Watch: Chris Simms ATTEMPTING to scout Goff

[NateDawg122]

Film Room with Chris Simms: Breaking Down Top QB Draft Prospect Jared Goff | Bleacher Report
Film Room with Chris Simms: Breaking Down Top QB Draft Prospect Jared Goff | Bleacher Report (via http://ble.ac/teamstream-) http://teamstre.am/1T9tHXO

If you enjoy watching somebody who has no idea what they're talking about try to scout a player, enjoy this link.

Simms has serious concerns about Goff's "shaky mechanics" and "wobbly throws" but clearly has no idea what he's talking about when looking at the film. This is exactly why people can't take BR seriously. The whole site is a joke.

 

[DaveFan'51]

After reading your post, I'll pass on the link!!

 

[Faceplant]

Wow, this kid is as much of a dullard as his father....

 

[Mackeyser]

Actually, he got it right.

Goff has a hitch in his mechanics that I described months ago. And it affects his ability to apply spin to the ball.

It's NOT his small hand size that's causing him to not be able to spin the ball, it's the hitch in his throwing motion. The common notion is that small hand size, in addition to ball security issues, make it difficult for a QB to throw the deep ball because they cannot apply the optimal spin velocity to maintain a tight spiral. Which is why the rule of thumb is a 9 inch hand.

Goff's hands should be fine. I'm not concerned about that.

I AM concerned about the hitch in his throwing motion which can lead to two REAL problems

1) on a strip sack, with his wrist bent like that, he's asking for a nasty injury. Protecting himself in the pocket means more than having slippery footwork. He won't have time to rework that throwing motion much his first season, but thankfully, Throwing motion King, Tom House, works at USC, works with Tom Brady and other NFL QBs and Goff wouldn't even have to take a plane to work with the best at fixing his biggest mechanical issue.

2) While not "weak armed" like Pat Haden or currently Teddy Bridgewater, when a defense has film that there's any kind of ball a QB can't throw or can only throw one way, that gives a defense an advantage. Goff's deep ball, 40+ in the air, isn't on a rope. It's lofted with a draw at the end. As a Rams fan, our defense FEASTS on those kinds of deep balls, so we've seen it. And while he's got very good footwork, I think the pre-draft hype has him having Pro-Bowl level footwork prior to ever playing a down and that's just not true. He's a very good PROSPECT. He's going to have to meld better footwork AND get that hitch out of his throwing motion if is going to be anything more than an okay QB with excellent processing. I mean at this point, he could be a decent QB who can get to his third read, but allows defenses to shrink the field. OR...if he works on these things...in a few years he could be an exceptional QB.

But he's not an exceptional pro QB now and won't be Game 1 of this year if he starts. That's asking too much and setting him up to fail. Why do that?

 

[tahoe]

Hes not wrong...

 

[tahoe]

Actually, he got it right.

Goff has a hitch in his mechanics that I described months ago. And it affects his ability to apply spin to the ball.

It's NOT his small hand size that's causing him to not be able to spin the ball, it's the hitch in his throwing motion. The common notion is that small hand size, in addition to ball security issues, make it difficult for a QB to throw the deep ball because they cannot apply the optimal spin velocity to maintain a tight spiral. Which is why the rule of thumb is a 9 inch hand.

Goff's hands should be fine. I'm not concerned about that.

I AM concerned about the hitch in his throwing motion which can lead to two REAL problems

1) on a strip sack, with his wrist bent like that, he's asking for a nasty injury. Protecting himself in the pocket means more than having slippery footwork. He won't have time to rework that throwing motion much his first season, but thankfully, Throwing motion King, Tom House, works at USC, works with Tom Brady and other NFL QBs and Goff wouldn't even have to take a plane to work with the best at fixing his biggest mechanical issue.

2) While not "weak armed" like Pat Haden or currently Teddy Bridgewater, when a defense has film that there's any kind of ball a QB can't throw or can only throw one way, that gives a defense an advantage. Goff's deep ball, 40+ in the air, isn't on a rope. It's lofted with a draw at the end. As a Rams fan, our defense FEASTS on those kinds of deep balls, so we've seen it. And while he's got very good footwork, I think the pre-draft hype has him having Pro-Bowl level footwork prior to ever playing a down and that's just not true. He's a very good PROSPECT. He's going to have to meld better footwork AND get that hitch out of his throwing motion if is going to be anything more than an okay QB with excellent processing. I mean at this point, he could be a decent QB who can get to his third read, but allows defenses to shrink the field. OR...if he works on these things...in a few years he could be an exceptional QB.

But he's not an exceptional pro QB now and won't be Game 1 of this year if he starts. That's asking too much and setting him up to fail. Why do that?

Great analysis, better than Simms'!

 

[RAMpage28]

Doesn't seem like a major project. Just a seemingly simple fix and it adds to his velocity and a tighter spiral.

Got no doubt that if either of these QBs is shown a problem in their game and are told how to fix it, that they'll put in the time and get it right.

 

[Mackeyser]

A hitch in a throwing motion?

Actually, some can never correct it no matter how many reps they take. A hitch is a MAJOR issue and it's dangerous to think it's a simple fix.

A baseball pitching prospect with a hitch in his throwing motion is seriously devalued due to a number of factors. A batter with a hitch in his swing for not dissimilar reasons. Football doesn't have many instances where that translates because fluidity in football doesn't have many isolated moments like in baseball. There's a QB's throwing motion and a kicker's kicking motion. Although cornerbacks without fluid hips or a hitch in their rotation find that they don't change direction as quickly and that affects a player's ability to play the position and their value. That's pretty much it.

But those still apply. What it requires for QBs is a revisiting of the QBs mechanics.

I dunno how bad the hitch is cuz I've never had to fix one. I just noticed that he c0cks his wrist pretty distinctly and it affects his throws and at the next level will affect his ball security. I know because of how much I used to read about baseball that fixing mechanics is and always has been a scary place. Almost like changing a golfer's swing (which is why the entire Golf world freaked out when Tiger changed his swing). Tom House is a throwing mechanics expert...probably among the best if not the best in the entire world and he's the pitching coach at USC. He also works with a bunch of QBs including NFL QBs, among them Tom Brady and other top NFL QBs who want to stay on top of their games. While the throwing motions aren't the same, many of the principles apply and things like hitches (bad) and weight transfer, hip explosion and foot placement are worked on (good).

Goff's not a mechanical mess. At least, I don't see that he is.

However, it's just not accurate to not say that he's got a clean, pure throwing motion because he's got a significant defect in his throwing motion. It may amount to very little difference or it may amount to a massive difference at the next level.

Here's hoping that between Fisher, Boras, Groh, Weinke and Goff that they can get it worked out...

 

[So Ram]

Actually, he got it right.

Goff has a hitch in his mechanics that I described months ago. And it affects his ability to apply spin to the ball.

It's NOT his small hand size that's causing him to not be able to spin the ball, it's the hitch in his throwing motion. The common notion is that small hand size, in addition to ball security issues, make it difficult for a QB to throw the deep ball because they cannot apply the optimal spin velocity to maintain a tight spiral. Which is why the rule of thumb is a 9 inch hand.

Goff's hands should be fine. I'm not concerned about that.

I AM concerned about the hitch in his throwing motion which can lead to two REAL problems

1) on a strip sack, with his wrist bent like that, he's asking for a nasty injury. Protecting himself in the pocket means more than having slippery footwork. He won't have time to rework that throwing motion much his first season, but thankfully, Throwing motion King, Tom House, works at USC, works with Tom Brady and other NFL QBs and Goff wouldn't even have to take a plane to work with the best at fixing his biggest mechanical issue.

2) While not "weak armed" like Pat Haden or currently Teddy Bridgewater, when a defense has film that there's any kind of ball a QB can't throw or can only throw one way, that gives a defense an advantage. Goff's deep ball, 40+ in the air, isn't on a rope. It's lofted with a draw at the end. As a Rams fan, our defense FEASTS on those kinds of deep balls, so we've seen it. And while he's got very good footwork, I think the pre-draft hype has him having Pro-Bowl level footwork prior to ever playing a down and that's just not true. He's a very good PROSPECT. He's going to have to meld better footwork AND get that hitch out of his throwing motion if is going to be anything more than an okay QB with excellent processing. I mean at this point, he could be a decent QB who can get to his third read, but allows defenses to shrink the field. OR...if he works on these things...in a few years he could be an exceptional QB.

But he's not an exceptional pro QB now and won't be Game 1 of this year if he starts. That's asking too much and setting him up to fail. Why do that?

Fair enough.

You can see though Jared Goff makes the right reads & for the most part puts it on the money.
- The stat I see is his red zone efficiency is excellent. The Rams have not had that in years. I've seen way to many times in the last 10 years pick 6's the other way in the red zone.
Say what you want about , but the Rams are getting a new young QB.

--NFL fans can say what they want. I don't know how much the value chart has changed in the last 10 years. I just know cap wise select a QB now vs. when Sam Bradford got drafted is Night & day !! --

 

[jrry32]

There are some valid critiques but I didn't consider any of the things he mentioned to be major issues when I evaluated Goff. One thing I do strongly disagree with was his criticism of Goff's footwork. Especially using this play:

https://gifs.com/gif/kRgYPv

That's masterful QBing. Goff side-steps the rush, throws a shoulder-fake in to get the Mike running the wrong direction (which opens up the window for a completion), and then Goff puts the ball in the perfect spot in the open window. Simms said if he had strode more into it, he could have hit his WR in the chest. He didn't want to hit his WR in the chest. That would have either led to a pick by the LB coming in from the left or got his WR clobbered. He purposefully threw it low in the spot he did to protect his WR and put the ball away from the LB into the window he created by faking out the Mike (#47).

And I should also point out that play occurred on 3rd and 13.

 

[Mackeyser]

Yeah...I cringe when I read superlatives like "masterful" when it's about college players. Maybe that's just me.

That said, I was mostly focused on his throwing motion, which is what I commented on.

You can argue with Simms on the ball placement deal...LOL.

 

[jrry32]

Yeah...I cringe when I read superlatives like "masterful" when it's about college players. Maybe that's just me.

That said, I was mostly focused on his throwing motion, which is what I commented on.

You can argue with Simms on the ball placement deal...LOL.

Sorry, man, but this is such a nitpicky complaint. It's an adjective. Who cares?

Would you have a problem if I said "deftly" or "skillfully?"

You brought up the throwing motion months ago. Just not something that bothers me. I can understand why it might bother you.

 

[Mackeyser]

You're studying to be a lawyer. I don't have to tell you that words mean something.

There's a world of difference between masterful and skillful and you know that. There's a difference between Peyton Manning and Jay Cutler. Peyton Manning was a masterful QB. Jay Cutler was (is) skillful. It's a pretty remarkable difference.

Aaron Donald is masterful. Chris Long is skillful. Skillful is fine, but for the #1 overall, I'm sure hoping for masterful, I'm hoping for a LOT more than just skillful.

And, yeah, the throwing motion thing will just bother me and every long flutter will just...annoy me and I'll just grit my teeth, take a deep breath, let it out and then let it go, cuz there's nothing to do about it. He'll fix it or he won't.

 

[NateDawg122]

There are some valid critiques but I didn't consider any of the things he mentioned to be major issues when I evaluated Goff. One thing I do strongly disagree with was his criticism of Goff's footwork. Especially using this play:
https://gifs.com/gif/kRgYPv

That's masterful QBing. Goff side-steps the rush, throws a shoulder-fake in to get the Mike running the wrong direction (which opens up the window for a completion), and then Goff puts the ball in the perfect spot in the open window. Simms said if he had strode more into it, he could have hit his WR in the chest. He didn't want to hit his WR in the chest. That would have either led to a pick by the LB coming in from the left or got his WR clobbered. He purposefully threw it low in the spot he did to protect his WR and put the ball away from the LB into the window he created by faking out the Mike (#47).

And I should also point out that play occurred on 3rd and 13.

That was my biggest issue with his scouting of Goff. Saying that Goff has "shaky mechanics" is pretty outlandish. Does he have things he could work on and fix? Sure. But saying his footwork was bad on that play tells me Simms doesn't really know what he's looking at. And picking one play to say that Goff has a problem with wobbly passes is just plain dumb. EVERY QB has wobbly passes from time to time. It's definitely not a chronic issue for Goff. His spirals tend to be tight in most cases. Examples:

 

[jrry32]

You're studying to be a lawyer. I don't have to tell you that words mean something.

There's a world of difference between masterful and skillful and you know that. There's a difference between Peyton Manning and Jay Cutler. Peyton Manning was a masterful QB. Jay Cutler was (is) skillful. It's a pretty remarkable difference.

Aaron Donald is masterful. Chris Long is skillful. Skillful is fine, but for the #1 overall, I'm sure hoping for masterful, I'm hoping for a LOT more than just skillful.

And, yeah, the throwing motion thing will just bother me and every long flutter will just...annoy me and I'll just grit my teeth, take a deep breath, let it out and then let it go, cuz there's nothing to do about it. He'll fix it or he won't.

Yes, I am studying to be a lawyer. It makes me "skillful" at arguing semantics.

The word skillful is a synonym of masterful.
http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/masterful

You're obsessing over something that's entirely insignificant for no reason at all.

But the good news is that you're getting masterful for the #1 pick. Sit back and enjoy the ride, Mack. SUPER BOWL, HERE WE COME!

 

[leoram]

There's this one former Ram QB that threw mostly wobbly passes. His name was Kurt Warner and I'd bet most people would say he was decidedly better on his worst day than Chris Simms ever was on his best.

Nothing to see here.

Oh, and I still prefer Wentz...

 

[Mackeyser]

Okay... 'tis the season for drunken Kool-Aid Bacchanalias...

Thing is... I don't drink.

So, have at it.

 

[jrry32]

Okay... 'tis the season for drunken Kool-Aid Bacchanalias...

Thing is... I don't drink.

So, have at it.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

I believe the ability to make decisions very quickly, and have them be the right decision, is the hardest thing to do as an NFL QB. Goff is better at that part of his game than anyone since Luck IMO. His pocket awareness and manipulation are also a sign of his quick mental processing. QBs don't have to be the greatest athletes, or throw perfect spirals all the time.. Ever see Brady's combine clips? And as Leo pointed out, Kurt threw his share of wobbling passes. I am not worried about Goff's mechanics. His results with a terrible team are enough proof that his mechanics are not a big problem.

 

[OnceARam]

I'd love to see him break down his own film.