

I think Fisher and Cignetti will take their shots, but the running game will be first and foremost the foundation that everything works through.

Coach. Do you feel that Foles can effectively run an Offense like this - his resumé shows promise, albeit in fundamentally different scheme.

 

[theramsruleUK]

Would you trade him for a 1st? As much as I love Tavon, this division is totally wrong for him.
I'd think hard about it tbh, take a future first founder for him as I dont think we'll be signing him to a 2nd deal. Honestly I'd rather have stedman in the slot than tavon

 

[LesBaker]

This isn't a run heavy offense. It wasn't a run heavy offense with 2nd and 3rd string QB's last year.

Fisher isn't some blind stone age relic of a coach.

This whole "power run and throw sometimes" thing is entirely inaccurate and I wish it would go away LOL. Fisher has had to deal with shitty QB situations for a lot of years and in some cases took the ball out of the less than stellar QB's he had to work with.

But it isn't like he has limited the Rams passing game to running more than passing, in fact FAR from it even with backups.

This power running thing will finally drop dead with Foles. I'm sure of that.

 

[OC_Ram]

I don't read too much into what the Rams are doing except having flexibility offensively. Too think because they have Gurley means they go strickly to a power running game is basically jumping the gun.

Fisher is a "ball control" guy...but he also knows this is a passing league. The Rams are being built to be able to do both.

They are NOT specifically going to be a "power running" team.

Exactly, think Dallas with Emmitt Smith. Aikman would sling the ball for the most part of 3 quarters. By the 4th they had a cozy lead and ran EMMITT, EMMITT, EMMITT.

 

[…..]

This topic continues to baffle me.

How they are able to utilize Tavon Austin has more to do with Tavon Austin, than it does with the scheme or design of the offense.

He is entering his 3rd year, and this far he has been unable to find a way to be a factor in the passing game. People seem to think that by somehow "designing special plays" for him they should be able to "use him properly". But more than any play design, its more about how HE understands how to attack defenses, and become more of a factor within the system. People are quick to point the finger at Schottenheimer. But its not by accident that he had more carries, than receptions last year. He just hasn't shown he understands how to get open as a receiver. And that is with 4 different QBs. It cannot all be about the OC or QB. At some point, maybe we say its the receiver.

The problem, and this has been discussed numerous times before, is that thus far, Austin isn't capable of being a difference maker when teams play zone against this offense. In his only real breakout game, Indianopolis inexcusably played straight man to man all day vs. Rams, and both Austin and Givens had huge days on crossing routes. The problem is, MOST teams don't do this against the Rams. So to simply say that he will be able to beat single coverage, IMO, is not looking at the big picture here.

The thought process to drafting him, IMO, was that he was going to be a quicker, faster "Danny Amendola" type. But that hasn't been the case. I have watched them try to run him on the option routes (arrow routes) and crossing routes in training camp, and he just isn't very good at it. And when forced to settle into the soft spots of the zone coverage, and being forced to virtually come to a complete stop, Austin loses his advantage. In the open field, or catching the ball on the move he is as dangerous as any receiver in the game. But he just doesn't have the stop and start quickness they envisioned.

Until Austin himself, shows he can figure it out, I just don't see why so many think they should design the offense around getting him the ball. He will have his role in the offense, but not like many seem to hope he will. I would venture to say, he will again be about the 4th or 5th best option on most days.

Thank you.

If we want to see alot of Tavon Austin, we need to force alot of punts.

 

[rams56]

This topic continues to baffle me.

How they are able to utilize Tavon Austin has more to do with Tavon Austin, than it does with the scheme or design of the offense.

He is entering his 3rd year, and this far he has been unable to find a way to be a factor in the passing game. People seem to think that by somehow "designing special plays" for him they should be able to "use him properly". But more than any play design, its more about how HE understands how to attack defenses, and become more of a factor within the system. People are quick to point the finger at Schottenheimer. But its not by accident that he had more carries, than receptions last year. He just hasn't shown he understands how to get open as a receiver. And that is with 4 different QBs. It cannot all be about the OC or QB. At some point, maybe we say its the receiver.

The problem, and this has been discussed numerous times before, is that thus far, Austin isn't capable of being a difference maker when teams play zone against this offense. In his only real breakout game, Indianopolis inexcusably played straight man to man all day vs. Rams, and both Austin and Givens had huge days on crossing routes. The problem is, MOST teams don't do this against the Rams. So to simply say that he will be able to beat single coverage, IMO, is not looking at the big picture here.

The thought process to drafting him, IMO, was that he was going to be a quicker, faster "Danny Amendola" type. But that hasn't been the case. I have watched them try to run him on the option routes (arrow routes) and crossing routes in training camp, and he just isn't very good at it. And when forced to settle into the soft spots of the zone coverage, and being forced to virtually come to a complete stop, Austin loses his advantage. In the open field, or catching the ball on the move he is as dangerous as any receiver in the game. But he just doesn't have the stop and start quickness they envisioned.

Until Austin himself, shows he can figure it out, I just don't see why so many think they should design the offense around getting him the ball. He will have his role in the offense, but not like many seem to hope he will. I would venture to say, he will again be about the 4th or 5th best option on most days.

I respect your opinion coach....but in an interview with Fisher earlier this year he answered exactly that question.....to paraphrase. ...he said he was happy with Tavons progress as a wr.....and he expected him to be used more vertically this year than in the past....and he expected his numbers to go up......so in way isn't that saying that he can be put in a better position to succeed? I'm sorry I'm not sure where I ran across this interview. ...I'll try to find it. But what do you think?

Go Rams.........

 

[rams56]

Here it is CoachO. ....
Watch "Jeff Fisher on Tavon Austin's role in 2015" on YouTube

View: https://youtu.be/0i9sAUrnKfw

 

[CoachO]

I respect your opinion coach....but in an interview with Fisher earlier this year he answered exactly that question.....to paraphrase. ...he said he was happy with Tavons progress as a wr.....and he expected him to be used more vertically this year than in the past....and he expected his numbers to go up......so in way isn't that saying that he can be put in a better position to succeed? I'm sorry I'm not sure where I ran across this interview. ...I'll try to find it. But what do you think?

Go Rams.........

Fisher says a lot of these things in the off season. While I am not totally discounting what he says, it doesn't always come to fruition.

He makes these sorts of comments for just about anybody he is asked about. But they still only have one football. So until it happens, I remain skeptical.

 

[lockdnram21]

Here it is CoachO. ....
Watch "Jeff Fisher on Tavon Austin's role in 2015" on YouTube

View: https://youtu.be/0i9sAUrnKfw

What u expect the coach to say? It's still up to Tavon. I think he's more of a RB then WR

 

[-X-]

How they are able to utilize Tavon Austin has more to do with Tavon Austin, than it does with the scheme or design of the offense.

That's really all there is to it.
If Tavon puts in the work and learns to run crisp, precise routes, then he'll get more involved.
If he relies on being a gadget player who thinks he can do anything once he gets the ball, then he won't.

 

[OC--LeftCoast]

@rams56
Yeah...but after that video ended you had a choice to click on 6 other videos, the Bradford one was priceless in fact it lead into the Tavon clip

Not sure you can take everything Fish sez at face value, dude has to adjust to how he's being defended real time, I haven't by any means giving up on him, but he does appear to be a slow learner.

 

[So Ram]

See "The Smurfs" of the 1980's with the Redskins power run scheme.

Also the Dolphins ---Mariano's early years.
Duper,

 

[So Ram]

See "The Smurfs" of the 1980's with the Redskins power run scheme.

Tavon & Bailey bring such a great energy to the Rams squad.Glad Kenny Britt resigned & Quick healthy.

 

[rams56]

Here is my take. Schottenheimer is gone for a reason. ... one of them is the misuse of TA. Another is the lack of an offensive identity. ....the power running attack that Fisher has wanted for a while.

First, as far as Tavon Austin is conserned he definitely has things to work on. But every player does in an attempt to reach they're full potential. But he was misused. ....I'm not talking about "SPECIAL PLAYS" I'm talking about making the defense defend TA while he runs a full route tree. He runs a sub 4.3 but anyone can defend him if his only routes are 5 yard crosses, 5 yard square outs and 8 yrd hook patterns along with tail back dives. He is capable of so much more. And it is the responsibility of his offensive coach and position coach to get the most out of his talent. Something tells me that if John Brown, TY Hilton, Percy Harvin and Antonio Brown for that matter were only limited to 3 to 4 routes they would much easier to defend...... where are the fly patterns. ..as a decoy or weapon? Where are the screen passes, wheel routes, flag routes, post patterns, reverses?

Secondly, Schottenheimer failed to produce a consistent if not dominant run game dispite the injuries to SB and the backup situation.

Now I know it can be argued that the oline has been undermanned the last couple of years also. But in most cases it is easier to find run blockers than pass blockers.....so that should have still led to a decent run game if committed.

Go Rams...........

 

[lockdnram21]

Here is my take. Schottenheimer is gone for a reason. ... one of them is the misuse of TA. Another is the lack of an offensive identity. ....the power running attack that Fisher has wanted for a while.

First, as far as Tavon Austin is conserned he definitely has things to work on. But every player does in an attempt to reach they're full potential. But he was misused. ....I'm not talking about "SPECIAL PLAYS" I'm talking about making the defense defend TA while he runs a full route tree. He runs a sub 4.3 but anyone can defend him if his only routes are 5 yard crosses, 5 yard square outs and 8 yrd hook patterns along with tail back dives. He is capable of so much more. And it is the responsibility of his offensive coach and position coach to get the most out of his talent. Something tells me that if John Brown, TY Hilton, Percy Harvin and Antonio Brown for that matter were only limited to 3 to 4 routes they would much easier to defend...... where are the fly patterns. ..as a decoy or weapon? Where are the screen passes, wheel routes, flag routes, post patterns, reverses?

Secondly, Schottenheimer failed to produce a consistent if not dominant run game dispite the injuries to SB and the backup situation.

Now I know it can be argued that the oline has been undermanned the last couple of years also. But in most cases it is easier to find run blockers than pass blockers.....so that should have still led to a decent run game if committed.

Go Rams...........

You are comparing players that he's nothing like. Those guys are decent to good route runners. Tavon is poor. Tavon is a Harvin clone. It's up to him it wasn't Schotty fault

 

[Loyal]

I'm expecting a Pro bowl season as a punt returner from TA. I have no expectations outside of that. Most disappointing player in the Fisher/Snead era so far. No blue font.

I don't know man.. Pead is the worst in my book..At least there have been some flashes with Austin....Pead has been 7 pounds of suck from day one.

 

[rams56]

You are comparing players that he's nothing like. Those guys are decent to good route runners. Tavon is poor. Tavon is a Harvin clone. It's up to him it wasn't Schotty fault

Ok. We will have to agree to disagree. ... I believe he is a good route runner...and I'll take Fishers word over yours.......

Go Rams........

 

[WvuIN02]

Ok. We will have to agree to disagree. ... I believe he is a good route runner...and I'll take Fishers word over yours.......

Go Rams........

....pretty much this.

If Fishers assessment isn't the same as the forum crowd, then they're just "being nice"...but of course they know better. Many of these are the same posters who already said Quick was a bust. The offense and QB situation here has been atrocious his entire career minus part of a season with SB healthy.

 

[-X-]

....pretty much this.

If Fishers assessment isn't the same as the forum crowd, then they're just "being nice"...but of course they know better. Many of these are the same posters who already said Quick was a bust. The offense and QB situation here has been atrocious his entire career minus part of a season with SB healthy.

I wouldn't presume to know which of the members here said Quick was a bust, and it's not really of much consequence if they did. People have different opinions and projections for different players, so I don't see how Quick maturing into a starter (maybe) after 3 years is going to be any indication of what Tavon can or cannot do.

Fisher isn't the only person who's weighed in on Tavon's route-running abilities though either. Lots of analysts who break down film have said he has some work to do in the areas of beating press, sharpening his routes, and recognizing coverages. Not the least of whom was Isaac Bruce. So now we have to determine how giving credence to Bruce's evaluation ties into my opinion of Quick too, I guess.

I will say this. Even IF Tavon doesn't become a bonafide #1 type of wideout, he's still plenty dangerous in the return game and in certain situations/positions. So it's not necessarily an insult if people think he still has a ways to go to be a well-rounded receiver. Even Tavon himself said he was completely lost in the playbook when he first started - and yet - he still managed to destroy a couple of defenses that underestimated his athleticism. So again, it's entirely up to him how far he can go. What's wrong with pointing that out? The same held true for Quick as well.