The trenches

[1maGoh]

Why do you assume this? Even though Allen is stronger, he's still smaller than Blythe. I think he will be pushed around by big, power guys just as much.

I don't he improved enough in a year where he was rehabbing and dealing with COVID to be better than Blythe. I'm expecting him to improve from being worst than Blythe to maybe just as good as Blythe.

I am hoping he's better...

He got injured in 2019, rehabbed that year and off season, got covid before the 2020 season, but I can't find anything that says he was injured last year. He was the backup last year, so he practiced for a year against our number 1 defense and worked his ass off in the off season. The way some of you guys talk about him and his injury, you'd think he hasn't been able to suit up for practice, workouts, anything since November of 2019. He spent all last year working on his craft, learning from his mistakes (probably Blythe's too), and trying to get stronger. Maybe it worked. Maybe the year behind Sullivan, the half year starting, the year behind Blythe, and really dedicating himself this off season has made him a serviceable or even decent center. This November will be 2 years since his injury. This training camp was 1 year since he got covid. Those things probably aren't as big of factors as many are making them out to be at this point in time.

I don't know...Do you keep relying on late rounders and UDFA'a that have to develop with a low ceiling? Or do you get Creed Humphrey(s) in the 2nd. who also needs some coaching but the ceiling and learning curve is higher and faster? You never know of course. We all want to win now, but sometimes you have to eat your veggies instead of the coconut cream pie....

A coconut is a fruit... Or a vegetable... Or something. I'm not sure, but it's gross and healthy so coconut cream pie must be good for us.

 

[Psycho_X]

Good rep for Brian Allen at least.


View: https://twitter.com/elitster/status/1428475496703021058?s=21

 

[Dodgersrf]

@VegasRam 's main concern is will he make it to the toilet in time.

.

Your time is coming.

 

[Dodgersrf]

I don't know...Do you keep relying on late rounders and UDFA'a that have to develop with a low ceiling? Or do you get Creed Humphrey(s) in the 2nd. who also needs some coaching but the ceiling and learning curve is higher and faster? You never know of course. We all want to win now, but sometimes you have to eat your veggies instead of the coconut cream pie....

Coconut is a vegetable.

 

[RamsOfCastamere]

He got injured in 2019, rehabbed that year and off season, got covid before the 2020 season, but I can't find anything that says he was injured last year. He was the backup last year, so he practiced for a year against our number 1 defense and worked his ass off in the off season. The way some of you guys talk about him and his injury, you'd think he hasn't been able to suit up for practice, workouts, anything since November of 2019. He spent all last year working on his craft, learning from his mistakes (probably Blythe's too), and trying to get stronger. Maybe it worked. Maybe the year behind Sullivan, the half year starting, the year behind Blythe, and really dedicating himself this off season has made him a serviceable or even decent center. This November will be 2 years since his injury. This training camp was 1 year since he got covid. Those things probably aren't as big of factors as many are making them out to be at this point in time.

A coconut is a fruit... Or a vegetable... Or something. I'm not sure, but it's gross and healthy so coconut cream pie must be good for us.

Ahh you’re right. Mentally I was thinking all of this happened this past offseason instead of a year ago. I’m still skeptical however.

 

[Ballhawk]

At this point I wouldn't be surprised to see Evans be one of the last cuts this preseason. He has been terrible!

 

[XXXIVwin]

Allen & Shelton: These two have always been the best options for McVay. Both have long experience (which matters at this position) playing center. But only Allen has NFL starting experience. In 2019 he played 563 snaps before being injured. In 2020 Kromer demoted Allen to play the markedly inferior Blythe who was a Kromer favorite. Blythe gave up 4 sacks and even more pressures. In approximately half the snaps Allen only gave up one sack and fewer pressures. Simply going back and comparing the blocking of Allen vs Blythe reveals the truth and is part of the reason Kromer lost his job. Allen is the logical choice for compelling reasons. First, he is the only player with starting experience at center which is proved by Corbett is the hardest position to play. In his 2019 starts, he played much better than he was given credit for having done as a first-year starter.

Like all Rams fans, I sure hope Allen has improved enough to become a decent starter.

But saying Allen was decent in 2019 is IMHO off the mark. I actually checked some of the archived threads on Blythe in 2019... just about everyone on ROD was complaining for weeks about Allen's terrible play, and we all noticed marked improvement after Blythe stepped in. McVay said so as well. I forget the exact quote, but McVay commented that Blythe had "settled down the center position", or something to that effect.

You wrote: "In 2020 Kromer demoted Allen to play the markedly inferior Blythe who was a Kromer favorite." Not quite sure where you got the "inside info" that the Rams played a "markedly inferior" player because he was the OL coach's "favorite". IMHO that doesn't pass the smell test.

Again, sure hope that Allen is markedly improved. But I think it's a stretch to say he showed us much in either of the last 2 seasons.

 

[Ballhawk]

Yeah, I'm not convinced that Allen will be even an average center. Of course I'm from the Show Me State!

 

[jjab360]

Like all Rams fans, I sure hope Allen has improved enough to become a decent starter.

But saying Allen was decent in 2019 is IMHO off the mark. I actually checked some of the archived threads on Blythe in 2019... just about everyone on ROD was complaining for weeks about Allen's terrible play, and we all noticed marked improvement after Blythe stepped in. McVay said so as well. I forget the exact quote, but McVay commented that Blythe had "settled down the center position", or something to that effect.

You wrote: "In 2020 Kromer demoted Allen to play the markedly inferior Blythe who was a Kromer favorite." Not quite sure where you got the "inside info" that the Rams played a "markedly inferior" player because he was the OL coach's "favorite". IMHO that doesn't pass the smell test.

Again, sure hope that Allen is markedly improved. But I think it's a stretch to say he showed us much in either of the last 2 seasons.

I was under the impression that everyone on this board was aware of how terrible Allen was in 2019 and that the much maligned Blythe was a notable improvement when he took over. Hence my apprehension when it comes to Brian Allen taking over again, but if he truly has turned the corner physically that would be awesome.

 

[CGI_Ram]

Oline depth looks scary but let's also take into account that Noteboom isn't playing in preseason. Anchrum who's been playing RT mostly but got some work in at guard with the Raiders and he seems to be getting good reviews, even during the preseason.

Yeah. It must be a difficult evaluation process with the shuffling we are doing, and how that effects cohesion.

The coaches must really need to focus on individual play.

 

[Riverumbbq]

I was under the impression that everyone on this board was aware of how terrible Allen was in 2019 and that the much maligned Blythe was a notable improvement when he took over. Hence my apprehension when it comes to Brian Allen taking over again, but if he truly has turned the corner physically that would be awesome.

There's no question that Allen had a poor entry starting at Center in 2019, and things didn't get better as right up until his injury some in the media were projecting him as being in well over his head. Not only were these Allen's first starting NFL snaps, he was replacing 2017 & 2018 veteran starter John Sullivan. The 2019 OL was a bit of a circus with all the injuries and replacements, but we shouldn't forget that Allen was starting his career playing between the likes of Noteboom at LG and Blythe at RG, so his initiation was going to be by fire. When Noteboom was injured, the infamous Jamil Demby finished the game at LG, for the next few games it was the rookie David Edwards at RG with Blythe moving to LG, then following Allen's 9'th start of the season, he's injured, replaced by Blythe, with the newly acquired Austin Corbett taking over and finishing the season at LG. Some baptism ...
Allen was a smallish 6'2" 300lbs. OC back then, he's been credited with looking a lot stronger and having put on some weight for his 2021 training camp campaign, we'll just have to wait and see whether his year & a half hiatus has improved his play, ... but starting between what is now two veteran OG's in Edwards & Corbett should ease his transition. jmo.

 

[So Ram]

Yeah. It must be a difficult evaluation process with the shuffling we are doing, and how that effects cohesion.

The coaches must really need to focus on individual play.

Kevin O’Connell is a smart dude. Carberry was coaching at Stanford.
I think they have an idea of what is going on upfront .

Your talking a new QB as well.This group has already been together for a couple years now.
The question to me is who vets resigned?

 

[Ramstien]

With his time in the NFL and the coaching he is receiving I trust that you will see a marked improvement in his performance.

 

[dang]

By my calculation:
Corbett/Evans>Blythe/Corbett thus Evans> Blythe
Allen/Corbett>Corbett/Evans thus Allen>Evans
Thus Allen>>Blythe
I know…that’s some Brilliant Mind shit!!

 

[oldnotdead]

Hmmm Blythe the only center in the NFL that I've ever seen fall flat on his face trying to pull. He tripped over his own feet. That missed block resulted in a negative yardage run. I guess people didn't notice him standing around in the second level looking lost as well. It's why he isn't a Ram any longer and I doubt he starts in KC as well.

Why people are bemoaning the loss of a backup-level player for a starter is beyond me. Even that practice clip shows Allen controlling his man and Stafford would have had more than enough time to throw. Look how many times Goff couldn't even make his drop before the defense was in his face right up the middle.

I thought the whole idea is to improve the OL. Allen drafted in the 4th round, Edwards in the 5th round, Corbett in the top of the 2nd round, sorry I don't see any UDFA starting. Oh and Corbett was drafted as a center and ended up being benched. Now playing OG for the Rams he's a standout. Noteboom was drafted in the third round. High draft picks have a very high bust rate on the OL. It takes a few years to develop an NFL OL player which is why old school GMs always picked them in rounds 2-5 knowing they needed at least a year to develop. One of the best LT in the league Terron Armstead was a 3rd round pick. I remember a few years ago where there were about 5 tackles taken in the first round with the bulk in the top 10. As far as I know only one maybe two are still playing as OTs. My point is that the OL probably has the highest rate of busts compared to any other unit and takes longer to develop them.

Tremayne Anchrum looks to have the inside track for the RT spot next year and he would be the lowest pick on the OL as a 7th round pick. Teams aren't going to spend a pick earlier than the 6th round for a backup OL player. Most will be UDFAs.

 

[BonifayRam]

I was one who wanted the best center available in this year's draft. But lets try to get into the minds of Snead and McVay. They're in a win now mode. Was there really going to be a center available that could come in and start right away? Without a first round pick? Our first pick was late in the second.

Lets say they do what people have been advocating the past couple years. Draft linemen early and often. What do they do with guys who are still in the progressing phase of their careers? Guys whose problem was inexperience a couple years ago. Do they cut bait and start over? With a new group of inexperienced guys? End up with the same problem they had in 2019?

Looking at that I can see their reasoning. If they were rebuilding I could see it. They would have time to let the youngsters learn and develop into serviceable linemen. But they aren't rebuilding. They don't have the time for that. They went all in and want to win now. They don't want to draft, develop, let them walk and start over every couple years.

It was a no-go snackdaddy from once they saw those thin nice trimmed legs & small petite body of Tutu Atwell they were in love. Just smitten to death......

My position @ this point in time of where they believed the Rams interior OL was going into the draft was wrong. With Corbett, Noteboom & Allen all scheduled for UFA early March & Whitworth retirement along with the other center Coleman Shelton involved in the free agency in highlight it does seem to be poor planning.

The 6-7 Chandler Brewer has struggled big this TC & preseason since being used primarily @ OG instead of OT. Tremayne Anchrum has not been working in the interior from all that I have seen & read. So the interior will certainly be under the microscope. Meanwhile, Atwell bad balky back & all, might get lucky & end up being our 5th wide out ....maybe?

 

[Merlin]

By my calculation:
Corbett/Evans>Blythe/Corbett thus Evans> Blythe
Allen/Corbett>Corbett/Evans thus Allen>Evans
Thus Allen>>Blythe
I know…that’s some Brilliant Mind shit!!

Pretty much. The concerns are valid though seeing as how they were wrong last year with their selected starting 5. And when you get down to it with that whole series of events the failure was due to two steps:

1. The OL coach making a bad call on Boom starting over a better player.
2. No live snaps in preseason for the starters and for the staff to evaluate how the OL plays.

This year they scrubbed the Evans plan after the Dallas scrimmage. This actually gives me hope that they learned from last year. Kromer would not have changed his anointed guys without gameday evidence to the contrary. And he probably needed McVay on his ass too tbh.

For myself this change from Evans is not something I find alarming though. I see it as a good thing that they're looking hard at the OL this year prior to the season. And even if Allen struggles the Rams do have options...

Option 1: Corbs to Center, Anchrum to RG. I have zero doubt Anchrum can play RG. Question is how good is Corbs at Center.

Options 2 and 3 get successively uglier IMO. But the good thing here that Anchrum looks ready to help these guys out if needed.

 

[Hram]

Bobby Evans played terrible in pass protection against Green Bay and just isn't a guard. He needs to be a right tackle only. Do we have room for another player that can only play one position on the OL.

We already have that in Havenstein. And he is just average in pass protection but excellent as a run blocker.

If Evans really can be average or better at RT and Hav departs after this year then the answer is a big maybe.

 

[AvengerRam]

Hmmm Blythe the only center in the NFL that I've ever seen fall flat on his face trying to pull.

"This is, like, the worst video ever."

"Like anyone can even know that, Napoleon."

Regarding the topic at hand... I'm not a fan of questioning the front office on player personnel decisions, but when I see the Packers and Chiefs planning to start the season with rookie centers I was high on pre-draft (Josh Myers, Creed Humphrey), while the Rams' top pick is no better than the #4 or #5 WR on the team right now, I have to scratch my head at the reliance on the OL incumbents.

 

[Loyal]

Several things here, Wisconsin.

First, you should post more. I enjoyed this one greatly and it started a damned good and very timely thread. Well done, sir.

Snead/McVay almost always take skill players that they like over the trenches with their early picks so we shouldn’t be very surprised by Atwell over Humphrey.

I could see the logic of going for it with Atwell over any available OL player when thinking in terms of a 2 year SB window. As you say, we can revisit this pick in 5 years to see how both players work out.

Honestly, I think this Ram OL is at least 7 deep and possibly even more. IOW, even a Creed Humphrey would have been doubtful to see the field this year, anyway.

The more I hear and learn about Atwell the more I like. This kid is small but he is a football player that loves the game, not just a track star. This pick could prove to be a brilliant move with the benefit of hindsight.

As always, we must cooly analyze all personnel moves.......