Dropped passes

[Warner4Prez]

AFROS gentlemen.
Britt wasn't bullshitting.

 

[Simba]

Imo showing some drops (past or present) it's not the fair thing.Every drop has got its story (momentum, frustation, score, wheater condition ...), but I can remember that Sam loves particularly throwing, too often, safes tracks in the middle of the field (especially with wr sholder to the post).It means hard punishment for receivers and when you "feel" the hit coming, changes something in your mind.You try to anticipate the move to avoid the shot and that's why the drop.It doesn't mean that is Bradford's fault.

 

[jjab360]

Imo showing some drops (past or present) it's not the fair thing.Every drop has got its story (momentum, frustation, score, wheater condition ...), but I can remember that Sam loves particularly throwing, too often, safes tracks in the middle of the field (especially with wr sholder to the post).It means hard punishment for receivers and when you "feel" the hit coming, changes something in your mind.You try to anticipate the move to avoid the shot and that's why the drop.It doesn't mean that is Bradford's fault.

Most of Sam's drops came from downfield passes, though.

 

[jrry32]

I think you may be underestimating but that's just my opinion.

The Cook drop was terrible I agree. That gets dropped maybe 1 in 500 plays and that was the wrong game to do it in!

I can only recall a couple drops from 2013 where Bradford seemed to throw it in there too hard. That's where my opinion comes from.

 

[UnknownREknown]

I'm only putting this out there because I've mentioned it before and IMO it is worth discussing as long as people keep it civil.

Bradford may be one of the reasons for the drops. He has a strong arm and does throw fastballs. Davis has excellent touch, at least so far.

What we may be seeing is the result of that. These guys have been catching footballs for many years, I doubt if they just learned how to do it correctly.

I was thinking this before even reading your post!

 

[RamWoodie]

If Stacy can get going the WRs become more lethal!!! That's what I'm hoping to see Sunday...Stacy taking HUGE chunks of yardage.

 

[AZRamsFan93]

Or maybe just maybe austin Davis has a more catchable ball and puts it in better places.

Everything else is the same and the QB changes yet that is not considered as the cause? I am not saying it is that simple but ignoring that fact is just bad science.

 

[tklongball]

None of that explains this crap:

View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=C4USiF-zG9A


Or this:

View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LfzEvzKResM


Or even this:


View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4LGX3plK-n4

The 2nd and 3rd videos are good throws. The second one is just a terrible whiff. But the ball placement on the 1st video makes that a much harder catch. Now I am not taking the blame off the receiver, they are paid very well to make tough catches. I am only saying that ball placement can make catches easier or harder. When the ball placement makes catches harder, a greater number of balls will be dropped, period.

The 1st video (Kendricks) is a very tough ball to catch in traffic. It is not back shoulder, as the commentator states, it is actually behind him and outside of his frame. That is a very difficult catch, and a low percentage opportunity.
The 2nd video (Alexander) is a perfectly thrown ball, and there is no blame to be put on the QB. That is perfect ball placement, an Alexander absolutely has to make that catch.
The 3rd video (Gibson) is a little harder to tell, as it appears that the ball is thrown a little too much to the outside, making it 'behind' the receiver. But, watching the slow motion instant replay, I am convinced that Gibson made a poor adjustment to the ball, which made it appear to be behind him. The longer the ball is in the air, the more time the receiver has to adjust to the throw, and Gibson just did a poor job on that play. This is another well thrown ball.

Everybody has their theories about the drops, but it happened at a higher rate with Bradford. Maybe it was inexperience of the receivers, maybe it was a higher percentage of 'catchable' balls being slightly off target, maybe it was a little too much heat on certain throws. My guess is that it was a combination of all of those, and probably other factors as well.

Now maybe this is absolutely off base, and I have no scientific data or video clips to back me up on this, but I always felt like Bradford would very often throw balls slightly off target. What I mean by that is that they were 'catchable' balls, statistically, but it seemed like the receivers always had to reach. Either slightly too high, or slightly behind them, a touch too low, etc. Again, not bad enough to be seen as uncatchable, but just off target enough that they were harder to catch, and like I said earlier, when catches are harder, more of them are dropped.

I have nothing against Bradford, and again, I could be way off the mark here. It is just an observation that has always floated around the back of my mind.

 

[jrry32]

The 1st video (Kendricks) is a very tough ball to catch in traffic. It is not back shoulder, as the commentator states, it is actually behind him and outside of his frame. That is a very difficult catch, and a low percentage opportunity.

That ball was put where it should be. Kendricks was between two defenders with a safety bearing down on him. The QB's job is to protect his receiver. Bradford hasn't always done a good job of that but there, he did. You throw the ball to the back shoulder of Kendricks so he can slow his momentum, catch the ball, and get down without getting blown up. You force Kendricks to catch the ball while still running, he's going to get smacked by that safety.

So there are essentially two options on that play for Bradford:
1. You throw it low and let Kendricks try to make a sliding catch; or
2. You throw it slightly behind him, let him reach back for it, and go to the ground.

Obviously, there's a third option which is throw it on him or in front of him but that gets him blown up by the safety. In that circumstance, as a WR, I'd prefer the ball slightly behind me. It's more difficult to go low for it than reach back for it.

The 3rd video (Gibson) is a little harder to tell, as it appears that the ball is thrown a little too much to the outside, making it 'behind' the receiver. But, watching the slow motion instant replay, I am convinced that Gibson made a poor adjustment to the ball, which made it appear to be behind him. The longer the ball is in the air, the more time the receiver has to adjust to the throw, and Gibson just did a poor job on that play. This is another well thrown ball.

Nah, you're right when you say it was a poor adjustment by Gibson. Ball was thrown decently well. Gibson had no reason to leave his feet. All he had to do was turn back for it and it would have hit him in the numbers. Because he left his feet, he didn't adjust fully and then flat-out dropped what was still a very catchable ball.

 

[Amitar]

I think it is the speed of the ball. Bradford throws hard but so do and did a lot of great QB's. So I'm not so sure the receivers are progressing or they are just getting softer passes thrown their way. We'll never know tell Bradford gets back or Keenum gets in and if he throws hard.

 

[Merlin]

I don't want to bash on Bradford, the dude has taken enough hits just by missing out on this offense this year. I do think it is legit, however, to note the difference in drop rates between him and AD.

First off, I'll agree with Les that AD throws a softer ball that is more catchable, and I think that is a big reason for the difference. So it's not about Sam throwing too hard per se, but moreso that a young WR corps now has a QB throwing a very catchable ball and they're getting a big boost in confidence from it.

But there have been other notes too, like mentions of AD's upbeat demeanor in the huddle, that could also contribute. A lot of the game is mental, and I have long suspected that Sam, as talented as he is, looks a little jumpy at times. Dudes pick up on that stuff, the attitude of the QB rubs off on the rest of the offense.

But it doesn't really matter unless it continues. AD has to continue driving this offense down the field. Sustain the drives, and spread that thing around to the right guy at the right time.

 

[tklongball]

That ball was put where it should be. Kendricks was between two defenders with a safety bearing down on him. The QB's job is to protect his receiver. Bradford hasn't always done a good job of that but there, he did. You throw the ball to the back shoulder of Kendricks so he can slow his momentum, catch the ball, and get down without getting blown up. You force Kendricks to catch the ball while still running, he's going to get smacked by that safety.

So there are essentially two options on that play for Bradford:
1. You throw it low and let Kendricks try to make a sliding catch; or
2. You throw it slightly behind him, let him reach back for it, and go to the ground.

Obviously, there's a third option which is throw it on him or in front of him but that gets him blown up by the safety. In that circumstance, as a WR, I'd prefer the ball slightly behind me. It's more difficult to go low for it than reach back for it.

Nah, you're right when you say it was a poor adjustment by Gibson. Ball was thrown decently well. Gibson had no reason to leave his feet. All he had to do was turn back for it and it would have hit him in the numbers. Because he left his feet, he didn't adjust fully and then flat-out dropped what was still a very catchable ball.

I disagree in that the ball is outside his frame. If that ball is 6-10 inches less behind Kendricks (more of a back shoulder catch), it becomes a much easier ball to catch, and still impossible to defend. I am not saying it is a bad throw, and for sure it is a catch these guys are expected to make, and we are talking about a tiny sample size of 3 throws. I was just trying to analyze the 3 throws in the videos. Every QB has throws that aren't perfect, and every receiver drops passes. In order to see who is truly responsible for a certain drop rate requires a much deeper analysis than my 3 throw, 5 minute, once over.

As I analyzed the videos it brought out the feeling in the back of my head about Bradford being accurate, in that the balls are catchable, but not having that next level of accuracy where the passes are not only catchable, but simple catches. Say what you want about receivers and what they are supposed to do, but it is an absolute fact that the harder something is to do, the less often it will be completed successfully, even in tiny increments.

I am trying to be very careful in the wording of my analysis, because criticisms of Bradford seem to be something that immediately get people on Rams Message Boards excited/defensive.

 

[mr.stlouis]

Those are also the only three years, 1999, 2000, 2001, they had more yards per game than the current 382 YPG at just 38 yards per game less!

Holy crap! That's insane...

 

[Oldgeek]

Austin doesn't have the heat on the ball like Sam. That's good and bad, easier for the WR and DBs to catch. Warner threw fastballs, but put the ball in great locations to catch it.

 

[MFaulk107]

That dropped pass by Cook was HUGE. That's the TD we needed to beat the Cowgirls.

 

[Rams0307]

None of that explains this crap:

View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=C4USiF-zG9A


Or this:

View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LfzEvzKResM


Or even this:


View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4LGX3plK-n4[/QUOTE]

Great post. You'd be hard pressed to find a QB that dealt with more drops, more bad penalties, and worse receiving corps than Bradford has as a Ram.

 

[Pho Kadat]

Austin doesn't have the heat on the ball like Sam. That's good and bad, easier for the WR and DBs to catch. Warner threw fastballs, but put the ball in great locations to catch it.

Another downside to the touch pass is on stop routes -- you will get your receiver smoked by the likes of Dashon Goldson if you can't zing it in there. On the plus side, passes on short routes are less likely to be batted down at the line of scrimmage. That's something Davis definitely has over Bradford.

 

[AZRamsFan93]

This is clearly the best WR core we've had here in a LONG time. I'm not buying the Bradford throws the ball too hard or without enough touch argument...concerning all the drops we've seen here in the last few years. Professional NFL receivers shouldn't have to be spoon fed perfect passes in this league. Our WR's have been bottom rung JAGS for awhile.

We had the same receivers last year (sans Britt). We just have a different QB. It seems pretty obvious that the QB has some impact on this equation.

Davis (so far) is a prime example of production over potential. Being a football player, not a football phenom with great measurables. While Sam has all the physical talent I never saw the "it" factor on the field. JMHO.

 

[DaveFan'51]

If Stacy can get going the WRs become more lethal!!! That's what I'm hoping to see Sunday...Stacy taking HUGE chunks of yardage.

I think your on to something here. And considering, the fact, the Eagles D is ranked 26th against the run, Stacy and company have a good shot at having a BIG day!