A few observations..... Boras/Keenum - Cignetti/Foles & OLINE

[DR RAM]

Agree with the OP. The Ol injuries killed us. Foles, Killed us. Fact, fact. Cignetti used about 10 plays, can't call that fact, but seemed like 5 plays. GRob, what is true for all players, when you think, you get beat. He also has to work on technique, both feet, and hand placement, punch, but is markedly better than he was when he started the season, and from last year. He's going to be good, IF he works hard. I see some passion there, I believe he will.

Havenstein, by who has to move around, and play different positions, has showed his value, and his future is very bright, IMO. The Guard play, was inconsistent, but understandably so, based on the circumstances, and by having several injuries, a few guys got to play, and showed some flash. D. Williams, Jamon Brown, Wichmann, all could be a part of this offense, for a long time. We only have one RT on the team, except when Donnal played there, is a RT only, but has some potential. Remember how young these guys are, and they will gain lean muscle, and power, technique, and more experience in the coming seasons.

Unless we make a swith of one of these guys to C, then we need to upgrade there in the future. Taking nothing from Barnes, and he was probably our most consistent player for the year, but he's not dominant either.

Our top need, in my eyes, is WR. We need more at QB, but I am still not convinced we need to draft another. We, maybe, could get an experienced dude via a trade, or something like that. Only the Rams know how much they believe in Mannion, and Case has proven himself to be able to inspire, and not lose games.

 

[DR RAM]

All good points. As to Saffold, I agree with your role for him, but nothing I've seen suggests he won't be in the Rams plans; indeed, Fisher recently stated, "I don't have the philosophy where a player is going to lose his job because of injury". I fully expect Saffold will be back and named as a starter assuming he's healthy when camp begins.

This is a point, I agree with wholehearted. I would keep Saffold on the bench, on the 45, and if someone goes down, he could step right in, without disrupting our whole line.

 

[Mikey Ram]

All good points. As to Saffold, I agree with your role for him, but nothing I've seen suggests he won't be in the Rams plans; indeed, Fisher recently stated, "I don't have the philosophy where a player is going to lose his job because of injury". I fully expect Saffold will be back and named as a starter assuming he's healthy when camp begins.

Keep in mind, however, that Fisher has said a lot of things that have changed before coming to fruition...

 

[FRO]

We were rough on Jenkins for his first three years for his mental lapses in the secondary and biting on plays he shouldn't leaving his guy open. Enter year 4 and he has matured into a great CB. The physical aspects are there for Robinson, he just needs to mature. He would be a college senior had he stayed in school. He needs to mature his game. That may never happen. Time will tell. It's too early to bail on him though. He was a raw project when drafted and this slow trajectory should have been expected.

 

[ramsince62]

We were rough on Jenkins for his first three years for his mental lapses in the secondary and biting on plays he shouldn't leaving his guy open. Enter year 4 and he has matured into a great CB. The physical aspects are there for Robinson, he just needs to mature. He would be a college senior had he stayed in school. He needs to mature his game. That may never happen. Time will tell. It's too early to bail on him though. He was a raw project when drafted and this slow trajectory should have been expected.

If that's the case, then he's playing a damn poor position to be just a trainee.

 

[A55VA6]

Good stuff Coach O.

 

[FRO]

If that's the case, then he's playing a damn poor position to be just a trainee.

I agree and that's why you don't draft raw players like Robinson and Quick so high. It is what it is now, we just have to hope for the best.

 

[BonifayRam]

All good points. As to Saffold, I agree with your role for him, but nothing I've seen suggests he won't be in the Rams plans; indeed, Fisher recently stated, "I don't have the philosophy where a player is going to lose his job because of injury". I fully expect Saffold will be back and named as a starter assuming he's healthy when camp begins.

When has Saffold ever been fully healthy? When & its rare if he is healthy he soon will not be. The Rams will have three former starting OG's other than Saffold. IMO all three (Brown/Reynolds/Wichmann) outlasted & outplayed Saffold. Saffold is NFL's most injured OL'er.

Fisher planning on starting Saffold means you will have to play musical chairs OL posts when he goes out & RS will do that. We have seen this over and over & over again with RS for many seasons this is not a positive....

If the above was not bad enough when you add in that keeping & paying Saffold Five million in 2016 just complicates the free agent signing of our departing UFA's Jenkins, Johnson, Barron, McLeod, Hayes, Fairley, Sims, Zuerlein & Barnes. Plus other who will enter free agency like Harkey, Davis, Cunningham, Keenum, Bates & Quick. If it were my decision I am using that 5 mil to help keep players who can remain on the field & make positive plays & we know one thing that's not Saffold.

 

[Pete Tooley]

Agree with the OP. The Ol injuries killed us. Foles, Killed us. Fact, fact. Cignetti used about 10 plays, can't call that fact, but seemed like 5 plays. GRob, what is true for all players, when you think, you get beat. He also has to work on technique, both feet, and hand placement, punch, but is markedly better than he was when he started the season, and from last year. He's going to be good, IF he works hard. I see some passion there, I believe he will.

Havenstein, by who has to move around, and play different positions, has showed his value, and his future is very bright, IMO. The Guard play, was inconsistent, but understandably so, based on the circumstances, and by having several injuries, a few guys got to play, and showed some flash. D. Williams, Jamon Brown, Wichmann, all could be a part of this offense, for a long time. We only have one RT on the team, except when Donnal played there, is a RT only, but has some potential. Remember how young these guys are, and they will gain lean muscle, and power, technique, and more experience in the coming seasons.

Unless we make a swith of one of these guys to C, then we need to upgrade there in the future. Taking nothing from Barnes, and he was probably our most consistent player for the year, but he's not dominant either.

Our top need, in my eyes, is WR. We need more at QB, but I am still not convinced we need to draft another. We, maybe, could get an experienced dude via a trade, or something like that. Only the Rams know how much they believe in Mannion, and Case has proven himself to be able to inspire, and not lose games.

The price for Tim Barnes went up significantly after this year. He will sign a nice free agent contract with someone. You center "experts"make me laugh.

 

[jjab360]

The price for Tim Barnes went up significantly after this year. He will sign a nice free agent contract with someone. You center "experts"make me laugh.

I seriously doubt it, he's been average at best.

 

[CoachO]

The price for Tim Barnes went up significantly after this year. He will sign a nice free agent contract with someone. You center "experts"make me laugh.

Kinda makes me wonder if all the people who claim he needs to be replaced have watched other centers game in and game out. Not sure what sort of expectations people have regarding the position.

Barnes justified being named the starting Center and was arguably the most consistent player on the unit throughout the season.

I agree completely with you that his price tag went up. And given how he performed, IMO the Rams will make a big mistake letting him walk. Especially if Rhaney is plan B.

 

[DR RAM]

The price for Tim Barnes went up significantly after this year. He will sign a nice free agent contract with someone. You center "experts"make me laugh.

That's great fucking reply.

We can upgrade there...and there was plenty more to my post, in which I didn't bash Barnes at all.
Happy New Year.

 

[den-the-coach]

Boras is better than Cig. Keenum is better than Foles. Neither may be the answer though. Foles wasn't a fit at all and played horrible for us. I would still like to upgrade the QB spot and the OC spot this offseason.

Agree with you on Keenum, but not on Boras. I'm getting a good feeling about him all the way around. Many who attended training camps spoke highly about him as did the likes of D'Marco Farr and other former players. He's very intense and might be a perfect match with Fisher and besides he looks the part or is it that I just like the surname "Boras?"

 

[DR RAM]

Kinda makes me wonder if all the people who claim he needs to be replaced have watched other centers game in and game out. Not sure what sort of expectations people have regarding the position.

Barnes justified being named the starting Center and was arguably the most consistent player on the unit throughout the season.

I agree completely with you that his price tag went up. And given how he performed, IMO the Rams will make a big mistake letting him walk. Especially if Rhaney is plan B.

Well, you know that I have, CoachO, but you also should know by now, that I know what I'm talking about. He was our best Center option this year, and I have agreed with it all year. We can get better play at the position though, and ANYONE who has watched the Rams, can see that. My suggestion is for developing someone behind him, not kicking him off the team.

Kind of a big difference.

 

[jjab360]

Kinda makes me wonder if all the people who claim he needs to be replaced have watched other centers game in and game out. Not sure what sort of expectations people have regarding the position.

Barnes justified being named the starting Center and was arguably the most consistent player on the unit throughout the season.

I agree completely with you that his price tag went up. And given how he performed, IMO the Rams will make a big mistake letting him walk. Especially if Rhaney is plan B.

I'd also like to clarify my last post, when I say average at best that's pretty much a god send compared to what we've had there years past, but still pretty much league average from what I've seen from other teams.

I really hope we re-sign him though, because Rhaney starting at C is a scary proposition.

 

[CoachO]

Well, you know that I have, CoachO, but you also should know by now, that I know what I'm talking about. He was our best Center option this year, and I have agreed with it all year. We can get better play at the position though, and ANYONE who has watched the Rams, can see that. My suggestion is for developing someone behind him, not kicking him off the team.

Kind of a big difference.

Average? I disagree with your assessment by saying he has been average. Given the hand he was dealt, playing along side six different guards, including Donnal and Rhaney who were BOTH lost, I think Barnes has been better than average.

He was good to very good in the early part of the season (when both Brown & Saffold were still healthy). He has been better than average the past month with the same line mates (Wichmann & Reynolds) settling in. As Wichmann has gotten better, so has the entire unit. Including Barnes.

When forced to play next to raw rookies (Donnal, Rhaney and Wichmann early on) Barnes "struggled". How much of that was him trying to cover for the mistakes of others?

As a first year starter, they could have done worse. IMO, he is only going to get better as the others around him improve right along with him.

 

[DR RAM]

Average? I disagree with your assessment by saying he has been average. Given the hand he was dealt, playing along side six different guards, including Donnal and Rhaney who were BOTH lost, I think Barnes has been better than average.

He was good to very good in the early part of the season (when both Brown & Saffold were still healthy). He has been better than average the past month with the same line mates (Wichmann & Reynolds) settling in. As Wichmann has gotten better, so has the entire unit. Including Barnes.

When forced to play next to raw rookies (Donnal, Rhaney and Wichmann early on) Barnes "struggled". How much of that was him trying to cover for the mistakes of others?

As a first year starter, they could have done worse. IMO, he is only going to get better as the others around him improve right along with him.

I never said he was average...so?

Apparently you don't read my posts, or the entirety of them. That's cool.

 

[Merlin]

Appreciate the post Coach it was an enjoyable read.

You know, I wonder to what extent Cigs was involved in signing Foles. Did he push for it or play a key role in the mentality of "we better sign this guy now because he is gonna play well?"

Either way, though, it is clear to me from the product on the field that Boras is an improvement at OC. He has a great feel for balancing calls but also it seems all 11 players are encountering what his gameplan prepares them for.

That is something I think goes unnoticed. A great coordinator is going to have a plan of attack that accurately estimates how the defense will react to a given formation and play, and takes advantage. I think Boras has a better feel for doing that, and it is partially why the whole thing has looked so much better on the field.

What I would like to know is what Fish is gonna do with OC after next game. Most will guess, including myself, that he keeps Boras. Think he will interview a top guy if the market is plentiful?

 

[CoachO]

I never said he was average...so?

Apparently you don't read my posts, or the entirety of them. That's cool.

My bad. I see the "average" tag was posted by jjab360 immediately after yours. So I guess I quoted the wrong post.

That being said, I stand by my comments as to Barnes getting better and will disagree that he needs to be replaced.

 

[DR RAM]

My bad. I see the "average" tag was posted by jjab360 immediately after yours. So I guess I quoted the wrong post.

That being said, I stand by my comments as to Barnes getting better and will disagree that he needs to be replaced.

Again, that's cool, but I never said replaced either. I said that we could get better at the position, which includes backups, BTW, which you inadvertently agreed with. I said he wasn't dominant, and I stand by everything I say, all the time.

It's funny how people cherry pick, and try to make an argument. I agreed with almost every single thing you said. That's good enough for me. I liked your original post.