Professional Boxing

[ozarkram]

 

[Loyal]

SONOFA! ~ Jersey Joe

 

[Loyal]

Tyson Fury actually busted Wilder's ear drum and one of the knock downs was due to a body blow, which always impresses me...Give it a watch. Tyson is named after Mike Tyson, and dude is a bit cray cray flicking a tongue towards Wilder's bloody shoulder...lol

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWY3S2v773Y

 

[Loyal]

This is a great watch...


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxC7wm728ig

 

[fearsomefour]

Foreman is my favorite fighter of all time.
Missed his first go round, the second version of Foreman is the one I like.
There are a lot of good fighters out there now, mostly in the lighter divisions.
Danny Garcia for example is always an entertaining fight and a great fighter.

 

[ozarkram]

Foreman is my favorite fighter of all time.
Missed his first go round, the second version of Foreman is the one I like.
There are a lot of good fighters out there now, mostly in the lighter divisions.
Danny Garcia for example is always an entertaining fight and a great fighter.

Foreman's first incarnation was just a huge unbelievably strong angry man. Who hammered anything in front of him down. The second Foreman while still huge and strong was a much more seasoned smart fighter.

 

[ozarkram]

 

[thirteen28]

I remember watching that live as a 6th grade kid ... if my memory serves me (a dubious proposition at times), it was on a Saturday Afternoon on ABC's Wide World of Sports. Holy shit, this was like two of the biggest, baddest, toughest cavemen meeting with their clubs and beating the shit out of each other. Not much pugilistic artistry, but one helluva lot of action.

the second version of Foreman is the one I like.

Ditto. For Ozark's reason below.

The second Foreman while still huge and strong was a much more seasoned smart fighter

If you ever meet anyone that says Foreman's victory over Moorer to regain the title was just a lucky punch, make them watch this:


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PeLeNhix2pk


He set Moorer up so good and at the right time, he dropped the hammer. This, IMO, is Foreman's greatest fight, because he combined brains with his brawn to accomplish one of those most unlikely feats ever - regaining the heavyweight title *20 years* after losing it.

 

[Loyal]

I remember watching that live as a 6th grade kid ... if my memory serves me (a dubious proposition at times), it was on a Saturday Afternoon on ABC's Wide World of Sports. Holy shit, this was like two of the biggest, baddest, toughest cavemen meeting with their clubs and beating the shit out of each other. Not much pugilistic artistry, but one helluva lot of action.



Ditto. For Ozark's reason below.



If you ever meet anyone that says Foreman's victory over Moorer to regain the title was just a lucky punch, make them watch this:


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PeLeNhix2pk


He set Moorer up so good and at the right time, he dropped the hammer. This, IMO, is Foreman's greatest fight, because he combined brains with his brawn to accomplish one of those most unlikely feats ever - regaining the heavyweight title *20 years* after losing it.

No doubt that I loved old George winning the title again, but was a symptom of a deep weakness in the sport. There is no way if you were transport an old George Foreman or Mike Tyson back to the early 70's to fight Ali, Foreman, Frazier, Lyle, Norton, Shavers, or Young in their primes, that they could beat the challengers to crown....let alone beat the Champ. It was a shell of what it used to be, imo.

 

[fearsomefour]

Foreman's first incarnation was just a huge unbelievably strong angry man. Who hammered anything in front of him down. The second Foreman while still huge and strong was a much more seasoned smart fighter.

Very true.
He had that great dominating jab.
Knew how to control and cut of the ring and how to control the pace of the fight.
He would control the tempo of the fight in most cases.
The thing that is funny is commentators would always talk about how slow Foreman was but he had a very high connect percentage for all his punches.
I remember Teddy Atlas talking about how he would change up the speed of his punches at times. Loop a slower right hand several times to set up a short straight right like he eventually knocked Moorer out with.

 

[fearsomefour]

No doubt that I loved old George winning the title again, but was a symptom of a deep weakness in the sport. There is no way if you were transport an old George Foreman or Mike Tyson back to the early 70's to fight Ali, Foreman, Frazier, Lyle, Norton, Shavers, or Young in their primes, that they could beat the challengers to crown....let alone beat the Champ. It was a shell of what it used to be, imo.

Ehhh.
The heavies are usually like that.
Look at Ali’s record.
He beat a whole bunch of tomato cans as well.
The heavyweight division is usually not super deep.
I mean, Tex Cobb was a contender.

 

[Loyal]

Ehhh.
The heavies are usually like that.
Look at Ali’s record.
He beat a whole bunch of tomato cans as well.
The heavyweight division is usually not super deep.
I mean, Tex Cobb was a contender.

Tex Cobb was a Palooka...Now mention the contenders when Foreman beat Moorer vs contenders to Ali.....There has never been a time in my life time when there were guys of this caliber contending for the crown in the early 70's:
Ali
George Foreman
Joe Frazier
Earnie Shavers
Jimmy Young
Ken Norton
Ron Lyle
These guys were all swirling in competition to become Champ, concurrently. Were you watching them in these years? There is no way any decade since then was as good. NO WAY.

 

[thirteen28]

No doubt that I loved old George winning the title again, but was a symptom of a deep weakness in the sport. There is no way if you were transport an old George Foreman or Mike Tyson back to the early 70's to fight Ali, Foreman, Frazier, Lyle, Norton, Shavers, or Young in their primes, that they could beat the challengers to crown....let alone beat the Champ. It was a shell of what it used to be, imo.

It was definitely weaker at the time, with Holyfield on the decline and Lennox Lewis still not at his peak, Tyson in jail, and Riddick Bowe ducking Lewis and others. I generally agree that the 70's was the best era for heavyweight talent, and the 1960's wasn't actually that bad either, it's just that Ali overshadowed everybody once he had ascended to the title and did so even during his exile.

Look at Ali’s record.

It's actually pretty impressive:

- Beat HW champ, Sonny Liston, twice.
- Beat former HW Champ Floyd Patterson (first HW to regain the title after losing it) twice
- Beat HW champ Foreman (by KO, which pretty much nobody but Ali himself thought was possible)
- Beat HW Frazier 2/3 times they fought, including in perhaps the greatest fight of all time, The Thrilla in Manila
- Beat Norton 2/3 times

That's pretty damn impressive. And add to that all of the contenders he beat, guys that could probably have been champions in other eras (Shavers, Lyle, Jimmy Young, Cleveland Williams, Henry Cooper, etc.).

 

[fearsomefour]

It was definitely weaker at the time, with Holyfield on the decline and Lennox Lewis still not at his peak, Tyson in jail, and Riddick Bowe ducking Lewis and others. I generally agree that the 70's was the best era for heavyweight talent, and the 1960's wasn't actually that bad either, it's just that Ali overshadowed everybody once he had ascended to the title and did so even during his exile.



It's actually pretty impressive:

- Beat HW champ, Sonny Liston, twice.
- Beat former HW Champ Floyd Patterson (first HW to regain the title after losing it) twice
- Beat HW champ Foreman (by KO, which pretty much nobody but Ali himself thought was possible)
- Beat HW Frazier 2/3 times they fought, including in perhaps the greatest fight of all time, The Thrilla in Manila
- Beat Norton 2/3 times

That's pretty damn impressive. And add to that all of the contenders he beat, guys that could probably have been champions in other eras (Shavers, Lyle, Jimmy Young, Cleveland Williams, Henry Cooper, etc.).

That’s 13 or so wins out of 56.
Can do the same with most HWs.
A lot of never weres on that list.
Same with most of them.
He did fight a lot....many years with 4-6 fights as a contender or as Champ.
That is more of an indication of what money has done than a deep division.
I agree overall it was deeper then, for several reasons.
But, it doesn’t much matter.
Just like comparing eras of football teams or players.
They beat the guys in front of them and won their titles.

 

[fearsomefour]

Tex Cobb was a Palooka...Now mention the contenders when Foreman beat Moorer vs contenders to Ali.....There has never been a time in my life time when there were guys of this caliber contending for the crown in the early 70's:
Ali
George Foreman
Joe Frazier
Earnie Shavers
Jimmy Young
Ken Norton
Ron Lyle
These guys were all swirling in competition to become Champ, concurrently. Were you watching them in these years? There is no way any decade since then was as good. NO WAY.

Before my time.
I’ve been limited to espn classic and night to remember replays.

 

[Loyal]

Before my time.
I’ve been limited to espn classic and night to remember replays.

That's why you think the heavyweight division has always been mediocre, because with some exceptions, it has been during your lifetime.

 

[thirteen28]

That’s 13 or so wins out of 56.
Can do the same with most HWs.
A lot of never weres on that list.
Same with most of them.
He did fight a lot....many years with 4-6 fights as a contender or as Champ.
That is more of an indication of what money has done than a deep division.
I agree overall it was deeper then, for several reasons.
But, it doesn’t much matter.
Just like comparing eras of football teams or players.
They beat the guys in front of them and won their titles.

Yeah, but how many heavyweight champions can claim that many other champions from the same division on their resume? Off the top of my head, Joe Louis comes to mind ... and that's about it.

 

[Loyal]

I've heard two reports from top heavyweight boxers concerning Mike Tyson's return.
Reportedly, Tyson Fury says that he has no interest in fighting Mike because there is no benefit to him. If he beats the older man, he will have beaten a diminished old man. If he loses, his legacy becomes garbage. Says he will retire after the next two fights.

Deontay Wilder says he's better than Mike Tyson and so doesn't worry about him, which Iron Mike liked. "It's what I'd say if I was him."

 

[ozarkram]

Ali gets most of the praise. And maybe he should. Louis was probably the better over all fighter. Just my opinion. But the one know one ever talks about is Rocky Marciano. Kinda like the 72 Dolphins. Everyone just goes oh yeah forgot about him.

 

[ozarkram]

I've heard two reports from top heavyweight boxers concerning Mike Tyson's return.
Reportedly, Tyson Fury says that he has no interest in fighting Mike because there is no benefit to him. If he beats the older man, he will have beaten a diminished old man. If he loses, his legacy becomes garbage. Says he will retire after the next two fights.

Deontay Wilder says he's better than Mike Tyson and so doesn't worry about him, which Iron Mike liked. "It's what I'd say if I was him."

If Mike is half the fighter he was and focused. No way i let my fighter in the ring with him.