Rams like do-it-all prospect Scherff/PD

[DaveFan'51]

After running a 5.05 time in the 40, which was fourth-best among the 52 offensive linemen invited to Indy, Scherff’s Combine was finished.

+ his split time was 1.78, not bad for a big guy!

elite player..elite person....at a need position
usually the simpliest solution is the best..question is does he last till #10 and do we stay at #10

He sounds like a 'Plug 'n Play' guy to me!

I like Scherff, but I don't think I'd like him at 10.

That pick would be Peat if he's still there.

I'm not sure about the #10 spot either, but I prefer Scherff over Peat.

 

[jjab360]

Smart money says this guy is our first round pick, it just makes too much sense.

 

[Memento]

Smart money says this guy is our first round pick, it just makes too much sense.

If he's our pick in any round, I'll have lost a ton of faith in our current regime.

 

[jjab360]

If he's our pick in any round, I'll have lost a ton of faith in our current regime.

No offense, but you seem to be so extremely rooted into this one belief without reasoning or analysis, it's hard to take you seriously.

 

[Memento]

No offense, but you seem to be so extremely rooted into this one belief without reasoning or analysis, it's hard to take you seriously.

You want reasoning and analysis? Very well.

He's clearly unable to play tackle at any sort of decent level in college, let alone the NFL. He doesn't have a center's body, which limits him strictly to guard. I highly doubt that he'll be able to function against quicker defensive tackles such as Atkins and McCoy or talented and/or athletic right/left ends that go on stunts against him. He has straight-line speed, functional strength, okay fundamentals, and can get to the second level in the running game. That's it.

His pass-protection has been terrible at Iowa, terrible against below-mediocre players such as the 3-4 defensive ends at Maryland, who gave him absolute fits in the passing game - both bull-rushing and speed-rushing. It was one of the worst performances I've ever seen from a supposed "top-of-the-class offensive lineman", and he doesn't even have the excuse of using inexperience because that was his senior tape. He was a senior, and he got overpowered, overmatched, and beat like a rented mule by a 5'11", 285 lbs. 3-4 end on a horrific defense. What do you think that Kilgo (the nose tackle on the Maryland defensive line, and likely the only real talent that Maryland even had on the defensive side of the ball that year) would have done to him if Scherff was at guard? He's strong in the weight room, sure, but I don't see that strength translating to anything other than run-blocking.

He's extremely top-heavy (which allows bull-rushers to have their way with him), has horrible footwork (which allows speed-rushers to utterly destroy him), can't pull to save his life against quick one-gap penetrators such as Bennett (see OSU vs. Iowa), and he's just not a natural knee-bender like Peat is.

He'll be a guard at the next level, and probably not even a left one. He's not Zack Martin. Not even close because Martin - while he had issues at pass-protection - didn't get horrifically beat like Scherff did. He's not Reiff or Bulaga either. He compares more to his fellow Hawkeye alum, the #2 overall pick of the 2004 NFL draft: Robert Gallery. Gallery was also a weight room warrior and a much better overall athlete than Scherff. He couldn't hack it at tackle and carved himself out a career as a decent left guard. He's still regarded as one of the biggest offensive line busts in that decade (second only to Jason Smith).

But Scherff doesn't have Gallery's overall athleticism. He's strictly - in my honest opinion - a right guard. He'll be a decent right guard at the NFL level, but you won't ever see him make it to Pro-Bowls or the All-Pro teams. You can expect consistency and durability from him, sure, but you're not going to see him dominate NFL linemen. He'll give up more sacks than your average right guard, although he'll be a fantastic addition to the running game; that is, if you're asking him to just lock onto one guy and not have to pull to his left to stop a defensive end.

I would never criticize a prospect this much if I didn't watch a ton of tape on him or see a huge rap sheet. Scherff is a fantastic and an intelligent person, definitely worthy of being selected, but I don't believe for a moment that he's anything more than a third round pick based on his film, and I don't believe for a single heartbeat that we should draft him anywhere in the first two rounds. If you're looking at right guards, he's your guy; that is, if guys like Tomlinson are already gone.

Whatever he did in the Combine doesn't mean shit to me. Gallery and Smith blew up the Combine, too.

 

[mr.stlouis]

Yes

 

[jjab360]

You want reasoning and analysis? Very well.

He's clearly unable to play tackle at any sort of decent level in college, let alone the NFL. He doesn't have a center's body, which limits him strictly to guard. I highly doubt that he'll be able to function against quicker defensive tackles such as Atkins and McCoy or talented and/or athletic right/left ends that go on stunts against him. He has straight-line speed, functional strength, okay fundamentals, and can get to the second level in the running game. That's it.

His pass-protection has been terrible at Iowa, terrible against below-mediocre players such as the 3-4 defensive ends at Maryland, who gave him absolute fits in the passing game - both bull-rushing and speed-rushing. It was one of the worst performances I've ever seen from a supposed "top-of-the-class offensive lineman", and he doesn't even have the excuse of using inexperience because that was his senior tape. He was a senior, and he got overpowered, overmatched, and beat like a rented mule by a 5'11", 285 lbs. 3-4 end on a horrific defense. What do you think that Kilgo (the nose tackle on the Maryland defensive line, and likely the only real talent that Maryland even had on the defensive side of the ball that year) would have done to him if Scherff was at guard? He's strong in the weight room, sure, but I don't see that strength translating to anything other than run-blocking.

He's extremely top-heavy (which allows bull-rushers to have their way with him), has horrible footwork (which allows speed-rushers to utterly destroy him), can't pull to save his life against quick one-gap penetrators such as Bennett (see OSU vs. Iowa), and he's just not a natural knee-bender like Peat is.

He'll be a guard at the next level, and probably not even a left one. He's not Zack Martin. Not even close because Martin - while he had issues at pass-protection - didn't get horrifically beat like Scherff did. He's not Reiff or Bulaga either. He compares more to his fellow Hawkeye alum, the #2 overall pick of the 2004 NFL draft: Robert Gallery. Gallery was also a weight room warrior and a much better overall athlete than Scherff. He couldn't hack it at tackle and carved himself out a career as a decent left guard. He's still regarded as one of the biggest offensive line busts in that decade (second only to Jason Smith).

But Scherff doesn't have Gallery's overall athleticism. He's strictly - in my honest opinion - a right guard. He'll be a decent right guard at the NFL level, but you won't ever see him make it to Pro-Bowls or the All-Pro teams. You can expect consistency and durability from him, sure, but you're not going to see him dominate NFL linemen. He'll give up more sacks than your average right guard, although he'll be a fantastic addition to the running game; that is, if you're asking him to just lock onto one guy and not have to pull to his left to stop a defensive end.

I would never criticize a prospect this much if I didn't watch a ton of tape on him or see a huge rap sheet. Scherff is a fantastic and an intelligent person, definitely worthy of being selected, but I don't believe for a moment that he's anything more than a third round pick based on his film, and I don't believe for a single heartbeat that we should draft him anywhere in the first two rounds. If you're looking at right guards, he's your guy; that is, if guys like Tomlinson are already gone.

Whatever he did in the Combine doesn't mean crap to me. Gallery and Smith blew up the Combine, too.

It's easy to look at any prospect's worst game and diminish their value, but that's missing the forest for the trees. Hell, you think we would've drafted Greg Robinson no.2 overall last year if we focused on his rough outings early in '13 and not his dominant tape late in the year and immense upside?

No, I don't think Scherff will be a LT because he lacks the lateral movement to keep up with some NFL speed rushers, but luckily we already have one. When I look at Scherff I see a versatile OL who will be a great run blocker from day one, who has good enough feet for a LT but great feet for an interior OL. And yes, he has the athleticism to play LG, he has every bit the athleticism of a guy like Saffold and then some.

If you can't look at this game against a very talented Ohio St. defense (when he wasn't coming off knee surgery btw), the way he bullies the guy in front of him around almost all game long, and see why he's considered a universal top 15 pick, then we're just going to have to disagree.

 

[BonifayRam]

Looks very close to a Rodger Saffold clone to me. Rodger was a OLT in college just like Brandon Scherff. Due to all the things that this Ram OL has gone through since RS arrival with Sam Bradford in 2010 RS has been forced to start @ four OL positions OLG/ORG in 2014, ORT/ORG 2013 & then 2010/2011/2012 @ OLT. Could you imagine a Robinson/Scherff left side OL? :bow:. You also get another talented OL who could if need be start @ either OT post.

If you could get a younger stronger fully healthy & undamaged Rodger Saffold with the same kind of working brain & versatility that could start day one in one of the weakest OL's in the NFL. Bet that Sam Bradford would have a big smile on his face.

Your telling me you would pass on that for a play-toy WR who would have to fight through other Ram WR's to get playing time?

 

[RamFan503]

It's easy to look at any prospect's worst game and diminish their value, but that's missing the forest for the trees. Hell, you think we would've drafted Greg Robinson no.2 overall last year if we focused on his rough outings early in '13 and not his dominant tape late in the year and immense upside?

No, I don't think Scherff will be a LT because he lacks the lateral movement to keep up with some NFL speed rushers, but luckily we already have one. When I look at Scherff I see a versatile OL who will be a great run blocker from day one, who has good enough feet for a LT but great feet for an interior OL. And yes, he has the athleticism to play LG, he has every bit the athleticism of a guy like Saffold and then some.

If you can't look at this game against a very talented Ohio St. defense (when he wasn't coming off knee surgery btw), the way he bullies the guy in front of him around almost all game long, and see why he's considered a universal top 15 pick, then we're just going to have to disagree.

I gotta say - it looked like he was really good at directing his man away from where the play was going and seemed to make up for it if he got beat by a step. Of course that video was all I've ever watched of the guy.

As to the question of if we could pass on a guy like Cooper if he's there. I too am of the thinking that he won't matter if he has no time to finish routes and our starting QB gets pummeled to the ER. Maybe Cooper is THAT good. I don't buy it though.

 

[Memento]

It's easy to look at any prospect's worst game and diminish their value, but that's missing the forest for the trees. Hell, you think we would've drafted Greg Robinson no.2 overall last year if we focused on his rough outings early in '13 and not his dominant tape late in the year and immense upside?

No, I don't think Scherff will be a LT because he lacks the lateral movement to keep up with some NFL speed rushers, but luckily we already have one. When I look at Scherff I see a versatile OL who will be a great run blocker from day one, who has good enough feet for a LT but great feet for an interior OL. And yes, he has the athleticism to play LG, he has every bit the athleticism of a guy like Saffold and then some.

If you can't look at this game against a very talented Ohio St. defense (when he wasn't coming off knee surgery btw), the way he bullies the guy in front of him around almost all game long, and see why he's considered a universal top 15 pick, then we're just going to have to disagree.

http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/schools/auburn/2013-schedule.html

http://www.sports-reference.com/cfb/schools/iowa/2014-schedule.html

Greg Robinson had bad games, yes, but against horrid defenses such as Maryland? Maryland was ranked 89th in total defense. Conversely, most of the teams that Auburn faced were top-ranked defenses that year. I'll even list all of the teams defensive rankings in 2013:

Washington State Cougars - 97th
Arkansas State Red Wolves - 58th
Mississippi State Bulldogs - 32nd.
Louisiana State Tigers - 21st
Ole Miss Rebels - 37th
West Carolina Catamounts - D2
Texas A&M Aggies - 96th
Florida Atlantic Owls - 36th
Arkansas Razorbacks - 90th
Tennessee Volunteers - 77th
Georgia Bulldogs - 89th
Alabama Crimson Tide - 4th
Missouri Tigers - 33rd
Florida State Seminoles - 1st

Conversely, here are the rankings for the teams that Iowa faced in 2014, Scherff's senior year:

Northern Iowa Panthers - D2
Ball State Cardinals - 68th
Iowa State Cyclones - 117th
Pittsburgh Panthers - 59th
Purdue Boilermakers - 99th
Indiana Hoosiers - 102nd
Maryland Terrapins - 89th
Northwestern Wildcats - 46th
Minnesota Golden Gophers - 34th
Illinois Fighting Illini - 109th
Wisconsin Badgers - 20th
Nebraska Cornhuskers - 60th
Tennessee Volunteers - 35th

The only top 25 defense that Iowa faced was Wisconsin. The only others in the top forty were an SEC team and the Golden Gophers. Did I mention that they lost to Iowa State and only scored seventeen points? Or when they faced the Ball State juggernaut and slipped away with a seventeen-point victory?

They only scored over 40 points twice (Northwestern and Indiana) in 2014. 2013 Auburn, on the other hand, had their lowest scoring game against LSU, and they still managed to put up twenty-one points. They scored over fifty points three times and three other times over forty.

I never questioned G-Rob's talent or potential. I questioned his rawness. I've never questioned Scherff's experience. I've questioned why experts think he has more talent and upside than he really does.

 

[jrry32]

Sure if you rate them all nearly the same. But if not what are actually trading for? A second or more likely a third in this years draft? What is that worth? Is it the same as a third in last years draft? Is next year a much deeper draft? If so then trade for a pick in next years draft. If you trade down it should be for something worthwhile. In a weak draft a third rounder could be like a fifth or a sixth rounder in a very good draft.

I do rate them close enough that a 2nd round pick would be very enticing.

 

[jrry32]

I gotta say - it looked like he was really good at directing his man away from where the play was going and seemed to make up for it if he got beat by a step. Of course that video was all I've ever watched of the guy.

As to the question of if we could pass on a guy like Cooper if he's there. I too am of the thinking that he won't matter if he has no time to finish routes and our starting QB gets pummeled to the ER. Maybe Cooper is THAT good. I don't buy it though.

You don't pass on Cooper if he's there. You just don't. That's the type of move that you regret.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

You don't pass on Cooper if he's there. You just don't. That's the type of move that you regret.

Or White

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

I do rate them close enough that a 2nd round pick would be very enticing.

Now if you could get an extra first for 2016 then sure, but a late second in this draft? No thanks.

I don't like getting out of the top ten. I think after that there is a big drop off. I guess it all comes down to who is there to pick. And what the offer is.

 

[jrry32]

Now if you could get an extra first for 2016 then sure, but a late second in this draft? No thanks.

I don't like getting out of the top ten. I think after that there is a big drop off. I guess it all comes down to who is there to pick. And what the offer is.

The big drop off is after the first 6 or so picks. The guys from 10 to 20 are all pretty much in the same range. That's assuming Cooper and White are gone.

We're not getting a future first. But yes, I'd absolutely take a late 2nd in this draft. The talent doesn't tail off until Day 3. There's still plenty of talent in the 2nd and 3rd rounds.

I'll absolutely take T.J. Clemmings or La'El Collins and Eric Kendricks or Paul Dawson or Daryl Williams or Laken Tomlinson or Rashad Greene over just Brandon Scherff.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

I don't think that it is a guarantee that Mariota, Winston, Whit, or Cooper will ALL be gone by 10.

 

[jrry32]

I don't think that it is a guarantee that Mariota, Winston, Whit, or Cooper will ALL be gone by 10.

We wouldn't trade down then.

This is discussing it as if Scherff is the #1 guy on the board.

 

[OC--LeftCoast]

And you really think that Scherff is plug-and-play at left guard? The only real plug-and-play players in this draft for offensive linemen who can actually help us are Peat and Cann. Clemmings and Collins still need work, but they can also be fantastic additions.

I really don't know, since I sell windows for a living I'll defer to those on Enos' payroll for that one, my one and only point is --- if we get "the pick of the litter" interior line prospect sitting at...gulp number 10, we take him.

Nothing more nothing less.

Some here may wanna take a look around at what makes certain teams elite.

Snisher have built their Dline, they almost scored Zack Martin last year (in what would have be one helluva coup in my book) I think they pick up where they left off last year.

 

[Jorgeh0605]

You want reasoning and analysis? Very well.

He's clearly unable to play tackle at any sort of decent level in college, let alone the NFL. He doesn't have a center's body, which limits him strictly to guard. I highly doubt that he'll be able to function against quicker defensive tackles such as Atkins and McCoy or talented and/or athletic right/left ends that go on stunts against him. He has straight-line speed, functional strength, okay fundamentals, and can get to the second level in the running game. That's it.

His pass-protection has been terrible at Iowa, terrible against below-mediocre players such as the 3-4 defensive ends at Maryland, who gave him absolute fits in the passing game - both bull-rushing and speed-rushing. It was one of the worst performances I've ever seen from a supposed "top-of-the-class offensive lineman", and he doesn't even have the excuse of using inexperience because that was his senior tape. He was a senior, and he got overpowered, overmatched, and beat like a rented mule by a 5'11", 285 lbs. 3-4 end on a horrific defense. What do you think that Kilgo (the nose tackle on the Maryland defensive line, and likely the only real talent that Maryland even had on the defensive side of the ball that year) would have done to him if Scherff was at guard? He's strong in the weight room, sure, but I don't see that strength translating to anything other than run-blocking.

He's extremely top-heavy (which allows bull-rushers to have their way with him), has horrible footwork (which allows speed-rushers to utterly destroy him), can't pull to save his life against quick one-gap penetrators such as Bennett (see OSU vs. Iowa), and he's just not a natural knee-bender like Peat is.

He'll be a guard at the next level, and probably not even a left one. He's not Zack Martin. Not even close because Martin - while he had issues at pass-protection - didn't get horrifically beat like Scherff did. He's not Reiff or Bulaga either. He compares more to his fellow Hawkeye alum, the #2 overall pick of the 2004 NFL draft: Robert Gallery. Gallery was also a weight room warrior and a much better overall athlete than Scherff. He couldn't hack it at tackle and carved himself out a career as a decent left guard. He's still regarded as one of the biggest offensive line busts in that decade (second only to Jason Smith).

But Scherff doesn't have Gallery's overall athleticism. He's strictly - in my honest opinion - a right guard. He'll be a decent right guard at the NFL level, but you won't ever see him make it to Pro-Bowls or the All-Pro teams. You can expect consistency and durability from him, sure, but you're not going to see him dominate NFL linemen. He'll give up more sacks than your average right guard, although he'll be a fantastic addition to the running game; that is, if you're asking him to just lock onto one guy and not have to pull to his left to stop a defensive end.

I would never criticize a prospect this much if I didn't watch a ton of tape on him or see a huge rap sheet. Scherff is a fantastic and an intelligent person, definitely worthy of being selected, but I don't believe for a moment that he's anything more than a third round pick based on his film, and I don't believe for a single heartbeat that we should draft him anywhere in the first two rounds. If you're looking at right guards, he's your guy; that is, if guys like Tomlinson are already gone.

Whatever he did in the Combine doesn't mean crap to me. Gallery and Smith blew up the Combine, too.

Up until this point I was sitting here agreeing with jjab360 that it was hard to take you seriously without legitimate analysis. Actually explaining yourself gives you some credibility in my book FWIW (Not much I suppose). Thank you for the post. I enjoyed your insight.

 

[bwdenverram]

No, please, fate, no! No! NO! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

Memento-Why do you not like him so much? You must see something I don't. Guy seems like a really good player and plays pretty nasty, which we need.
EDIT: Never mind I now see your earlier reply. I don't agree with you but we shall see.