Something I noticed regarding Gurley

[DR RAM]

Our linemen aren't even running the right way on some plays, causing other linemen to trip over them. And as far as Gurley being patient, he can't even take a step passed the line of scrimmage, on average, without being hit. That frustrates patience. Patience is for allowing holes to be created for him to run through, not for allowing five unblocked defenders to come crashing through.
I wonder if this o line has been working a lot more on pass protection that run blocking? They are very good at pass protection, where last year they weren't. Now the run blocking is improving from where it was in week one and two, but is still sub par. If this is true then could this have been Fishers plan for starting a rookie QB?

It's starting to get a little better, and it's not always the same guy, but one guy misses a block on every play, however, there are yards to be had on some of those plays. I'm sure, as you say, he is very frustrated, and he's not hiding it very well either.

 

[-X-]

It's starting to get a little better, and it's not always the same guy, but one guy misses a block on every play, however, there are yards to be had on some of those plays. I'm sure, as you say, he is very frustrated, and he's not hiding it very well either.

I miss your O-line write-ups, man.
Now get to work.

Chop chop.

 

[Bruce2980]

It's starting to get a little better, and it's not always the same guy, but one guy misses a block on every play, however, there are yards to be had on some of those plays. I'm sure, as you say, he is very frustrated, and he's not hiding it very well either.

Yes it is getting better, I think the coaches have been doing a lot more pass blocking originally, to allow a rookie to survive, and are now working more on run blocking?

 

[DR RAM]

I miss your O-line write-ups, man.
Now get to work.

Chop chop.

Thanks.

Ughhh, not enough energy anymore, but I still see it. I can tell you this, some of these running plays are either, not well designed, or one guy completely blows his assignment, and without knowing the offense that well yet, like I used to, I can't tell you which one it is, besides the obvious ones. It could very well be both, and until these guys put more reps together, they aren't going to be great. They need to communicate and execute together a lot better than they are doing now. I see more mental errors, than being inept physically.

I don't know if this whole running coordinator, and passing coordinator stuff works, or how it is hashed out. Just another thing that seems too complicated, when you switch out of a pass, for instance.

 

[fearsomefour]

Keenums girly boy arm doesn't allow him to throw the ball into small windows, and some argue he can't do it in medium sized one either, and he doesn't try. His completion success comes when guys are wide open, like the strike to Quick for a TD. Keenums stats against pressure and blitzes suck. Yes, he did make a nice play knowing he was going to get hit, but there are a lot of QBs that do that all of the time at all levels of football. An accurate QB with a strong arm, kind of like the one that the farm was traded for, in theory, and as shown at the college level, should make on hell of a difference in getting the ball down field and into small windows. You'll see the difference in a short time I am sure.

Not arguing any of that.
Arm strength won't much matter if he is confused by what is going on and doesn't get ball out on time.

 

[Memphis Ram]

What about Sam Bradford and Joe Flacco?

They weren't mentioned in the prior quote, but Flacco could move a bit and his size helps him, too. Bradford? While he's still trying to prove himself, he looked far better than Goff during his rookie preseason.

Your claim that Goff not being ready is on the coaching staff seems as if you see these guys as robots to me. Everybody doesn't grow / learn at the same speed.

 

[jrry32]

They weren't mentioned in the prior quote, but Flacco could move a bit and his size helps him, too. Bradford? While he's still trying to prove himself, he looked far better than Goff during his rookie preseason.

Your claim that Goff not being ready is on the coaching staff seems as if you see these guys as robots to me. Everybody doesn't grow / learn at the same speed.

Goff can move a bit too. Every bit as well as Flacco.

My claim that Goff not being "ready" is on the coaching staff isn't based on every player growing and learning at the same speed. It's based on the fact that other coaching staffs find a way to get their QB up to speed.(whether that's tailoring the offense, simplifying the scheme, tossing the QB into the fire, etc.) Ours somehow didn't.

 

[-X-]

It's based on the fact that other coaching staffs find a way to get their QB up to speed.

Sorry to keep butting into this conversation with you and Memphis, but I think the disconnect here is that Fisher didn't want to "find a way" to get him up to speed in an accelerated manner. He had every intention of just taking his time with him. And he did so because he felt he had that luxury. He didn't want to let Goff take his lumps as he was learning. He wanted Goff to learn and then dish out the lumps. So it's really not a matter of the coaching staff being unable to get their QB up to speed like everyone else. It's just a developmental preference. I'm sure if Keenum got hurt in week one, that Goff would have started the Tampa game. More than likely. And they would have definitely found a way to get him up to speed before that too.

 

[RamWoodie]

This screaming for Goff is nonsense right now! He not ready...and really I wouldn't be surprised if we didn't see him start a game this year, though he may get to play some. Nothing is holding Gurley back except the Rams passing game! Teams are gonna stack the box until the Rams show a consistent ability to move the ball in the air...and Gurley will get more room to operate.

Goff isn't the answer right now! He has a great arm...BUT..he doesn't have the mental yet.

Actually I don't understand Fisher not suiting up Mannion Sunday because it would make more sense to have Mannion as the true backup. I believe Fisher suits Goff up to help his confidence because Mannion easily outplayed Goff in preseason. Perhaps with the Cards coming up Fisher decided not to suit up Mannion so he has him for the Cards game.

 

[jrry32]

Sorry to keep butting into this conversation with you and Memphis, but I think the disconnect here is that Fisher didn't want to "find a way" to get him up to speed in an accelerated manner. He had every intention of just taking his time with him. And he did so because he felt he had that luxury. He didn't want to let Goff take his lumps as he was learning. He wanted Goff to learn and then dish out the lumps. So it's really not a matter of the coaching staff being unable to get their QB up to speed like everyone else. It's just a developmental preference. I'm sure if Keenum got hurt in week one, that Goff would have started the Tampa game. More than likely. And they would have definitely found a way to get him up to speed before that too.

And that's my complaint. Because I think the team would have been better for it if he did. However, that's simply an opinion. Everybody has their own.

 

[gabriel18]

And that's my complaint. Because I think the team would have been better for it if he did. However, that's simply an opinion. Everybody has their own.

Agreed . Why take the kid #1 and not get him ready to start week 1 ? Nobody does it that way in today's game . My biggest worry is the pressure is mounting on the kid the more he sees all the success of the other rookies that are playing . Of course that's just my opinion.

 

[Amitar]

I was looking at QB stats last night and took a look at Keenum's stats.
Stat & Rank
Rating #31
PCT #32
ATT #27
Yds/A #31
TD T#27

I still would not start Goff though. I would start Mannion and see what he has got to offer.

 

[-X-]

And that's my complaint. Because I think the team would have been better for it if he did. However, that's simply an opinion. Everybody has their own.

Fair enough.

 

[blackbart]

If you don't like what I presented in my post, or you think I'm beating a dead horse, you don't have to read on. I'm fine with you disagreeing with me, but I don't see why you have to call my attempt to support my opinion as "lame" because you have a different opinion. I guess I am in the jrry camp in regards to Goff and you're not. Agree to disagree?

Because you misled with your title and there have already been 5000000000000 threads about why Goff isn't playing. :deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse::deadhorse:

And trying to align yourself with jrry to justify it

 

[blackbart]

I meant that putting so much importance on winning now and not getting Goff experience will only delay him that much more next year. At some point when you draft a QB #1 overall, you have to admit that the future is more important than the presence...unless your starter is Brett Favre.

Maybe if the season is already in the crapper but until that point to quote Herm, "You play to win the game!"

 

[blackbart]

These are game management numbers. They'll never headline Sportscenter. They'll never be the lead story. But as long as Ws come out the other side, who cares? If our D shores up some things, this works more often than not. Gurley's numbers will continue to get better if this O keeps improving. When Goff is ready, this O really takes flight. I just think Fisher doesn't want to crash on takeoff.

Passing CP/AT YDS TD INT
C. Keenum 14 26 190 2 1
Rushing ATT YDS TD LG
T. Gurley 27 85 2 16

Third Down Efficiency 6/13

And don't forget the 5 drops, 2 by Britt, 2 by Kendrick and 1 by Austin. That makes those numbers quite a bit better.

 

[Memphis Ram]

Goff can move a bit too. Every bit as well as Flacco.

My claim that Goff not being "ready" is on the coaching staff isn't based on every player growing and learning at the same speed. It's based on the fact that other coaching staffs find a way to get their QB up to speed.(whether that's tailoring the offense, simplifying the scheme, tossing the QB into the fire, etc.) Ours somehow didn't.

Have those other coaching staffs really gotten all their QBs up to speed or have they simply inserted them into the lineup to sink or swim due to their draft position and/or lack of options? And, did those other QBs look as lost as Goff seemed to appear in preseason games? And do we know how he was in OTAs, practices, and meetings?

Is it not possible whatsoever that Goff could be on sort of a a Brian Quick type learning curve to the NFL game? Is a coaching staff to blame for all rookies not being ready early? Or is it just Goff?

 

[RamzFanz]

Actually I don't understand Fisher not suiting up Mannion Sunday because it would make more sense to have Mannion as the true backup. I believe Fisher suits Goff up to help his confidence because Mannion easily outplayed Goff in preseason. Perhaps with the Cards coming up Fisher decided not to suit up Mannion so he has him for the Cards game.

I'm hoping he chose Goff because Goff has progressed to earning the number 2 spot. If he chose him as a confidence boost, shame on him for undermining the team. If Mannion is (more) ready and Goff isn't, I hope he does suit up Mannion this week.

Agreed . Why take the kid #1 and not get him ready to start week 1 ? Nobody does it that way in today's game .

Why people think they didn't try to get him ready, baffles me.

And don't forget the 5 drops, 2 by Britt, 2 by Kendrick and 1 by Austin. That makes those numbers quite a bit better.

According to Fisher, there were 4 drops last week alone. I think your numbers are very low. Tavon leads the NFL in dropped passes at 4. Britt and Higbee are tied for 5th at 2 each.

 

[RamWoodie]

I'm hoping he chose Goff because Goff has progressed to earning the number 2 spot. If he chose him as a confidence boost, shame on him for undermining the team. If Mannion is (more) ready and Goff isn't, I hope he does suit up Mannion this week.

I won't deny that's a possibility...but I try to think like Fisher...he knew the Rams success over the Bucs. He also knows the OLine is pretty steady.

I didn't argue with the idea of rotating Mannion and Goff as backups but when you know Mannion has earned the QB2, it's not fair to him to leave him in the cold.

I think we see Mannion as the QB2 Sunday. Sometime coaching is about the bold decision!

Example...despite what the Pats were paying Bledsoe Belicheat made to step to call Brady the starter.

Same thing here...despite drafting Goff at #1 if he's not ready, STAND on your decision and continue to rotate the backups.

 

[Mackeyser]

Watching Carson Wentz and Dak Prescott, they'd certainly make life easier on Gurley. Teams would be far more afraid of them than Keenum. So why not Goff?



You know what does fix those issues? Experience. However, if rookie QBs have shown us anything over the past 5 or so years, it's that those issues often aren't as severe as people believe they are.

Goff providing us with better QB play absolutely opens up running lanes for Gurley. The Rams are second to last in the NFL in every major passing category (passing yards, passing TDs, YPA, and QB Rating). I don't see how Goff makes us any worse.

You're right. However, the one thing all of the successful rookies have in common is a HC/OC that either trims the playbook and expands it as the rookie QB becomes comfortable or simplifies the play calling or SOMETHING to help the rookie acclimate.

Fisher won't do that. He's just that old school. He expects the rookie to get fully up to the level in all aspects of the Vet before displacing him.

That is why Fisher has such an issue getting rookies at certain positions to contribute.

Would Pederson be rocking and rolling with Goff? I dunno, but I think it's certainly reasonable to believe that he'd have found a way to have him ready to be productive.

Wentz, Prescott and Brissett, even, have been productive because of functioning schemes and staffs that are committed to seeing them succeed.

The frustrating part for all of us fans on all sides of the QB debate is that we don't know if we got Aaron Rodgers, Alex Smith...or Matt Barkley. Moreover, it really didn't help that all of the hype COMPLETELY ignored the reality that is Jeff Fisher...which we've seen play out.

1) Goff not only didn't start, but he started out as the 3rd string QB and didn't even dress.
2) The offense, including the nightmarish play_calling nomenclature wasn't simplified in order to both improve game/clock management and to more quickly transition the Xs and Os to the field.
3) There is still no clear rep allocation for the QBs beyond getting the starter ready to play (and not every practice is open) so we don't know how much either young QB is getting actual reps with which string.

Thus, while the hype for Goff may, in the abstract, be totally warranted, it's more than a little frustrating that no one can say what we have in young Goff.

The hype is gone for now because...well, it's football season and hype means nothing and it's all about the scoreboard. Which leaves us Rams fans with??? the reality of Fisher.

I'd love to think that the shackles on this scheme are all a function of the limitations of Keenum, but then what explains the first few years?

Essentially, it seems like Fisher's belligerence is holding Goff back because he has more faith in "his way" than he's committed to getting Goff productive....now. I suppose it's possible that Goff is just that far behind, but it almost seems like they're trying to make him seem lost. And I find it hard to believe that he's THAT far behind.