Joyner being moved to Free Safety?

[Stl2La]

Who wrote an article on him? I could flip it around, so guys remember LaMarcus Joyner played safety at FSU & wrote an article on him...Regardless of what he's played in his 4 years in the NFL, and think HE could be a fit at FS???? No matter that he's a terrible DB overall....
I pencil him in as the next best option....Since TJ McDonald's departure....Mo Alexander's move to SS....and the lack of proven depth besides Mark Barron...who for some reason is penciled in as a ILB.....no matter that he's never played ILB....maybe in high school...who knows.
On skills....I believe Randolph to be the best option....I see Christian as a nickle db/corner....more likely, he's gonna be cut.

Joyner a terrible DB? Randolph the best fit on skills? Lol let me ask you a serious question. Are you related to Randolph and did Joyner do something to you or someone you know?

 

[WestCoastRam]

There's a 70% chance that our starting FS isn't on the roster yet.

 

[Merlin]

I wonder who will come in at FS when Joyner does drop down? Who ever it is will practically be a starter there, I don't know how often they'll be in a base set.

There is a reasonable chance they add a safety in the draft. The position is very well represented starting right there at our round 2 pick. Budda Baker, for example, who is similar to Joyner in terms of being small and scrappy as F but his range is stupid and I think his ball skills down the middle are starting FS material. Wade loves himself a good FS, so I'm sure it's a position they're open to taking at really every pick depending on value.

Suffice to say that LaMarcus Joyner's speed (4.55 40) falls right in line with that group of players. Your empirical evidence that Joyner lacks the speed to play FS is lacking imo.

I've never been a speed guy wrt safeties and their evaluation. More concerned with responsible play at FS, good instincts, and decisiveness. That edge in speed is meaningless in game time if the instincts and decisiveness aren't up to snuff. And with safeties it's not like there's a clear connection with top end 40 speed, tbh change of direction type drills are probably a better indicator of what you want. My preference is a ball hawk, someone who is going to be in the right spot and have a good shot at actually catching the INT moreso than freak athletic ability and size.

 

[OldSchool]

There's a 70% chance that our starting FS isn't on the roster yet.

"47% of stats posted on the internet are made up" - Abe Lincoln

 

[LACHAMP46]

Joyner a terrible DB? Randolph the best fit on skills? Lol let me ask you a serious question. Are you related to Randolph and did Joyner do something to you or someone you know?

Joyner was responsible for a large percentage of 3rd down conversions. Joyner hasn't had a int in the pros....He only touched 5 passes all year in 2016. That, to me, in my honest opinion is a terrible db.
I am related to Randolph only as men who love the Rams...I can almost guarantee, if brian randolph starts, he'd make more of an impact than Joyner. If Joyner was SO GOOD in his role, why does almost every guy that follows him, want him to change positions?

My preference is a ball hawk, someone who is going to be in the right spot and have a good shot at actually catching the INT moreso than freak athletic ability and size.

To be the best type of ball hawk....in 2017....most good FS have outstanding speed...4.50 at 200+ lbs is pretty damn good speed. 4.55 at < 190 lbs is pretty average....or, pretty slow.

I'm from the Don Rodgers/Kenny Easley era of safeties....and slow guys at FS are only gonna get us killed in a passing league.

 

[bubbaramfan]

I too prefer Randolph get a long look at FS. Never been a fan of smurfs.

 

[Memento]

Joyner is a good defensive back. He played nickel and occasionally SSLB last year, and he was rated by PFF over all of our other defensive backs. He's great when facing the receivers and using his instincts and quick reaction time to make plays. He played free safety at FSU, and he was amazing there.

I like Randolph, but not enough to unseat Joyner from the FS post.

 

[jrry32]

@So Ram reference your statement on Safety Brian Randolph....:

Yes as a Ram fan & member of the best Rams Forum known to mankind ....I have been delusional at times so I will agree with that. First I would like to address the "Unknown UDFA" remark if you will permit me......for us here in the deep south & who follow NCAA SEC dominance for the past 2 decades BR was far from being NOT known. But it would be normal for southern California folks would probably have no clue who this guy is. The fact that a true southern Calif. homey like @LACHAMP46 knew more than me tells me he is Abby Norm- all.:snicker:

My first general statement on him would look like this...had a very solid college career in the SEC....4 year starter, ton of tackles, a handful of big plays, & was the leader on the back end of the Vol's defense since he was a freshman. BR is rangy safety offers good size, ball skills and play aggressive football. BR's best fit in the NFL looks to be in a zone DB system.

Nationwide what may have really flashed his name to those who follow Draft Prospects was BR did at his pro day. a 4.40 40 yard dash ranging as high as a 4.50 and a 3 cone drill under 7.00 then lets get to the cherry on top of the cream.....31 reps on the bench.

If you can find any Tubes on him you will see some serious closing speed (range) from a safety in coverage from last years 2016 draft class. BR can play up close to the LOS or play single high coverage. Stat wise were .... played in 53 games with the Vols, making 47 starts. BR made 310 tackles, eight interceptions, four forced fumbles and 13 pass breakups during his career for Vol's. BR is a good tackler who shows some hit when he tacks. Show'd he can flips his hips well enough, shows good instincts in run support. Some other stuff is BR shows quick feet..BR does have fixable flaws bad tendency to not wrap up when going low for a big hit similar to TJ McDonald main issue. NFL coaches do not like his high backpedal. Wade will have to fix his backpedal to be a starter in the NFL.

I was sure that BR had won a spot with us last season due to his TC reports plus his ST value fact was he was the #1 gunner & was injured on a ST play as the gunner. That ACL tear injury in the preseason game against the Dallas Cowboys caused him to be IR'd as you pointed out. Your concerns bout that knee have merit it will be his second ACL tear recovery. BR did very well rehabbing with the first one so thats a positive here on this second one on the other knee.I still feel very strong about BR & that Wade will surly provide him the opportunity to compete very soon.

I think @So Ram's point is reasonable. Randolph is an athletic guy, but he played in the SEC. It's not like he was overlooked because nobody saw him play. I don't see Joyner relinquishing the position. It's a great fit for his skill-set.

 

[jrry32]

If Joyner was SO GOOD in his role, why does almost every guy that follows him, want him to change positions?

For the same reason that I'd rather have Marshall Faulk at HB than WR. Faulk would have been a good WR, but he was an elite HB.

Joyner's skill-set allows him to be an above average slot CB. However, his weaknesses limit him from ever being great in that position. His weaknesses are quite easy to mask at FS while his strengths are all magnified. It's a position where he has the ability to be very good. Considering that we have a hole at FS, I'd rather play Joyner at the position that maximizes his skill-set.

 

[So Ram]

For the same reason that I'd rather have Marshall Faulk at HB than WR. Faulk would have been a good WR, but he was an elite HB.

Joyner's skill-set allows him to be an above average slot CB. However, his weaknesses limit him from ever being great in that position. His weaknesses are quite easy to mask at FS while his strengths are all magnified. It's a position where he has the ability to be very good. Considering that we have a hole at FS, I'd rather play Joyner at the position that maximizes his skill-set.

You could use Barron as an example as well. He was not making it as a true safety with Tampa. He comes to the Rams lead the team in tackles as a LBer.
Ram fans want to trade him , but the front office last season signed him to a big contract extension. Where does he fit best ??

Add Mo Alexander to the mix as a FS ?? He played LBer in college. He was a SS his first year & last season started for The Rams at FS ??

Ram fans have been wanting Joyner out of the nickel spot, in fact wanted him at CB last season ?
I think The new Rams coaching staff haventhis one right ?? There is no proof though . They still have him listed as a CB ?

 

[Stl2La]

Joyner was responsible for a large percentage of 3rd down conversions. Joyner hasn't had a int in the pros....He only touched 5 passes all year in 2016. That, to me, in my honest opinion is a terrible db.
I am related to Randolph only as men who love the Rams...I can almost guarantee, if brian randolph starts, he'd make more of an impact than Joyner. If Joyner was SO GOOD in his role, why does almost every guy that follows him, want him to change positions?

Do you have those 3rd down conversions allowed numbers on hand by chance? I don't care about how many passes he knocked down bc more goes into it than that. The scheme he was asked to play in is one factor. Rams routinely played off allowing for high completion % while not allowing big plays. Joyner was extremely good at this since he is an excellent tackler and didn't allow the ball catcher to gain hardly any yards after the catch. His skills sets of being fearless, great tackler, and good football quickness and instincts projects him to be a very good safety especially in Wade's scheme.

Randolph has literally done nothing in the NFL and didn't make near the impact in college that Joyner did. But sure if you want to "almost guarantee he will make a bigger impact" than Joyner sure take that huge leap with nothing on film to back it up. I'm going to go with what I've seen of both in college and the pros and what I've seen in no way indicates what you are implying.

I hope Randolph can come back from injury and contribute on special teams but to project him as the starting free safety over a player like Joyner is confusing to me but it's your opinion so you're welcome to it.

 

[jrry32]

Do you have those 3rd down conversions allowed numbers on hand by chance? I don't care about how many passes he knocked down bc more goes into it than that. The scheme he was asked to play in is one factor. Rams routinely played off allowing for high completion % while not allowing big plays. Joyner was extremely good at this since he is an excellent tackler and didn't allow the ball catcher to gain hardly any yards after the catch. His skills sets of being fearless, great tackler, and good football quickness and instincts projects him to be a very good safety especially in Wade's scheme.

It's also interesting that people cite third down conversions as a shot at Joyner. The Rams defense was fourth in 2016 (at 36.3%) and sixth in 2015 (at 34.7%) in the NFL in lowest third down conversion rate allowed.

Our defense was among the best in the NFL each of the past two years at not allowing teams to convert third downs. I happen to think Joyner's above average play is a big reason why considering that teams often look for their slot WRs on third downs.

 

[Mojo Ram]

Good lord still arguing about this? Here ya go boys.

This is the internet...where people are never wrong...nor man enough to admit it. Lol

 

[Mojo Ram]

Joyner a terrible DB? Randolph the best fit on skills? Lol let me ask you a serious question. Are you related to Randolph and did Joyner do something to you or someone you know?

Not necessary.

 

[Stl2La]

It's also interesting that people cite third down conversions as a shot at Joyner. The Rams defense was fourth in 2016 (at 36.3%) and sixth in 2015 (at 34.7%) in the NFL in lowest third down conversion rate allowed.

Our defense was among the best in the NFL each of the past two years at not allowing teams to convert third downs. I happen to think Joyner's above average play is a big reason why considering that teams often look for their slot WRs on third downs.

Ya I've seen a lot of things said in here that don't match up to the numbers or what I've seen watching games. I can't for the life of me understand the hate that Joyner is getting in this thread but hopefully he can prove some people wrong next season. If he does I'm sure they will be happy as rams fans. I know I would be if Randolph balls out.

Not necessary.

Should of put it in blue font even though I said it was a serious question. I'm pretty sarcastic sometimes. I obviously didn't think either of those two things were true or possible lol

 

[Soul Surfer]

This is the internet...where people are never wrong...nor man enough to admit it. Lol

To me it's just fun to guess on wno you like where.

But a month after the Super Bowl I usually make out my initial depth chart for the Rams and then work it over as the reality of who is REALLY starting where sets in.

 

[Soul Surfer]

I can't remember which writer wrote an article on Randolph being a candidate for Free Safety. It just seemed kind of out of the blue that he would find a guy who (I felt) was pretty much a Joe Average UDFA.

It would be like me writing on here that Troy Hill is in line to play corner opposite Trumaine Johnson.

It just seems a little far-fetched to me but heck I hope Brian Randolph makes All Pro at FS. Just not very likely.

That would make a story almost as good as Kurt Warner.

 

[LACHAMP46]

Randolph has literally done nothing in the NFL and didn't make near the impact in college that Joyner did. But sure if you want to "almost guarantee he will ake a bigger impact" than Joyner sure take that huge leap with nothing on film to back it up. I'm going to go with what I've seen of both in college and the pros and what I've seen in no way indicates what you are implying.

Almost guarantee....because for Joyner's entire career, he's never had an interception. So, with Randolph's first, that's like 200% better correct?
I can't find that 3rd down conversion against link....
https://www.profootballfocus.com/pro-top-25-nfl-cornerbacks-this-season/

21. Lamarcus Joyner, Los Angeles Rams, 82.1
The first CB to play primarily in the slot to make the list, Lamarcus Joyner has been excellent for the Rams when on the field this season. After his Hard Knocks drama, Joyner’s season has seen him allow just one touchdown catch, and he has been beaten for only 8.5 yards per reception. Joyner doesn’t have an interception on his stat sheet, but he has broken up four passes and hasn’t been beaten for a catch longer than 29 yards all year.

No int's....and <5 pbu's....meh...this ranking must be a joke
http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamdef
https://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/passes-intercepted-and-defensed-leaders/2016/
http://www.advancedfootballanalytics.com/index.php/home/stats/defensive-players/cornerbacks
(be careful with this last link)....seems more realistic....man, I wish I could find that link to 3rd down conversions...it has slot corners/slot wrs stats.
not sure what LaMarcus has done...I always say, what have you done for me lately....and our last game was 44-6.

 

[jrry32]

not sure what LaMarcus has done...I always say, what have you done for me lately....and our last game was 44-6.

Just to get this straight, Joyner is now getting blamed for the Rams allowing the Cardinals to score 44 points?

That's especially odd in light of the fact that Joyner didn't play in that game due to an injury.

 

[kurtfaulk]

I can't remember which writer wrote an article on Randolph being a candidate for Free Safety. It just seemed kind of out of the blue that he would find a guy who (I felt) was pretty much a Joe Average UDFA.

It would be like me writing on here that Troy Hill is in line to play corner opposite Trumaine Johnson.

It just seems a little far-fetched to me but heck I hope Brian Randolph makes All Pro at FS. Just not very likely.

That would make a story almost as good as Kurt Warner.

most people in here were high on him last offseason after seeing his sensational highlight tape. we wanted to see what he could do in preseason. alas, he was injured in the first game. it's not like they saw his name mentioned in an article a couple of weeks ago and decided to get on board.

.