We have to draft Winston

[blackbart]

There's one...now look around the league and the majority of the starting QBs are early draft picks. In fact, I'll bet that there are good players at every single position throughout history that have been taken at every round in the draft, or undrafted...so should teams just decide to look in the late rounds and screw the first round just because you can get lucky?

Yeah that is exactly what it means

 

[jrry32]

Sorry but I watched that game. Yes ND was coming after him but the FSU line was picking it up the most of the game and when they got to Jameis, he threw up some real jump balls and a VERY ugly INT - an INT that you don't want to see your starting QB throwing that deep in your end of the field. And on several of his completions downfield, the receiver either makes an outstanding catch or has no one within at least 5 yards. I also noted that he flushed from the pocket fairly readily even when he had a pocket to step up into.

I know you really like Jameis. He certainly has the size and strength but he makes some real questionable plays. In that ND game, he should have been picked 3 times. And as teams have started to figure him out a bit, he has gone from a 4-1 TD to INT ratio to a 2-1. I think in the NFL, teams will play him with hidden coverages designed to get him to revert to his instincts. If he is unable to play a wide open game, I think he will have some rough sledding at the next level.

FSU's line was not picking it up most of the game. I didn't chart it but I'd bet he was pressured on 40% to 50% of his drop-backs.(especially if you don't count pas

He should have been picked 3 times? Name them please. You have the INT and then you have the Karlos Williams pass(even then, that ball was risky but saying it should have been picked was a stretch...he trusted his receiver and put the ball in the right spot). Beyond that, I don't know what else you'd be referring to.

I don't agree with you either on his completions. He threw 3 or 4 passes in the intermediate or deep range into tight windows and completed them. Two were outstanding catches but that's the WR's job. Winston had a limited window and put it in the right spot. It forced the WR to make a tough grab but that's what it's like in the NFL. Throws like that should be commended.

He flushed from the pocket when necessary. He also showed the willingness to stand tall and deliver. He showed the ability to climb the ladder and deliver passes when necessary as well.

Yes, he does make questionable plays. His decision making needs to improve. But he also makes plays that just are unreal for a college QB. That pass to Bobo Wilson that forced Bobo to make a leaping catch on the ball behind him was one of the best passes you'll see from a college QB. Yes, it forced his WR to make an outstanding catch but Winston had a very limited window to fit that ball in because he was throwing between levels of the defense. That was a NFL throw.

 

[A55VA6]

Wish we could get Mariota but we'd have to trade up to get him..

 

[V3]

Every year I hear people say you can find QB's later in the draft. Sure, but you're going to have to eat four-leaf clovers and poop horseshoes to find a good one. The odds of finding a franchise QB after the first round drop DRAMATICALLY. Taking a QB at the top is going to be risky but that's rewarded due to the importance of the position if you hit. All those later round QB's that people have been talking about the past year or two are starting show flaws(Wilson excluded, sadly). Foles, Kraperdick, Cousins, and Dalton are showing that they aren't elite. Of the elite QB's, Brady, Wilson, and Brees are the only top QB's(IMO) taken after the 1st round. Now look at all the draft picks that have transpired between the time those three were selected. Those players are INCREDIBLY RARE! Some might throw in Romo(meh) but it's still rare to find those later round top QB's. IMO, it's so hard that it's almost not worth taking them...though, I don't really mind too much after the 4th.

So if the Rams are going to draft a QB, take one in the first. I'm tired of mediocre QB's. I don't want a game manager. I want to be perennial playoff contenders for a decade and that's what an elite QB does for your team.

 

[Sum1]

Every year I hear people say you can find QB's later in the draft. Sure, but you're going to have to eat four-leaf clovers and poop horseshoes to find a good one. The odds of finding a franchise QB after the first round drop DRAMATICALLY. Taking a QB at the top is going to be risky but that's rewarded due to the importance of the position if you hit. All those later round QB's that people have been talking about the past year or two are starting show flaws(Wilson excluded, sadly). Foles, Kraperdick, Cousins, and Dalton are showing that they aren't elite. Of the elite QB's, Brady, Wilson, and Brees are the only top QB's(IMO) taken after the 2nd round. Now look at all the draft picks that have transpired between the time those three were selected. Those players are INCREDIBLY RARE! Some might throw in Romo(meh) but it's still rare to find those later round top QB's. IMO, it's so hard that it's almost not worth taking them...though, I don't really mind too much after the 4th.

So if the Rams are going to draft a QB, take one in the first. I'm tired of mediocre QB's. I don't want a game manager. I want to be perennial playoff contenders for a decade and that's what an elite QB does for your team.

Exactly...you can also score a date with a model...doesn't mean it WILL happen though.

 

[moklerman]

Every year I hear people say you can find QB's later in the draft. Sure, but you're going to have to eat four-leaf clovers and poop horseshoes to find a good one. The odds of finding a franchise QB after the first round drop DRAMATICALLY. Taking a QB at the top is going to be risky but that's rewarded due to the importance of the position if you hit. All those later round QB's that people have been talking about the past year or two are starting show flaws(Wilson excluded, sadly). Foles, Kraperdick, Cousins, and Dalton are showing that they aren't elite. Of the elite QB's, Brady, Wilson, and Brees are the only top QB's(IMO) taken after the 1st round. Now look at all the draft picks that have transpired between the time those three were selected. Those players are INCREDIBLY RARE! Some might throw in Romo(meh) but it's still rare to find those later round top QB's. IMO, it's so hard that it's almost not worth taking them...though, I don't really mind too much after the 4th.

So if the Rams are going to draft a QB, take one in the first. I'm tired of mediocre QB's. I don't want a game manager. I want to be perennial playoff contenders for a decade and that's what an elite QB does for your team.

The problem is, you can't just rely on percentages. To find an elite QB in any round is rare. Leaf/Manning is a perfect example. Just because the Rams could use a QB doesn't mean drafting one in the first round is the answer. The player has to fit the scheme and you still have to get lucky.

 

[LACHAMP46]

The risk in taking a first round ANYTHING is not as costly due to the new CBA....Winston should be the QB we target on talent, if all the homework done by the Snisher is clear...I trust the FO to do whats right, and route for all these picks...

Free Mark Barron & Mo Alexander.....

 

[rickrawk]

YES to Mariota, NO to Winston. That is all.

GO RAMS!!!!

 

[RamsFan14]

On the plus side, none of us could complain about the Rams not getting press. If they draft Winston, they'll get non-stop press. It'll be like the Jets.

Very true my friend lol, that's a positive. Who would you compare Mariota and Winston to in the NFL? I just want to get an idea of there skill set with someone I'm familiar with, I don't watch much college football anymore lol. Idk much about Mariota, I know a decent amount on Winston however lol... Not counting the off the field issues with him (shocking, right? lol). I haven't seen Mariota play live football before... Just youtube once or twice

 

[RamWoodie]

To the OP...whatever you're smoking...IT'S POWERFUL STUFF!!!

Look back in history at FSU QBs and try and understand why they don;t fare well in the NFL!!!

If you ask me Winston is JaMarcus Russell waiting to repeat...PUT THAT DOWN!!!

 

[jrry32]

Very true my friend lol, that's a positive. Who would you compare Mariota and Winston to in the NFL? I just want to get an idea of there skill set with someone I'm familiar with, I don't watch much college football anymore lol. Idk much about Mariota, I know a decent amount on Winston however lol... Not counting the off the field issues with him (shocking, right? lol). I haven't seen Mariota play live football before... Just youtube once or twice

I had compared Mariota to Alex Smith with a lot more physical talent but I'm rethinking my stance on him right now. I see Jameis Winston as very similar to Ben Roethlisberger.

 

[RamFan503]

FSU's line was not picking it up most of the game. I didn't chart it but I'd bet he was pressured on 40% to 50% of his drop-backs.(especially if you don't count pas

He should have been picked 3 times? Name them please. You have the INT and then you have the Karlos Williams pass(even then, that ball was risky but saying it should have been picked was a stretch...he trusted his receiver and put the ball in the right spot). Beyond that, I don't know what else you'd be referring to.

I don't agree with you either on his completions. He threw 3 or 4 passes in the intermediate or deep range into tight windows and completed them. Two were outstanding catches but that's the WR's job. Winston had a limited window and put it in the right spot. It forced the WR to make a tough grab but that's what it's like in the NFL. Throws like that should be commended.

He flushed from the pocket when necessary. He also showed the willingness to stand tall and deliver. He showed the ability to climb the ladder and deliver passes when necessary as well.

Yes, he does make questionable plays. His decision making needs to improve. But he also makes plays that just are unreal for a college QB. That pass to Bobo Wilson that forced Bobo to make a leaping catch on the ball behind him was one of the best passes you'll see from a college QB. Yes, it forced his WR to make an outstanding catch but Winston had a very limited window to fit that ball in because he was throwing between levels of the defense. That was a NFL throw.

I'm not saying he didn't make some good to very good throws. But that doesn't put him in rare company for me. I look at what he does when he is under REAL pressure - not when he FEELS the pressure that IMO wasn't there on several occasions. And I would say that you'd be hard pressed to show he was under anything more than normal pressure on anywhere near 40 - 50% of his drop backs.

One of the potential INTs was when he absolutely threw the ball up for grabs in the middle of the field when he was pressured. Very little doubt that is an INT in the NFL. But the DBs were playing the receivers and not even looking for the ball. The other one was simply dropped by the defender when he threw into coverage. There was actually another one that had the defender turned around, was a possible pick 6 but I's have to look again.

Does Jameis have elite potential? Certainly. But does he also try some real head scratchers that would never fly against NFL talent? Yes. Does he have a very good team around him? Yes. I just happen to think some of his faults are getting exposed and in the NFL, he won't be such a physical phenom.

I of course reserve the right to eat crow if he blows up the NFL but as of right now, I have a lot of reservations with both his ability to truly anticipate a defense and his character concerns I think are valid as a piece to how I would evaluate him coming to the next level. His off field issues may be somewhat trivial in nature (not counting the assault allegations) but they are stupid ass things and IMO show a real lack of belief in personal accountability.

 

[Boffo97]

To me, you "have to" draft someone if there is a high chance of NFL success. I don't see that in Winston due to character issues.

There's as much or bigger argument that we CANNOT draft Winston.

He seems like one of those picks where if this was Madden, and estimation of on field talent was the only thing that mattered, it'd be a no brainer to pick him. But that's not how real life football works. With that maturity level, an "black eye to the organization" level total bust seems very possible.

 

[RamsOfCastamere]

His off the field issues are largely exaggerated if the assault case is thrown out.

Dude, sick profile! One of the best series I've ever watched

 

[RamFan503]

The risk in taking a first round ANYTHING is not as costly due to the new CBA....Winston should be the QB we target on talent, if all the homework done by the Snisher is clear...I trust the FO to do whats right, and route for all these picks...

True if you are not trading several draft picks for the opportunity or turning down several draft picks to some other team. If we are in a position to pull a trade ala the RG3 trade and would be giving up multiple high draft picks to get into the bidding for a QB, does anyone think that wouldn't do deep damage to our team if that player isn't truly elite at the next level?

I agree though that I do trust the FO to do what is right. Maybe because I think the chances of them making that kind of a trade up has about the chance of a snowball in hell.

 

[jrry32]

I'm not saying he didn't make some good to very good throws. But that doesn't put him in rare company for me. I look at what he does when he is under REAL pressure - not when he FEELS the pressure that IMO wasn't there on several occasions. And I would say that you'd be hard pressed to show he was under anything more than normal pressure on anywhere near 40 - 50% of his drop backs.

What do you mean by normal pressure?

The plays he made in that game did put him in rare company for me. I'll show you why:

View: http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:11725464


View: http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:11725472

On both passes, Notre Dame runs a zone and forces Winston to throw between the levels. In both instances, he puts the ball between two underneath zone defenders to his WR who has an additional defender over the top. Those are NFL throws.


View: http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:11725546

This is one time where he did flush unnecessarily but that throw was gorgeous.


View: http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:11725737

Probably his best play of the game...unblocked blitzer and he throws the ball before his WR makes his break to the perfect spot.


View: http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:11725751

Great throw in terms of ball placement...can't defend the deep out low and away from the defender.

One of the potential INTs was when he absolutely threw the ball up for grabs in the middle of the field when he was pressured. Very little doubt that is an INT in the NFL. But the DBs were playing the receivers and not even looking for the ball. The other one was simply dropped by the defender when he threw into coverage. There was actually another one that had the defender turned around, was a possible pick 6 but I's have to look again.

When did that happen at? I'm not recalling this but I am getting old and senile.

The ball in the middle of the field was a play where he was hit as he released it. That's not really a fair indicator. That happens to any and every QB. It's not like he threw it inaccurately or made a poor decision. I don't consider those type of plays as a negative.

Does Jameis have elite potential? Certainly. But does he also try some real head scratchers that would never fly against NFL talent? Yes. Does he have a very good team around him? Yes. I just happen to think some of his faults are getting exposed and in the NFL, he won't be such a physical phenom.

I of course reserve the right to eat crow if he blows up the NFL but as of right now, I have a lot of reservations with both his ability to truly anticipate a defense and his character concerns I think are valid as a piece to how I would evaluate him coming to the next level. His off field issues may be somewhat trivial in nature (not counting the assault allegations) but they are stupid ass things and IMO show a real lack of belief in personal accountability.

He's a gunslinger type. Has an unreal arm, though. If you clean up his lower body mechanics and work on shortening his release, his arm strength will rival Kaepernick. Guys throws in the mid 90s in the baseball and can absolutely rip some passes in there.

I gotta disagree with you on him not anticipating the defense. He makes some really dumb decisions but he also shows the ability to read the defense and exploit their scheme.

 

[Athos]

Again, I don't think I could be a Rams fan anymore if we drafted Winston.

Mariota or bust.

 

[RamFan503]

What do you mean by normal pressure?

The plays he made in that game did put him in rare company for me. I'll show you why:

View: http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:11725464


View: http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:11725472

On both passes, Notre Dame runs a zone and forces Winston to throw between the levels. In both instances, he puts the ball between two underneath zone defenders to his WR who has an additional defender over the top. Those are NFL throws.


View: http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:11725546

This is one time where he did flush unnecessarily but that throw was gorgeous.


View: http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:11725737

Probably his best play of the game...unblocked blitzer and he throws the ball before his WR makes his break to the perfect spot.


View: http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=espn:11725751

Great throw in terms of ball placement...can't defend the deep out low and away from the defender.



When did that happen at? I'm not recalling this but I am getting old and senile.

The ball in the middle of the field was a play where he was hit as he released it. That's not really a fair indicator. That happens to any and every QB. It's not like he threw it inaccurately or made a poor decision. I don't consider those type of plays as a negative.



He's a gunslinger type. Has an unreal arm, though. If you clean up his lower body mechanics and work on shortening his release, his arm strength will rival Kaepernick. Guys throws in the mid 90s in the baseball and can absolutely rip some passes in there.

I gotta disagree with you on him not anticipating the defense. He makes some really dumb decisions but he also shows the ability to read the defense and exploit their scheme.

I'll tell you what Jrry. I' going to opt out of conversations with you right now. I think it would be better that way.

 

[FarNorth]

Okay now hear me out, this is difficult for a university of Miami fan to say but we have to draft this knucklehead. After what I saw yesterday out of Davis he has no chance to be a franchise quarterback. He will never take a team to the playoffs with his noodle arm and nor will Bradford.

Winston is once of the dumbest kids I've seen in a while. Johnny football is up there, but Winston makes some decisions off the field that make you scratch your head. IMO he has huge maturity issues like a lot of these big name young kids, but it seems like he doesn't care or have remorse about the bad decisions he's made. This is definitely a problem.

All that said, he is a far superior prospect than johnny football. If Winston was a "perfect" student athlete he would be the 1st pick of the upcoming draft without a doubt.

I feel like his talent is too great to pass up. As bad of a kid this is, I think like a lot of "bad kids" (janoris) in college learn, when you get to the business of the NFL that's exactly what it is, a business. And with all his shortcomings you have to give this kid credit, he is a great leader and motivator on the field. Even more than that hes a winner. There are few people that when you watch you know they have that something you can't see. This competitiveness or clutchness that separates the good from the elite. I feel like he has this characteristic.

With all the off the field attention he receives and negative press he compartamentalizes better than most kids I've ever seen at his age. He does this and goes out and wins game. Down late against a big opponent, don't worry because this kid will lead you to a win.

With Jeff fishers affinity to draft talent even when it has red flags, I feel like it would be a better fit than with most other teams. He's shown that with janoris, pacman, etc. he will take a chance. If he can help this kid mature and focus on football only I feel like he could be great for us.

 

[FarNorth]

Sorry, but drafting a knucklehead like JW is one of the worst ideas I've heard for improving this franchise. How about the best outside linebacker we can get instead?