Bernie: Rams defense can show way to playoffs

[Thordaddy]

So since you guys wouldn't let this article go into the abyss of obscurity I finally took a look at Bernies article and as usual crap but not the smelly piece of dung he's accustomed to, more like bird turd.

IOW brevity was the soul of shit?

 

[The Rammer]

IOW brevity was the soul of crap?

That didn't compute

 

[Selassie I]

OK, you guys are both talking about Bernie's actions as if they are responsible for both your internal and external your responses. IMO, they are responsible for your internal response but YOU are responsible for your external response.

My 12 year old daughter frequently watches Honey Boo Boo on the TV in our living room. Every time I pass through the living room on my way to my computer room I stop to watch the program for a few minutes to see why. The first ten times I did that I'd make disparaging comments about the program and pointed out how stupid the program is to my daughter and she'd politely say "yeah I know Dad but I still like it." Pretty soon she was having trouble being polite and her response had morphed into hostility. We had a talk about that and she rightly pointed out that I had already, on multiple occasions, made my views perfectly clear to her. She asked me why I was constantly trying to ruin the experience for her. I had no answer. Now, when I pass through and she's watching that program I still occasionally watch for a couple of minutes, I still think it sucks big time but I no longer make crappy comments about it nor try to force my views about the program on to her. She's happy that I no longer let that crappy program control my external response to it and she no longer tries to hide the fact that she's watching it.

How many times do I need to hear how much you think Bernie is a __________? At what point do you think you've made your view about him known? When do you come to the realization that I'm no longer listening to you repeat yourself about this subject because I'm trying to derive some enjoyment and you're doing your best to ruin it for me? Would you talk the same way to a member of your family or a friend or would you just agree to disagree.

I have a lot of respect for both of you and the other posters in that thread. I just think you haven't thought it through and you're letting someone else control your actions. You have a choice to be civil and caring of others or...to make other choices.

I'm done talking about this and you guys can do what you want in the future. I merely ask that you take into consideration what the effect your actions has on others.

This was extremely helpful.

Going forward, I will just picture Honey Boo Boo when I read a Bernie column.

Thanks Alan.

 

[Alan]

No problemo Haile!

 

[Thordaddy]

I have it, Bernie should plagiarize some of these camp reports and raise his image

 

[Thordaddy]

That didn't compute

I guess you have a filter on and Sh!t got changed to crap

 

[The Rammer]

I guess you have a filter on and Sh!t got changed to crap

I dont like being moderated

 

[RmsBlsCds]

I'm absolutely with Alan and Sum on this one.

No offense (and yes, I realize how stupid that statement is, as it is always followed by something offensive) but I thought this was the kind of BS many of us left the PD boards to get away from.

Some of the posts I have read on this thread are right up there with "Sam sucks we're doomed until we get another QB! BUST BUST BUST!"

I would be curious how many of the people that dislike Bernie so much are from St. Louis?

I have read St. Louis sports columnists for the past 35 years in this town (going back to the Globe Democrat for goodness sake!), and I put Bernie up among some of the top we have seen in terms of asking the hard questions and trying to dig up stories. When he was on the radio he was responsible for getting all of the best guests on 101.1 ESPN. He helped put that station on the map.

We have always had an inferiority complex here in St. Louis when it comes to the media and national coverage. The East and West coast biases have been around ever since ESPN launched, and we are always skeptical about any outsiders that cover our teams (Bernie is from Baltimore, btw).

Bernie gets the same treatment from die-hard Cardinals fans and Blues fans as well. For the Cardinals he's dogged for not attacking the organization enough when they lose or are in the midst of a slump. Blues fans don't believe anyone other than Gordie Howe or Wayne Gretzky should ever be allowed to talk about hockey.

One thing many people have to realize is that Bernie is not writing these articles for the 1% of us that spend time on Rams message boards and soaking in football like it's our lifeblood. He writes for the more casual fan that wanders to stltoday.com or still subscribes to their paper. So yeah, a lot of what he (or any columnist for that matter) writes is not news to us, and the opinion he has is likely someone here already has expressed.

The TLDR version of this: To follow up what Alan said why in the hell come into a thread about a known journalist you despise just to make sure everyone remembers how you think he's a lazy, useless, fat guy that shouldn't be paid to write?

Very strange....

 

[Rmfnlt]

<evil grin>

"When he straddles the fence and/or talks out of both sides of his mouth, then I might point out the inconsistencies, but in the end it doesn't matter to me what he writes. I, personally, have seen him change his mind frequently over the years, and he'll shove his opinion down your throat either way. "I SAID SPAGS IS GETTING A BUM WRAP YOU IDIOTS!" soon became, "I SAID SPAGS IS A crappy COACH YOU IDIOTS!" It's just funny. And transparent."
I struggle with this sometimes (the emphasis on consistency).

Using your example: Perhaps at one point, he thought Spags was getting a bum rap. Remember when Spags arrived? Lots of positives about him. Great defensive mind. The local and national media loved him. Gutted what we all knew was a really bad, old roster. Kind of what Fisher has done. So most all were on board the Spags train.

After that somewhat promising 7-9 season and coming close to the playoffs, most fans were still on board (although that first season was as painful as anything I, personally, have experienced as a Rams fan).

But that next year? Things just kind of fell apart... Bradford hurt, McDaniels scheme not matching the talent at that time... more injuries. And fans turned on Spags. So, if Bernie was saying that was a bum rap, then he might have been right.

But, as more time passed, we saw Spags wasn't the guy... the job was too big for him and he had to go. If Bernie was saying he was a crappy coach, then he might have been right.

My point is... situations change... people's opinions change. For some reason, that is viewed by many as a negative. In a lot of cases, that might not be fair.

I know I've changed over the years... I'm sure you have too. Right now, you are on board with Fisher and Snead... but, if things were to deteriorate, your opinion might change, no?



"A Bernie thread with zero replies says more than one with 144 replies shellacking him."
Yes, sir!

 

[Thordaddy]

I'm absolutely with Alan and Sum on this one.

No offense (and yes, I realize how stupid that statement is, as it is always followed by something offensive) but I thought this was the kind of BS many of us left the PD boards to get away from.

Some of the posts I have read on this thread are right up there with "Sam sucks we're doomed until we get another QB! BUST BUST BUST!"

I would be curious how many of the people that dislike Bernie so much are from St. Louis?

I have read St. Louis sports columnists for the past 35 years in this town (going back to the Globe Democrat for goodness sake!), and I put Bernie up among some of the top we have seen in terms of asking the hard questions and trying to dig up stories. When he was on the radio he was responsible for getting all of the best guests on 101.1 ESPN. He helped put that station on the map.

We have always had an inferiority complex here in St. Louis when it comes to the media and national coverage. The East and West coast biases have been around ever since ESPN launched, and we are always skeptical about any outsiders that cover our teams (Bernie is from Baltimore, btw).

Bernie gets the same treatment from die-hard Cardinals fans and Blues fans as well. For the Cardinals he's dogged for not attacking the organization enough when they lose or are in the midst of a slump. Blues fans don't believe anyone other than Gordie Howe or Wayne Gretzky should ever be allowed to talk about hockey.

One thing many people have to realize is that Bernie is not writing these articles for the 1% of us that spend time on Rams message boards and soaking in football like it's our lifeblood. He writes for the more casual fan that wanders to stltoday.com or still subscribes to their paper. So yeah, a lot of what he (or any columnist for that matter) writes is not news to us, and the opinion he has is likely someone here already has expressed.

The TLDR version of this: To follow up what Alan said why in the hell come into a thread about a known journalist you despise just to make sure everyone remembers how you think he's a lazy, useless, fat guy that shouldn't be paid to write?

Very strange....

In a nutshell team members and posters here aren't "fair game" , pundits are because PUNDITS take shots at players and teams and owners , gratuitous shots,if you wish to defend Bernie you are free to do so, just do yourself a favor and don't attack posters in the process.

BTW if you in deed have been reading for 35 years you missed slightly the inquisition of Tom Barnadge and Rich Koster that lead the masses of St. Louis to refuse the needs of the FB Cardinals and ultimately lead to St,Louis losing that team.
Bernie imputes motives upon the Rams ownership, he accuses them of intentionally torturing the fan base because they don't give him access, he lead that sort of inquisition against Martz until Martz gave him access and then became Martz lap dog in the war of words over Kurt Warner.
If you think Bernie is a journalist,I suggest you examine your standards of such, because he falls well short of my standards for the profession ,if my saying so offends, you put me on ignore , or maybe just maybe realize that since you are in such a profound minority of opine about "the Hut" you could be in error about the quality of his work.

 

[-X-]

I struggle with this sometimes (the emphasis on consistency).

Using your example: Perhaps at one point, he thought Spags was getting a bum rap. Remember when Spags arrived? Lots of positives about him. Great defensive mind. The local and national media loved him. Gutted what we all knew was a really bad, old roster. Kind of what Fisher has done. So most all were on board the Spags train.

After that somewhat promising 7-9 season and coming close to the playoffs, most fans were still on board (although that first season was as painful as anything I, personally, have experienced as a Rams fan).

But that next year? Things just kind of fell apart... Bradford hurt, McDaniels scheme not matching the talent at that time... more injuries. And fans turned on Spags. So, if Bernie was saying that was a bum rap, then he might have been right.

But, as more time passed, we saw Spags wasn't the guy... the job was too big for him and he had to go. If Bernie was saying he was a crappy coach, then he might have been right.

My point is... situations change... people's opinions change. For some reason, that is viewed by many as a negative. In a lot of cases, that might not be fair.

I know I've changed over the years... I'm sure you have too. Right now, you are on board with Fisher and Snead... but, if things were to deteriorate, your opinion might change, no?

The problem with that, Rmfnlt, is that he said those two things two weeks apart. Bernie and I had a brief discussion about it before he decided he didn't want to talk about it anymore and blocked me on Twitter. But not before he got a parting shot in of course. I even went as far as to record two separate interviews (again, two weeks apart) wherein he says two completely different things about the same topic of discussion, and I spliced them together so he could see (hear) what I was talking about.

And this isn't about Spags, really. My opinion will always be the same about him. He fell under an avalanche of shit in 2011 and that was pretty much insurmountable. No team loses 10 corners, their staring QB, most of their O-line, their starting RB, most of the receivers, and has a stellar season to show at the end of it. I was 100% behind Bernie and Balzer when they laid all of that stuff out for their radio audience. Bernie was actually making fun of the people who said the Rams should just win anyway, and it was all Spags' fault. You know how he does that too ... makes that "duhh" voice as if he's mimicking morons who don't know anything about football. And then a little over two weeks later, he made the same "duhhh" voice to mimic the people who were more or less absolving Spags of the problems plaguing the team.

And that's fine. I know what his job is. His job is to get people talking about stuff he says - good or bad. And if he doesn't take an extreme position, it's not going to generate as much discussion. He's absolutely allowed to change his mind after a cup of coffee too. That's certainly his prerogative. But when he starts to ridicule people (e.g., "the short attention span crowd") to get his point across, then he's opening himself up for the same treatment. And you know what? He probably likes enjoys that.

 

[Faceplant]

So wait. Big Bern essentially just wrote a column summarizing what he has read in other peoples columns? How is that any different than what we do on this forum. Oh yeah, he gets paid for his "opinions". Lolz....

 

[Rmfnlt]

The problem with that, Rmfnlt, is that he said those two things two weeks apart. Bernie and I had a brief discussion about it before he decided he didn't want to talk about it anymore and blocked me on Twitter. But not before he got a parting shot in of course. I even went as far as to record two separate interviews (again, two weeks apart) wherein he says two completely different things about the same topic of discussion, and I spliced them together so he could see (hear) what I was talking about.

And this isn't about Spags, really. My opinion will always be the same about him. He fell under an avalanche of crap in 2011 and that was pretty much insurmountable. No team loses 10 corners, their staring QB, most of their O-line, their starting RB, most of the receivers, and has a stellar season to show at the end of it. I was 100% behind Bernie and Balzer when they laid all of that stuff out for their radio audience. Bernie was actually making fun of the people who said the Rams should just win anyway, and it was all Spags' fault. You know how he does that too ... makes that "duhh" voice as if he's mimicking morons who don't know anything about football. And then a little over two weeks later, he made the same "duhhh" voice to mimic the people who were more or less absolving Spags of the problems plaguing the team.

And that's fine. I know what his job is. His job is to get people talking about stuff he says - good or bad. And if he doesn't take an extreme position, it's not going to generate as much discussion. He's absolutely allowed to change his mind after a cup of coffee too. That's certainly his prerogative. But when he starts to ridicule people (e.g., "the short attention span crowd") to get his point across, then he's opening himself up for the same treatment. And you know what? He probably likes enjoys that.

Thanks for clarifying... yes, two weeks apart seems a bit much. Had it gone down like I was theorizing, it might have been defensible. But it didn't, so there you go!

I don't listen to him, so I don't know about the "voice", but I definitely agree with you about the emotional tone of his articles (your example of the "short attention span crowd" is a good one!).

Always seemed unprofessional to me when he does that.

Hey, he's a mixed bag... some good points, some bad, and some silliness.

But, I'm a little disappointed that, if his article is critical of something going on with the Rams, it's banned from here.

 

[Thordaddy]

And that's fine. I know what his job is. His job is to get people talking about stuff he says - good or bad. And if he doesn't take an extreme position, it's not going to generate as much discussion. He's absolutely allowed to change his mind after a cup of coffee too. That's certainly his prerogative. But when he starts to ridicule people (e.g., "the short attention span crowd") to get his point across, then he's opening himself up for the same treatment. And you know what? He probably likes enjoys that.

Oh I think so ,I think he regards the vitriol he generates as success,as some kind of badge of honor ,problem is he doesn't know the difference between hard hitting journalism and just being a prick

 

[-X-]

Hey, he's a mixed bag... some good points, some bad, and some silliness.

But, I'm a little disappointed that, if his article is critical of something going on with the Rams, it's banned from here.

I hear ya. He can provide some decent research once in a while too. I'm just not a fan of being indirectly insulted for not sharing his wisdom. As for his being banned here on a rotating basis, I'm not sure that's the case. He had a brief stint where he was *only* bashing the team, and posting his articles was like lifting garbage out of the PD and dumping it on this board. As expected, it only drew visceral reactions. So I guess we just kept it off the board for a brief spell.

 

[VARam]

I'm from St. Louis and I still find him annoying.

 

[rhinobean]

Thanks for clarifying... yes, two weeks apart seems a bit much. Had it gone down like I was theorizing, it might have been defensible. But it didn't, so there you go!

I don't listen to him, so I don't know about the "voice", but I definitely agree with you about the emotional tone of his articles (your example of the "short attention span crowd" is a good one!).

Always seemed unprofessional to me when he does that.

Hey, he's a mixed bag... some good points, some bad, and some silliness.

But, I'm a little disappointed that, if his article is critical of something going on with the Rams, it's banned from here.

If he did his homework before he critized the team then it wouldn't get the vitriole he gets from the real Rams fans! Too much arrogance in his stuff to let it go as knowledgeable writing also. He's a tool!

 

[Thordaddy]

I hear ya. He can provide some decent research once in a while too. I'm just not a fan of being indirectly insulted for not sharing his wisdom. As for his being banned here on a rotating basis, I'm not sure that's the case. He had a brief stint where he was *only* bashing the team, and posting his articles was like lifting garbage out of the PD and dumping it on this board. As expected, it only drew visceral reactions. So I guess we just kept it off the board for a brief spell.

Exactly, why should any poster be insulted because I pan Bernie? WHATARTHEY his fan club ? DO ya get the diet plan with a membership?

 

[Rmfnlt]

If he did his homework before he critized the team then it wouldn't get the vitriole he gets from the real Rams fans! Too much arrogance in his stuff to let it go as knowledgeable writing also. He's a tool!

Hmmm... I wonder... if he took a different tone (not so emotional, not appearing to be arrogant)... a more objective tone, would his opinions still be considered?

Sometimes he does do research and still criticizes. Is those opinions received differently here?

The local reporters levy criticism from time to time. I'm new to this board, are they met with this same strong reaction?

If not, why not? Got to figure it has more to do with Bernie's "way" than his actual opinions or research.

 

[Angry Ram]

I'm absolutely with Alan and Sum on this one.

No offense (and yes, I realize how stupid that statement is, as it is always followed by something offensive) but I thought this was the kind of BS many of us left the PD boards to get away from.

Some of the posts I have read on this thread are right up there with "Sam sucks we're doomed until we get another QB! BUST BUST BUST!"

I would be curious how many of the people that dislike Bernie so much are from St. Louis?

I have read St. Louis sports columnists for the past 35 years in this town (going back to the Globe Democrat for goodness sake!), and I put Bernie up among some of the top we have seen in terms of asking the hard questions and trying to dig up stories. When he was on the radio he was responsible for getting all of the best guests on 101.1 ESPN. He helped put that station on the map.

We have always had an inferiority complex here in St. Louis when it comes to the media and national coverage. The East and West coast biases have been around ever since ESPN launched, and we are always skeptical about any outsiders that cover our teams (Bernie is from Baltimore, btw).

Bernie gets the same treatment from die-hard Cardinals fans and Blues fans as well. For the Cardinals he's dogged for not attacking the organization enough when they lose or are in the midst of a slump. Blues fans don't believe anyone other than Gordie Howe or Wayne Gretzky should ever be allowed to talk about hockey.

One thing many people have to realize is that Bernie is not writing these articles for the 1% of us that spend time on Rams message boards and soaking in football like it's our lifeblood. He writes for the more casual fan that wanders to stltoday.com or still subscribes to their paper. So yeah, a lot of what he (or any columnist for that matter) writes is not news to us, and the opinion he has is likely someone here already has expressed.

The TLDR version of this: To follow up what Alan said why in the hell come into a thread about a known journalist you despise just to make sure everyone remembers how you think he's a lazy, useless, fat guy that shouldn't be paid to write?

Very strange....

Again, it's because lately he's been knee jerk article taking cheap shots whenever he gets a chance too. There's a difference b/w asking the hard questions than just banging the "no excuses" drum. I was actually a Bernie listener when he on the radio, I followed him on twitter. But something changed, and IDK what it was. And it was so knee jerk it was ridiculous. Every loss meant the team was in a flushing toilet, every player on the Rams was bad, every coach was an idiot, blah blah blah. Oh but after a win, it was all "oh the team is headed in the right direction" even though even in wins there are issues that can be improved upon. I still infuriated with the way his videos/articles were after the season ended. As soon as the season ended he claimed "Rams must publicly commit to Sam Bradford." Then, a couple weeks later he was ranting about how the Rams need to draft Johnny Manziel, all the while taking a cheap shot at Sam Bradford (saying he has the personaility of an accountant). Here's the link http://www.stltoday.com/sports/colu...cle_d383b053-1d05-57fc-a7a7-87b49144ca1f.html

Where's the professionalism? Where's the bias-free commentary? Having a sports writer/radio gig is a dream job for any sports fan, and Bernie just goes out and pees all over it. As much as I dislike Jim Thomas (who I think is incredibly boring and dull in his writing) at least he keeps it professional.