The real reason Jefferson was drafted

[dieterbrock]

Well I think that was what I was saying??
Woods is singed until 2021,so I think The Rams don’t want to get caught with there pants down by Everett,Kupp,&Reynolds walk next season?
Reynolds from the interview was asked about an extension & he said he was not really thinking about an
extension. That he needed to talk to his agent. I think he could have a real solid breakout type of season.He might be signed to a team friendly deal ???
Jefferson also fills that void created by Sammy Watkins which was then filled by Cooks.

I dont think there is any thought of being "caught with their pants down". They'll deal with who is becoming a FA after the league year. Exception may be Kupp, but we'll see what happens there. Disagree on Reynolds, I think he's playing for his job. *IF* Jefferson were to show big in TC/PS, I wouldn't be surprised to see Reynolds cut as that would be a 2 mill cap save. (Based my understanding that his salary guarantees at beginning of season, which could be incorrect)

 

[dieterbrock]

Has woods outplayed his contract? Yes, is woods unhappy with it? We don't know because he's not the type of guy to put it out there. So by all accounts it's total speculation

Well, I think the unhappiness is speculation, but based on this article he surely is expecting to get paid
“Oh yeah, it’s coming. The work will take care of itself. I’ve been grinding, been trying to let it pay off. The money will be there when its time,” he said.

Robert Woods knows a big raise is in his future: 'It's coming'

Robert Woods commented on his contract situation, having two-plus years left on his deal.

theramswire.usatoday.com

And we made it to the SB without Kupp. Imagine that

But we also dont get there without Cooks...

 

[Angry Ram]

Man, a lot of you are over thinking this.

Here's why he was drafted:

Cooper Kupp: 174 targets first 8 games; 94 targets last 8 games. His snap count was being reduced big time.

Tyler Higbee and Robert Woods, Robert especially were being force fed the ball.

Todd Gurley ineffective, Brandin Cooks hurt.

This team just needed more weapons.

 

[Malibu]

I think the feeling of the FO is this year they wanted to get ahead of the potential losses in FA and make a smooth financial transition with home grown inexpensive options at TE and WR.

When McVay took over the cupbard was bare minus Gurley. They had to spend to increase the productivity of their WRs hence Woods and Cooks. Now we have slot of skill players in house it's time to be fiscally a little more conservative instead of Hurley/Cooks type contracts.

 

[Malibu]

Yes I agree that some of the lack of production from the TE position is due to the lack of targets.

It started before that though. Everett put up 136 against SEA, and was targeted a lot against ATL and PIT. The change to more "12" personnel started in CHI.

BTW he had a big game against Seattle, but he made a couple costly drops one resulting in an interception with 2 mins to go in the 4th quarter which was a killer. A ball he absolutely should have caught. I worry about the guys hands, I never do with Kupp or Woods.

 

[dieterbrock]

Cooper Kupp: 174 targets first 8 games; 94 targets last 8 games. His snap count was being reduced big time.

??
Kupp had 134 targets last season, 283 in 3 year career total

 

[Allen2McVay]

Cooper Kupp: 174 targets first 8 games;

That should have raised an eyebrow when you typed it.

Do you really think it’s reasonable that Kupp was targeted 22 times per game for eight straight games?

 

[Angry Ram]

@Dieter the Brock @Allen2McVay




I may have misquoted it a bit, but still he was targeted A LOT. It's no secret he's Jared's bestie.

 

[shovelpass]

BTW he had a big game against Seattle, but he made a couple costly drops one resulting in an interception with 2 mins to go in the 4th quarter which was a killer. A ball he absolutely should have caught. I worry about the guys hands, I never do with Kupp or Woods.

That was a costly one, he made up for it on the next drive to setup the game winning FG. I don't know much about the other one's but they happen, even WRs like Kupp and Woods drop them. Rewatch the PIT game Kupp has 2-3 flat out drops. Higbee used to have problems with drops if a defender was anywhere near him.

 

[Malibu]

A side issue that arose from this thread is what to do when Kupp and Woods are due new contracts?

The Rams have a multitude of high priced players Goff, AD, Ramsey soon, etc and a bunch coming up. It is not the Rams organizations fault they develop or sign talented players.

The issue in the NFL imo is that I am not a fan of the salary cap vs pay scale of QBs. The QBs agents and market demand is such that talented QBs get exhorbanately paid and take up too much of the cap which hurts resigning or signing new FAs to better a team. I think maybe the QBs salary should count 50% against the cap which then would bring them in line with the top paid WRs or DEs in the league. This would free up 15-18m to teams.

Teams that get a rookie QB to perform at a high level on that first contract have a huge advantage especially if those QBs like Dak or Wilson get drafted below the second round. Those teams can really use all that financial savings to grow a team. This is not totally fair imo because the NFL is penalizing good teams for doing a great job at drafting a QB. Those teams were run better, make smarter draft and FA choices, but due to a 30-35m QB contract it becomes much harder to succeed thus having to get rid of players in most cases they wouldn't if having the choice. That to me describes the Rams to a tee. When you add ADs and Goff's contract together (combined with dead cap money on Gurley/Cooks) and a big contract for Ramsey we are being punished for being good.

I know some will say we made bad contracts (Gurley/Cooks) and never should have traded for Ramsey or some posters even suggested not paying Goff (which I feel is ridiculous), but structuring the QB that he doesn't eat up so much space of the cap would be the sensible thing to do in the NFL.

Otherwise what will happen is all players who have alot of value when their contract is up will not get paid and unfortunately they will not get picked up. This off season there are some players like that who clearly have a bunch of great years left, but teams don't want to pay them. We would minimaly get to keep Littleton and Saffold two players my guess the team had to let go that given a little more financial flexibility we wouldn't have.

It just sucks that the team and the player jointly do what they are supposed to do and they are penalized for it. Something needs to change.

 

[OldSchool]

@Dieter the Brock @Allen2McVay




I may have misquoted it a bit, but still he was targeted A LOT. It's no secret he's Jared's bestie.

Simply not accurate unless he's talking about the first half of all 3 seasons vs the second half of all three seasons. If that's the case his wording is terrible. Ahhh I see he's talking about pace and that's being related to what could have or should have been. We're not talking actual numbers here.

 

[Merlin]

@Dieter the Brock @Allen2McVay




I may have misquoted it a bit, but still he was targeted A LOT. It's no secret he's Jared's bestie.

Yeah and I attribute that to Kupp having good size and the ability to get open quickly. Goff knows this and it's why he'll often look to Kupp and I suspect he sometimes ghosts his earlier reads when it doesn't look like a good matchup/leverage for the route for the other guys. Wouldn't fault him for that given his lack of time to throw last season and the fact teams knew the passing game was the only real threat to bust big gainers.

But what is interesting here is if the OL can get back to good pass pro. If that happens we'll be back to 3 wideouts with good route mastery and hands. Dropoff from Cooks to Jefferson will be the deep routes, but it's not like Jefferson doesn't have the raw ability to do that. Improvement from Cooks to Jefferson will be the hands and catch radius.

And I may be underestimating Reynolds here. But I think he's the odd man out. He's not a McVay type wideout IMO.

 

[…..]

We kinda need to see Kupps production this year to determine contract values dont we?

I dont usually follow these money discussions so to me 19m seems excessive.

 

[Angry Ram]

Simply not accurate unless he's talking about the first half of all 3 seasons vs the second half of all three seasons. If that's the case his wording is terrible. Ahhh I see he's talking about pace and that's being related to what could have or should have been. We're not talking actual numbers here.

View attachment 36223

Right, either way the point is that the team needs more weapons, on not just have a double combination of Robert Woods/Cooper Kupp/Tyler Higbee. I do know that Cooper's usage decreased as the year went on. Was it the Bears game where he barely played? Anyway, to me it's more about on-field production than worrying about contracts, and who's staying or going.

 

[leoram]

Drafting Jefferson surprised me. Drafting Aaron Donald and John Johnson III also surprised me. In hindsight, the apparent lack of need at their positions is what made the player selection a surprise.

This is why I say I believe the Rams simply believe Jefferson is an impact player and the other factors discussed here are tertiary. Injuries can derail a season and marginalize a player. Players become too expensive. Depth is a luxury but can also increase flexibility. All these are real factors but again, the real deal here is the Rams believe in this player more than I did when he was drafted.

 

[So Ram]

I dont think there is any thought of being "caught with their pants down". They'll deal with who is becoming a FA after the league year. Exception may be Kupp, but we'll see what happens there. Disagree on Reynolds, I think he's playing for his job. *IF* Jefferson were to show big in TC/PS, I wouldn't be surprised to see Reynolds cut as that would be a 2 mill cap save. (Based my understanding that his salary guarantees at beginning of season, which could be incorrect)

Well your always playing 4 a JoB. Todd Gurley said I just got fired.

Reynolds,Everett & Kupp are all in the same boat.

Time will tell , but as Old school gives you a thumbs up ?? I think The Rams have a different opinion. I’m going by reports & what McSnead are saying. I think that is the best direction to follow. It’s like WAZE, sometimes you just have to trust it even if you don’t always know the way it takes you.

 

[dieterbrock]

Reynolds,Everett & Kupp are all in the same boat.

No, not even close.
Reynolds and Everett are in better play great to get a contract somewhere mode
Kupp is in the better I play the more $$$ I get from anywhere mode

Time will tell , but as Old school gives you a thumbs up ?? I think The Rams have a different opinion. I’m going by reports & what McSnead are saying. I think that is the best direction to follow. It’s like WAZE, sometimes you just have to trust it even if you don’t always know the way it takes you.

Reports? What McNead said? Like when they said Gurley is 100%? That Cooks will be back in 2020? Yeah, ok.
Nothing has been said, other than the 2 biggest needs the Rams have was at RB and WR

 

[Corbin]

So we aren’t resigning Woods now, I thought it was we weren’t resigning Kupp?

Smh

People.

 

[dieterbrock]

Simply not accurate unless he's talking about the first half of all 3 seasons vs the second half of all three seasons. If that's the case his wording is terrible. Ahhh I see he's talking about pace and that's being related to what could have or should have been. We're not talking actual numbers here.

View attachment 36223

2017 6.26 Target per game
2018 7 Target per game
2019 8.4 Target per game
I'm not seeing anything strange about a player developing in his first 3 years. 2 more targets per game from his rookie year?

 

[FarNorth]

Simply not accurate unless he's talking about the first half of all 3 seasons vs the second half of all three seasons. If that's the case his wording is terrible. Ahhh I see he's talking about pace and that's being related to what could have or should have been. We're not talking actual numbers here.

View attachment 36223

A poorly explained statistical projection by Holloway.

On pace for 174 appears to mean for the whole season, as projected from the first eight games. It appears that Kupp actually had half of that projected total, or 87 targets, for the first eight games. Same thing for second half of season: "pace" for full season of 94 targets means actual second eight game total of half that, or 47 actual targets.

87+ 47= 134 actual targets for the year.