Les Snead trades a discussion

[OldSchool]

So I asked the question in the EJ trade topic and really only got 1 person that I saw to respond sorry if I missed your response if so post here. Snead takes a lot of grief from fans for in their opinion his lack of a quality return for players we trade away. I think my biggest issue with this is I can't think of any players we traded away that legit were good after we traded them. He seems to have a pretty good record of trading away guys who turned out to be duds. Goff being the exception, even though he's one of the most disliked Rams in the last 20 years and there are people who still will not give him any credit. Add to that it's hard for me to accept anybody saying that trade didn't work out for us. And this is coming from me one of the most vocal after the trade that was against it.

So I'm looking for is give me a player that we traded away that went on to enjoy success for his new team. One thing to consider is the Rams and McVay are for some guys like Ramsey willing to take a little less to facilitate a move to a team the player wants. Not exactly cutthroat best business practice but it's one of the things that make him the players coach and winner IMO that he is. So hit me with your best ones.

The best that I can come up with myself is Robert Woods. Not Bobby Trees was coming off an ACL injury at 30 years old and had IIRC a $10 million cap hit that year. The part of me that doesn't want to consider him is he really since then hasn't done anything close to what he did for the Rams. 2022 for the Titans 53 receptions for 527 yards and 2 TD. And 2023 40 receptions for 426 yards and 1 TD. That was one season for the Rams and it took him 2 seasons to do it.

So who you got? And just telling me "We should have got more" isn't going to cut it! Don't care what you got in your Madden career mode or what you did in your mock off season. Who did we get rid of that actually did anything good. My contention in all this is we are selling players that Rams fans think more highly of than the NFL does since they don't amount to much at all after they leave LA. Prime example in my mind is Trumaine Johnson, and that may have been one of the best trade returns But Tru was garbage after leaving the Rams.

 

[Loyal]

So I asked the question in the EJ trade topic and really only got 1 person that I saw to respond sorry if I missed your response if so post here. Snead takes a lot of grief from fans for in their opinion his lack of a quality return for players we trade away. I think my biggest issue with this is I can't think of any players we traded away that legit were good after we traded them. He seems to have a pretty good record of trading away guys who turned out to be duds. Goff being the exception, even though he's one of the most disliked Rams in the last 20 years and there are people who still will not give him any credit. Add to that it's hard for me to accept anybody saying that trade didn't work out for us. And this is coming from me one of the most vocal after the trade that was against it.

So I'm looking for is give me a player that we traded away that went on to enjoy success for his new team. One thing to consider is the Rams and McVay are for some guys like Ramsey willing to take a little less to facilitate a move to a team the player wants. Not exactly cutthroat best business practice but it's one of the things that make him the players coach and winner IMO that he is. So hit me with your best ones.

The best that I can come up with myself is Robert Woods. Not Bobby Trees was coming off an ACL injury at 30 years old and had IIRC a $10 million cap hit that year. The part of me that doesn't want to consider him is he really since then hasn't done anything close to what he did for the Rams. 2022 for the Titans 53 receptions for 527 yards and 2 TD. And 2023 40 receptions for 426 yards and 1 TD. That was one season for the Rams and it took him 2 seasons to do it.

So who you got? And just telling me "We should have got more" isn't going to cut it! Don't care what you got in your Madden career mode or what you did in your mock off season. Who did we get rid of that actually did anything good. My contention in all this is we are selling players that Rams fans think more highly of than the NFL does since they don't amount to much at all after they leave LA. Prime example in my mind is Trumaine Johnson, and that may have been one of the best trade returns But Tru was garbage after leaving the Rams.

You will say Bobby Trees and Tutu Atwell with pride and out loud!

 

[TSFH Fan]

Brandin Cooks had a couple of productive years for the Texans

 

[OntarioRam]

I didn't really watch their games but apparently Ramsey had a strong year in Miami, better than his last season in L.A.

Cooks did well after leaving.

Williams looked good in Jacksonville, though we have him back now.

Goff as you noted looks good in Detroit. Much better than he did towards the end of his Rams tenure.

I agree most players look better in horns vs. after they move on, which I think speaks to this coaching staff. But there are examples of guys looking good after we move on.

Dicker the Kicker, in hindsight, should have remained a Ram.

 

[Memphis Ram]

I didn't really watch their games but apparently Ramsey had a strong year in Miami, better than his last season in L.A.

Cooks did well after leaving.

Williams looked good in Jacksonville, though we have him back now.

Goff as you noted looks good in Detroit. Much better than he did towards the end of his Rams tenure.

I agree most players look better in horns vs. after they move on, which I think speaks to this coaching staff. But there are examples of guys looking good after we move on.

Dicker the Kicker, in hindsight, should have remained a Ram.

If you go by PFF Ramsey had his worst season ever last year.

I thought Williams left via free agency.

 

[tklongball]

I think the problem is that fans look at the player in a vacuum and say this player is worth more than a 7th round pick. But, these trades aren't in a vacuum, there are lots of variables that some fans don't take into account when evaluating a trade (Salary, due for a new contract, attitude, scheme fit, Salary Cap, Dead Money, etc.). Not to mention, fans tend to overvalue their team's players to begin with.

Bottom line is if you think that Les Snead gets fleeced every time he trades away a player, maybe, just maybe it is you, and not him.

 

[TSFH Fan]

My contention in all this is we are selling players that Rams fans think more highly of than the NFL does

IMO, this is largely a thing across all teams and all sports - the hometown fan tends to place a higher "value" on their player than the rest of the world does. There are just too many hot takes in sports about how "the team should have gotten more".

 

[OldSchool]

If you go by PFF Ramsey had his worst season ever last year.

I thought Williams left via free agency.

Correct on both counts.

 

[OldSchool]

IMO, this is largely a thing across all teams and all sports - the hometown fan tends to place a higher "value" on their player than the rest of the world does. There are just too many hot takes in sports about how "the team should have gotten more".

I 100% agree with you, but reading through the Jones thread there are people that really don't see it that way, they think Les is just bad at this.

 

[tempests]

If you go by PFF Ramsey had his worst season ever last year.

Pro Football Reference says opposing QBs had a 51 passer rating when targeting him.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2023/defense_advanced.htm

 

[dang]

Brandin Cooks had a couple of productive years for the Texans

View attachment 67248

Cooks couldn’t carry the team but he was a productive WR that I wish we could have kept.

 

[dang]

For any trade you have to also consider cap relief. So there’s more to consider other than draft picks.

Re: Goff being one of the most disliked Rams in the last 20 years and there are people who still will not give him any credit.
I just don’t get that. While he couldn’t carry the Rams in the SuperBowl and had way too many turnovers - he was one of the main reasons for the Rams turnaround in 2017. He was and is a top 10 NFL QB.

 

[OldSchool]

For any trade you have to also consider cap relief. So there’s more to consider other than draft picks.

Re: Goff being one of the most disliked Rams in the last 20 years and there are people who still will not give him any credit.
I just don’t get that. While he couldn’t carry the Rams in the SuperBowl and had way too many turnovers - he was one of the main reasons for the Rams turnaround in 2017. He was and is a top 10 NFL QB.

I agree fully with the bolded. Doesn't change what you put in italics at all though.

 

[fanotodd]

Old school:
I posted this on another thread.

Off the top of my head, I can’t think of anybody the Rams have let go who has thrived or made the Rams look bad for letting them go.

Goff would be the only one I can think of who has gone on to have real success, but the Rams got Stafford in return and won a SB. Both robinson and skow were cut today.

Look at every player from that SB team who the Rams let walk, released, or traded. What have they done since? How would you like to be the bills, holding that von miller contract? Yikes!

Jones wasn’t coming back after this season and I’ll be quite surprised if he has a season that makes us second guess the Rams’ FO.

 

[PARAM]

It's the "we not me" that facilitates some of these trades for what seem like very little. If a guy is unhappy you take what you can get for him and spare the distraction. If a guy wants more money than the Rams are willing to pay, you take what you can get and move on. As far as who played well after leaving the Rams via a trade where we got very little in return, are there many?

Goff? Sure, he's doing well in Detroit. I like the kid and always have. I wasn't crazy about the deal originally but how in the H-E-Double Lombardi sticks wasn't that worth it? Detroit got a nice young QB. The Rams got a SB.

Cooks? Traded with a 4th round pick to the Texans for a 2nd round pick. He had 81 receptions for 1150 yards, 6 TDs as the #1 WR in Houston. Jefferson, the guy we got with the 2nd round pick had a pretty good 2nd year as the #3 WR (2021) with 50 receptions 802 yards, 6 TDs.

Ramsey? Traded to Miami for a 3rd round pick (Byron Young) and Hunter Long. Ramsey was injured and played 10 games with 3 picks, 5 PDs and 22 tackles. He was a stellar CB for the Rams and probably will be again in Miami. But his first year there wasn't very good at all.

Williams? Was lost via Free Agency along with Von Miller, Austin Corbett, SJD, Okoronkwo and Mundt after the SB season. He had two good years in Jacksonville but we got him back. So CREDIT has to be given there.

I know people wanted a 1st for Ramsey. Maybe for Goff too? Cooks? That's home cooking. IMHO, Jones (or his agents) picked a bad time to pick a fight. Should have done it before they had other ILBs looking good. These guys (Snead and McVay) have demonstrated time and again, they know WTF they are doing. "Rebuild" last year and a wild card berth was the most recent factoid. I realize just like getting top dollar for the players they trade away, the SB should be won every other year but if we're realistic, WTF do we have to complain about?

 

[AZRams]

I think the problem is that fans look at the player in a vacuum and say this player is worth more than a 7th round pick. But, these trades aren't in a vacuum, there are lots of variables that some fans don't take into account when evaluating a trade (Salary, due for a new contract, attitude, scheme fit, Salary Cap, Dead Money, etc.). Not to mention, fans tend to overvalue their team's players to begin with.

Bottom line is if you think that Les Snead gets fleeced every time he trades away a player, maybe, just maybe it is you, and not him.

In the case of EJ, it feels like a starting MLB who is a defensive captain and expected to be a team leader is worth more than a 5th round pick, two years out. Especially if you've also included a pick of your own to go with.

Maybe the actual 'data' says no, but it sure doesn't feel like fair value for the player.

 

[Corbin]

So I asked the question in the EJ trade topic and really only got 1 person that I saw to respond sorry if I missed your response if so post here. Snead takes a lot of grief from fans for in their opinion his lack of a quality return for players we trade away. I think my biggest issue with this is I can't think of any players we traded away that legit were good after we traded them. He seems to have a pretty good record of trading away guys who turned out to be duds. Goff being the exception, even though he's one of the most disliked Rams in the last 20 years and there are people who still will not give him any credit. Add to that it's hard for me to accept anybody saying that trade didn't work out for us. And this is coming from me one of the most vocal after the trade that was against it.

So I'm looking for is give me a player that we traded away that went on to enjoy success for his new team. One thing to consider is the Rams and McVay are for some guys like Ramsey willing to take a little less to facilitate a move to a team the player wants. Not exactly cutthroat best business practice but it's one of the things that make him the players coach and winner IMO that he is. So hit me with your best ones.

The best that I can come up with myself is Robert Woods. Not Bobby Trees was coming off an ACL injury at 30 years old and had IIRC a $10 million cap hit that year. The part of me that doesn't want to consider him is he really since then hasn't done anything close to what he did for the Rams. 2022 for the Titans 53 receptions for 527 yards and 2 TD. And 2023 40 receptions for 426 yards and 1 TD. That was one season for the Rams and it took him 2 seasons to do it.

So who you got? And just telling me "We should have got more" isn't going to cut it! Don't care what you got in your Madden career mode or what you did in your mock off season. Who did we get rid of that actually did anything good. My contention in all this is we are selling players that Rams fans think more highly of than the NFL does since they don't amount to much at all after they leave LA. Prime example in my mind is Trumaine Johnson, and that may have been one of the best trade returns But Tru was garbage after leaving the Rams.

Who are these people that says the Goff trade didn’t work out for us?

 

[Kupped]

Part of the issue is that the Rams set themselves up.
They sold EJ hard as a leader as guy who could fill part of the locker room void created by the Donald departure.
So, I get the whiplash.
That doesn’t mean it was a bad trade.

 

[fanotodd]

In the case of EJ, it feels like a starting MLB who is a defensive captain and expected to be a team leader is worth more than a 5th round pick, two years out. Especially if you've also included a pick of your own to go with.

Maybe the actual 'data' says no, but it sure doesn't feel like fair value for the player.

Your points are good but there’s another issue to be considered:
His knees. He is looking like a player who will need to be “managed” from here on out. Maybe not, but it was something the Rams weren’t willing to gamble on, apparently.

 

[Flatlyner]

For any trade you have to also consider cap relief. So there’s more to consider other than draft picks.

Re: Goff being one of the most disliked Rams in the last 20 years and there are people who still will not give him any credit.
I just don’t get that. While he couldn’t carry the Rams in the SuperBowl and had way too many turnovers - he was one of the main reasons for the Rams turnaround in 2017. He was and is a top 10 NFL QB.

Disagree with the bolded. He certainly was not a top 10 QB when we traded him and I don't think he is one now. I'd be interested to see your top 10 list if he is in it.