What if Sean McVay is really an asshole?

[thirteen28]

Wyche reported some very hard conversations took place at this time, in which Sean and Jared did not see eye to eye.

If Goff had a 4 hour contentious meeting with his coach where it ends up getting reported that marriage counseling is required, and came out of it like nothing was wrong, how does that translate into grasping the nuances of McVay's offense?

And then years of McVay tweaking the offense to compensate, and STILL mistakes are made? To me, this is the most likely course of events to cause his frustration and desire to move on.

On thing that has had me curious since before the trade is something Silver said in a video about this situation, namely that there were "philosophical disagreements" between Goff and McVay with regard to the offense. I don't know what those entail, because no other information was given. But it does suggest the problem might have run deeper than mere performance, with Goff not buying into what McVay was doing with the offense, which would obviously be a big problem for both sides and would definitely be grounds for the breakup. I can only go by conjecture here, but maybe Goff didn't believe McVay's tweaks to the offense were the right ones for him. He certainly didn't look comfortable running the offense for a big chunk of the season. McVay obviously felt otherwise. Either way, I hope someday we find out what was said in that conversation.

If it's one thing McVay has shown, he will not sit idly by while a player doesn't perform up to his expectations.

I wish he would have applied that to Blythe. Good God, I hope his expectations for Blythe were above what he actually delivered.

At this point (and based on my previous paragraph above) I'm not sure having the C position fixed and having a more solid OL would have prevented the break up ... but it sure would have offered some clarity in evaluating both the offensive scheme and play of the QB who ran it.

The Rams don't want to build a reputation of bad breakups, this sort of looks like two now.

No, they don't want to build that reputation.

When they are finally able to talk about the trade per league rules, it probably wouldn't hurt McVay and Snead to come out and say that, yes, they could have handled the public relations aspect of this break up better than they did. It would at least acknowledge that they had a little respect for the player and appreciate what he did accomplish during his time here.

 

[Tano]

If so, then she wasn't worth having to begin with. Fake ass "influencer". Dime a dozen to an NFL QB....

I can't stand "Influencers"

 

[Tano]

At this point (and based on my previous paragraph above) I'm not sure having the C position fixed and having a more solid OL would have prevented the break up ... but it sure would have offered some clarity in evaluating both the offensive scheme and play of the QB who ran it.

This

 

[OldSchool]

Yeah but her modeling career is in LA. Detroit I think that is the last city I would move to in the US

Jared has also said he has laid down roots in LA and that's home. It could end up one of those stay in LA in the offseason but live in Detroit area in season. There are a lot of players that will do stuff like that. Stafford for example I'm pretty sure I read that he has a house in Texas as does his best buddy Clayton Kershaw.

 

[Faceplant]

Jared has also said he has laid down roots in LA and that's home. It could end up one of those stay in LA in the offseason but live in Detroit area in season. There are a lot of players that will do stuff like that. Stafford for example I'm pretty sure I read that he has a house in Texas as does his best buddy Clayton Kershaw.

I think Stafford already has a house in LA also.....

 

[OldSchool]

I think Stafford already has a house in LA also.....

Very possible it's even near his good buddy Clayton.

 

[Tano]

Very possible it's even near his good buddy Clayton.

They could have houses in every city they play

 

[Mackeyser]

I think McVay comes from a school that's notoriously hard on QBs with super high expectations.

That would be the Gruden tree. More on that in this vid at the queue mark.



Rodgers wasn't feeling Matt LaFleur likely in part because LaFleur wasn't gonna let the details go and pushed him...even going so far as to draft another QB.

Jimmy G's under the gun and maybe out of SF.

Goff is out of LA.

There have been questions for a couple of years now about Derek Carr.

It's a legit criticism that maybe the system is TOO hard on QBs, but it also is a system that when run with excellent execution is really prolific.

I hope Stafford is the guy. I really think he is and I think McVay and Stafford are both a schematic, skill and system mix..

But the criticism that the coaches from the Gruden tree being tough on QBs to the point of maybe being jerks? yeah, that's legit.

 

[iamme33]

I hate that we are starting to get a reputation for shitting on players. Of course, if we go on to win championships, I shall give nary a fuck.

i don't know about players but i kinda worry about coaches. there has not been one that was offered a job that has turned it down. it almost seems like most of them can't wait to go. you would think a few would want to stick around for a year or two just to learn from the master. i could be wrong but we lose by far more coaches then any other team is that because teams want to learn the mcvay system or because those coaches want out. it is kinda weird that i seem to need something to worry about all the time.

 

[Allen2McVay]

i don't know about players but i kinda worry about coaches. there has not been one that was offered a job that has turned it down. it almost seems like most of them can't wait to go. you would think a few would want to stick around for a year or two just to learn from the master. i could be wrong but we lose by far more coaches then any other team is that because teams want to learn the mcvay system or because those coaches want out. it is kinda weird that i seem to need something to worry about all the time.

Yes, that is weird.

When was the last time a position coach turned down a coordinator job offer?

When was the last time a coordinator turned down a head coach job offer?

I’m sure there are examples but I can’t think of any off the top of my head.

 

[Mackeyser]

i don't know about players but i kinda worry about coaches. there has not been one that was offered a job that has turned it down. it almost seems like most of them can't wait to go. you would think a few would want to stick around for a year or two just to learn from the master. i could be wrong but we lose by far more coaches then any other team is that because teams want to learn the mcvay system or because those coaches want out. it is kinda weird that i seem to need something to worry about all the time.

I dunno. I think after 2017, the coaches all saw that the pull from working with McVay is real and coaches know that promotion opportunities cannot be taken for granted.

Look at Bienemy. Dud's hella qualified and hardly gets a call. How is Brian Daboll not a HC after his work with Josh Allen?

I think it's a lot of things, but mostly, I think coaches are striking while the iron is hot.

 

[iamme33]

They could have houses in every city they play

as long as they don't have like a cowboy party house in every city. could not decide if this should have been blue or not

 

[FrantikRam]

I see some contradictions.

Sounds like the communication could have been a lot better between QB and coach. Goff's self awareness? or... Has McVay completely shared where his head has been at with Goff?

The following quote is Goff's perspective, but I never like hearing what appears some things unsaid between coach and player.

The optics sort of support Goff (i.e. not a great look on the Rams), if he hasn't heard from the Rams since the trade, IMO.

“That’s the tough part right now is trying to figure that out, when did that happen?” he said. “Those are all conversations that I may or may not have, and try to figure it out. That’s the conversation to have.”

Asked if it is strange that he has yet to have that talk with the Rams, he said: “A little bit, yeah.”

Then the following quotes indicate the friction was evident. I don't exactly know what the last comment means (this is how its supposed to feel). But, again, things were clearly weird toward the end.

So... I dunno Memphis... you gravitated to Goff's self awareness... I gravitated to "where is the communication at"?

I say that, because the same sort of weirdness happened when Gurley left. The Rams don't want to build a reputation of bad breakups, this sort of looks like two now.

“You don’t want to be in the wrong place. It became increasingly clear that was the case. [The trade] is something that I’m hopeful is going to be so good for my career.”

Talking to the Lions, Goff said, “is what made me go, ‘oh my God, this is how it’s supposed to feel. This makes me feel great,’

I felt the same as Memphis.

I'm sure many of us have managed people and one of the biggest things is that in a performance review, nothing should be a surprise. In a way this trade represents a negative review, and Goff seems surprised.

That leads to a question: after all the multi turnover games, do you believe McVay addressed them with Jared? If so, this flat out shouldn't be a surprise. And I have to think he addressed it, because he called him out publicly, which to me suggests that Goff wasn't receptive in private and McVay was out of ideas.

You brought up Gurley which is an interesting comparison. McVay NEVER criticized TG publicly and even flat out lied to all of us in a way about his knee injury. Probably knowing that we were going to cut him in the off-season for most of 2019.

So what was different between Gurley and Goff? Why would McVay essentially lie to protect Gurley but call Goff out publicly? We don't know but the only thing that makes sense is that Goff didn't respond to his feedback. Only reason he would go public too.

So this comment from Goff shows an extreme lack of self awareness IMO. Any professional athletes that bad a year like him, at any position, should be thinking "I'm in trouble".

 

[Memphis Ram]

I see some contradictions.

Sounds like the communication could have been a lot better between QB and coach. Goff's self awareness? or... Has McVay completely shared where his head has been at with Goff?

The following quote is Goff's perspective, but I never like hearing what appears some things unsaid between coach and player.

The optics sort of support Goff (i.e. not a great look on the Rams), if he hasn't heard from the Rams since the trade, IMO.

“That’s the tough part right now is trying to figure that out, when did that happen?” he said. “Those are all conversations that I may or may not have, and try to figure it out. That’s the conversation to have.”

Asked if it is strange that he has yet to have that talk with the Rams, he said: “A little bit, yeah.”

Then the following quotes indicate the friction was evident. I don't exactly know what the last comment means (this is how its supposed to feel). But, again, things were clearly weird toward the end.

So... I dunno Memphis... you gravitated to Goff's self awareness... I gravitated to "where is the communication at"?

I say that, because the same sort of weirdness happened when Gurley left. The Rams don't want to build a reputation of bad breakups, this sort of looks like two now.

“You don’t want to be in the wrong place. It became increasingly clear that was the case. [The trade] is something that I’m hopeful is going to be so good for my career.”

Talking to the Lions, Goff said, “is what made me go, ‘oh my God, this is how it’s supposed to feel. This makes me feel great,’

But, from reading Silver's article, McVay called Goff and Goff quickly got off the phone when his dad called. Communication over.

“That’s the tough part right now is trying to figure that out, when did that happen?” he said. “Those are all conversations that I may or may not have, and try to figure it out. That’s the conversation to have.”

Asked if it is strange that he has yet to have that talk with the Rams, he said: “A little bit, yeah.”

The when did that happen part is what I was referring to earlier btw.

 

[Ram Ts]

McVay with Goff reminds me of my single days with girlfriends. Everything would be good and then one thing or one day I’d feel I’m just not into her anymore and bam. No in between. One day in and next day out. I couldn’t even stand to be around the girl from that point on and would do anything to end it & be done. That’s McVay with Goff - Snead get this guy out of here and get me Stafford....now!

 

[FrantikRam]

McVay with Goff reminds me of my single days with girlfriends. Everything would be good and then one thing or one day I’d feel I’m just not into her anymore and bam. No in between. One day in and next day out. I couldn’t even stand to be around the girl from that point on and would do anything to end it & be done. That’s McVay with Goff - Snead get this guy out of here and get me Stafford....now!

Except....really McVay only asked Goff to do one thing: don't turn the ball over.

So really this would be like getting married and then for two years doing the one thing your wife asks you not to do, then wondering why she kicks you to the curb

 

[Merlin]

It's a legit criticism that maybe the system is TOO hard on QBs, but it also is a system that when run with excellent execution is really prolific.

Yeah the verbiage is terrible. Looking at the way the different systems encode information I think it's the least efficient verbiage. For a rookie coming in who has never been exposed to it, that has to be kind of rough.

Here's a cool article on the EP system and it does some comparisons and whatnot: https://grantland.com/features/how-...helped-maintain-dominance-tom-brady-patriots/

 

[CGI_Ram]

I felt the same as Memphis.

I'm sure many of us have managed people and one of the biggest things is that in a performance review, nothing should be a surprise. In a way this trade represents a negative review, and Goff seems surprised.

That leads to a question: after all the multi turnover games, do you believe McVay addressed them with Jared? If so, this flat out shouldn't be a surprise. And I have to think he addressed it, because he called him out publicly, which to me suggests that Goff wasn't receptive in private and McVay was out of ideas.

You brought up Gurley which is an interesting comparison. McVay NEVER criticized TG publicly and even flat out lied to all of us in a way about his knee injury. Probably knowing that we were going to cut him in the off-season for most of 2019.

So what was different between Gurley and Goff? Why would McVay essentially lie to protect Gurley but call Goff out publicly? We don't know but the only thing that makes sense is that Goff didn't respond to his feedback. Only reason he would go public too.

So this comment from Goff shows an extreme lack of self awareness IMO. Any professional athletes that bad a year like him, at any position, should be thinking "I'm in trouble".

You could be right on all that. Yeah.

What I find odd... these guys have been working together for 4yrs... tons of hours. How there are any communication issues I can’t wrap my head around.

 

[FrantikRam]

You could be right on all that. Yeah.

What I find odd... these guys have been working together for 4yrs... tons of hours. How there are any communication issues I can’t wrap my head around.

Really doesn't make sense because McVay actually puts an emphasis on it. Beyond what I've heard from other coaches. Like with Morris - he used the phrase "excellent communicator".

Seems very likely that if anything, McVay was over communicating.

 

[Mackeyser]

I felt the same as Memphis.

I'm sure many of us have managed people and one of the biggest things is that in a performance review, nothing should be a surprise. In a way this trade represents a negative review, and Goff seems surprised.

That leads to a question: after all the multi turnover games, do you believe McVay addressed them with Jared? If so, this flat out shouldn't be a surprise. And I have to think he addressed it, because he called him out publicly, which to me suggests that Goff wasn't receptive in private and McVay was out of ideas.

You brought up Gurley which is an interesting comparison. McVay NEVER criticized TG publicly and even flat out lied to all of us in a way about his knee injury. Probably knowing that we were going to cut him in the off-season for most of 2019.

So what was different between Gurley and Goff? Why would McVay essentially lie to protect Gurley but call Goff out publicly? We don't know but the only thing that makes sense is that Goff didn't respond to his feedback. Only reason he would go public too.

So this comment from Goff shows an extreme lack of self awareness IMO. Any professional athletes that bad a year like him, at any position, should be thinking "I'm in trouble".

Agree.

WRT Gurley, may also be that there was nothing they could do. The knee was what it was. Gurley was still nails in pass pro and personally, I never questioned Gurley's drive to perform. He just couldn't cut on that knee... and you can't only run to one side.