Drafting a QB

[NateDawg122]

Exactly !
The trouble is Goff, lynch, Cook, and Wentz or whomever we might select in 2016 will also be completely unknown quantity -- I mean nobody knows for sure if they are gonna be above average starters or super stars

Until these young QB's have at least 2-3 years under their belt like Bridgewater, Manziel, Garropolo, or Bortles, we don't have any idea how these guys will play out -- i remember all these dudes on Ram Stalk saying we blew it big by letting RG3 slip through our hands -- but boy do we get the better of that trade. And for Washington instead of their savior 1st pick RG3 they are being led to the playoffs by a 4th round pick in Cousins - not a first or a second pick but a 4th

Good for Cousins and good for all hose who know competing is the best way to make your make in history - who cares where you are picked, just ball!!!! And we will appreciate you.

What is perplexing me and others (I think) is why those of us who aren't high on Goff or necessarily drafting a QB are met with such hostility as if one opinion matters most - we all have good ideas here and we all care deeply for this team

But what is "delusional" is thinking just by drafting a QB with the first or second is a sure fire cure all
*
Bortles is playing well but he still hasn't led his team anywhere and I doubt they get to the playoffs next year - despite that he is good and wish we had him on our team

Again..... None of us are against drafting a QB like we have the past two drafts - but it ain't gonna be Goff.

If you look at Garrett Gilbert and Sean Mannion both of which have very similar measurable a and are also sons of coaches -- this regime looks for a certain things in their prospects and take a lot of stock in their lineage, etc, I mean look at all the nepotism in this regime - fassell, Shotty,
Mannion, TJ McDonald etc....

So I'm only suggesting if you want to look for a QB prospect the Rams might draft look to Gilbert and Mannion as examples of what we are looking for. A guy like Lynch or Hackenberg is more along what Fisher and Snead are looking for in my opinion

And may I dare to suggest that going into a rough and tumblr off-season for this team that instead of insulting or ridiculing our fellow Ram brothers for their viewpoints that we embrace them and enjoy the differing opinions for what they are - pure freaking speculation.

Anyway Happy New Year

Are you seriously trying to compare the situations of the Jaguars and Rams? The Rams have an elite defense, the Jaguars don't. The Rams have a top 5 running back, the Jaguars don't. Last year the Jaguars were 32nd in passing yardage. This year they are 10th. That's the difference a good QB can make.

I hate the excuse everyone makes when it comes to drafting a QB saying that it's not a "sure thing." Well of course it's not a sure thing! No draft selection is ever a sure thing. Todd freaking Gurley wasn't a sure thing! You have to do the best evaluation you can and make the best selection. It's also fairly obvious those people who haven't actually watched film on Goff. They say "well he's not even the #1 rated QB" and "he doesn't play in a pro system." Go watch the film. He's fantastic. He is incredibly polished as a college player and has everything you want from the position. Size, arm strength, accuracy, mechanics, poise, smarts, everything.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Yes, because Hall of Famers like Donald come out every year in the draft. SMH.

That is funny because they likely got two Hall of Famers in consecutive years. There are great players in every draft. Some years there are more than others. My point was that Snead and Fisher have been hitting on the picks pretty well lately with their BPA motto. Top teams have superstars sprinkled throughout. Right now the Rams superstars are Donald and Gurley with Quinn to a lesser degree. They need a few more but giving up four first rounders will make that train screech to a halt.

Keep your disrespectful SMH's to yourself. This is not the forum for it.

Does anyone outside the organization know??

I am not sure what you are saying here. You are echoing my very thoughts, but it sounds like you think I disagree. What I said is that we don't know what they really think of Mannion. We don't know what they saw in camp. So, it is not so cut and dry to me that the 'we need to trade the future to get a QB crew is necessarily right'. Are they likely to be? Probably but we really don't know.

Taking Mannion when they did tells me they thought highly of him and realized they no longer had a longer term answer at QB. They had their opportunity and a value pick at that slot.

Or you could say that this regime has a tendency to look at extra picks in a particular round as exactly that.......an extra pick that you can take a risk with. Maybe they weren't sure that Mannion was worth a third but they had an extra one so they risked it. Or, you could say they didn't necessarily think he was worth a third but they had to attempt to get a QB of the future. We don't really know, but a few here are adamant that Mannion is not an NFL starter. I never say never. Tom Brady looked like a joke at the combine and went in the 6th round.

 

[Dieter the Brock]

Are you seriously trying to compare the situations of the Jaguars and Rams? The Rams have an elite defense, the Jaguars don't. The Rams have a top 5 running back, the Jaguars don't. Last year the Jaguars were 32nd in passing yardage. This year they are 10th. That's the difference a good QB can make.

I hate the excuse everyone makes when it comes to drafting a QB saying that it's not a "sure thing." Well of course it's not a sure thing! No draft selection is ever a sure thing. Todd freaking Gurley wasn't a sure thing! You have to do the best evaluation you can and make the best selection. It's also fairly obvious those people who haven't actually watched film on Goff. They say "well he's not even the #1 rated QB" and "he doesn't play in a pro system." Go watch the film. He's fantastic. He is incredibly polished as a college player and has everything you want from the position. Size, arm strength, accuracy, mechanics, poise, smarts, everything.

Yes yes and yes
Goff is badass but the dude is a 49er or a Brown
We unfortunately are not getting him - we aren't in position to do so - if you think we are, I can't apologize for you-- we aren't getting Goff
Goff is clearly the best QB prospect in this 2016 draft - the guy looks great - but he's not gonna be a Ram
What wrong with admitting the truth?
Goff will not be a Ram
We aren't trading the farm for him - he's a Brown or a Niner
He's that good
That leaves us with Lynch, Wentz, and Cook, and if you have to ask yourself if those guys can perform so well in their rookie year thus lead us to the playoffs -- again if this scenario exists I welcome it with open arms - but I doubt highly Wentz, Lynch, or Cook will do any better than Mannion or Keenum

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Yes yes and yes
Goff is badass but the dude is a 49er or a Brown
We unfortunately are not getting him - we aren't in position to do so - if you think we are, I can't apologize for you-- we aren't getting Goff
Goff is clearly the best QB prospect in this 2016 draft - the guy looks great - but he's not gonna be a Ram
What wrong with admitting the truth?
Goff will not be a Ram
We aren't trading the farm for him - he's a Brown or a Niner
He's that good
That leaves us with Lynch, Wentz, and Cook, and if you have to ask yourself if those guys can perform so well in their rookie year thus lead us to the playoffs -- again if this scenario exists I welcome it with open arms - but I doubt highly Wentz, Lynch, or Cook will do any better than Mannion or Keenum

I agree with you on most of it. I do think Lynch will be a top QB though, but I don't know if the Rams can trade for him. With a few teams ahead of them that need QBs I think there will be no shot to get either Lynch or Goff. The most likely scenario is that Wentz, Cook or Hackenberg are available to the Rams but right now they are being rated as 2nd round picks. I know some here love Cook, but having watched him in the B1G for a few years I am not sold. I think Mannion can do just as well. Wentz is a mystery and Hackenberg has all the tools except football instincts. Now if Mannion is really stinking it up in Rams practices then maybe then Cook is better. At least he can start right away. However, Wentz probably sits for a few years and we rely on Case Keenum or some other vet for a few years.

 

[blackbart]

I am not sure what you are saying here. You are echoing my very thoughts, but it sounds like you think I disagree. What I said is that we don't know what they really think of Mannion. We don't know what they saw in camp. So, it is not so cut and dry to me that the 'we need to trade the future to get a QB crew is necessarily right'. Are they likely to be? Probably but we really don't know.



Or you could say that this regime has a tendency to look at extra picks in a particular round as exactly that.......an extra pick that you can take a risk with. Maybe they weren't sure that Mannion was worth a third but they had an extra one so they risked it. Or, you could say they didn't necessarily think he was worth a third but they had to attempt to get a QB of the future. We don't really know, but a few here are adamant that Mannion is not an NFL starter. I never say never. Tom Brady looked like a joke at the combine and went in the 6th round.

First part is just me spit balling not really directed to anyone. I think we are right in line with each each. We just don't know what they have in Mannion or how highly they regard him.

I think this team is very close and selling out the future to take a flyer on a guy that might be an above average QB is not worth the risk.

I guess they might take more risk with those extra picks but I doubt they get away from their basic formula which has produced a good percentage of high quality players.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

First part is just me spit balling not really directed to anyone. I think we are right in line with each each. We just don't know what they have in Mannion or how highly they regard him.

I think this team is very close and selling out the future to take a flyer on a guy that might be an above average QB is not worth the risk.

I guess they might take more risk with those extra picks but I doubt they get away from their basic formula which has produced a good percentage of high quality players.

Yeah and as Dieter points out the likelihood that we are talking about the top two is slim to nil. Do the Rams trade the future for Cook, or Wentz? Not likely.

 

[jrry32]

That leaves us with Lynch, Wentz, and Cook, and if you have to ask yourself if those guys can perform so well in their rookie year thus lead us to the playoffs -- again if this scenario exists I welcome it with open arms - but I doubt highly Wentz, Lynch, or Cook will do any better than Mannion or Keenum

Maybe, maybe not. But playing the guy has more benefits than just how they do in 2016. Not to mention the fact that if they play at the same level, we come out ahead.(except for possibly Wentz)

We don't know what Mannion is and I don't see Keenum as a world beater. Don't think the bar for them to clear is very high.

 

[Stel]

One more to throw out there. Chad Kelly at Ole Miss could declare. I really like what I've seen of him.

 

[jrry32]

One more to throw out there. Chad Kelly at Ole Miss could declare. I really like what I've seen of him.

If he does, I'll evaluate him. He's got some character red flags and he didn't look good earlier this year. Hopefully, he's progressed. He is a first year starter. Nobody doubts the physical tools.

I think the smart choice for him would be to return to school.

 

[Stel]

If he does, I'll evaluate him. He's got some character red flags and he didn't look good earlier this year. Hopefully, he's progressed. He is a first year starter. Nobody doubts the physical tools.

I think the smart choice for him would be to return to school.

Normally I'd agree that he should return to school, but he is losing Treadwell and both tackles so his environment would be a lot different next season.

 

[jrry32]

Normally I'd agree that he should return to school, but he is losing Treadwell and both tackles so his environment would be a lot different next season.

That's true. But it'll also be a much weaker QB class and from all reports, Evan Engram will be returning. He's also getting Adeboyejo and Stringfellow back. They were his 2nd and 3rd leading WRs. Treadwell is a loss but Ole Miss will still have one of the more talented WR/TE corps in the country.

The OL is a concern but they're bringing in one of the best OT recruits in the nation and have some guys with experience behind their seniors. But that is a unit that'll lose quite a bit.

 

[Merlin]

If he does, I'll evaluate him. He's got some character red flags and he didn't look good earlier this year. Hopefully, he's progressed. He is a first year starter. Nobody doubts the physical tools.

I think the smart choice for him would be to return to school.

Kid played a great game tonight. Gonna be interesting to see if he declares.

Re: his past, yeah it's gonna be something teams dig bigtime on. I see him as a kid who needed to grow out of his "do you know who my family is" type of attitude and realize he can't yell at coaches if/when they bench him. That said, I do like guys who don't want to leave the field, who are insane competitors... There's a fine line there.

 

[jrry32]

Kid played a great game tonight. Gonna be interesting to see if he declares.

Re: his past, yeah it's gonna be something teams dig bigtime on. I see him as a kid who needed to grow out of his "do you know who my family is" type of attitude and realize he can't yell at coaches if/when they bench him. That said, I do like guys who don't want to leave the field, who are insane competitors... There's a fine line there.

He was booted for more than that. The straw that broke the camel's back wasn't him being benched. It was them deciding to punt on 4th down. But there were issues before that.

 

[dieterbrock]

One more to throw out there. Chad Kelly at Ole Miss could declare. I really like what I've seen of him.

No doubt. He could be the anti-Cardale Jones and strike with the iron is hot

 

[blackbart]

Hackenberg out of today's game with an injury, he's been getting the beat down.

 

[blackbart]

Maybe, maybe not. But playing the guy has more benefits than just how they do in 2016. Not to mention the fact that if they play at the same level, we come out ahead.(except for possibly Wentz)

We don't know what Mannion is and I don't see Keenum as a world beater. Don't think the bar for them to clear is very high.

I don't think most of them can make the transition and learn the offense quickly enough to be a positive influence their rookie year. Unless the guy is a bone-a-fide stud and the offense is tailored to their game sitting and learning the first year is my preferred path.

That is one of the things I like about Mannion. He had a solid base to build from and has had that red-shirt year. Too bad they don't have minor league system like MLB to develop players we would know a bit more about what they can do. Of course this game has way more chance for injury and too much money invested to subject A+ players to that.

 

[Athos]

@blackbart

Teams should be designing offenses to beat use their QBs not force them into anything.

At least the smart teams do. Look what happened with Big Ben and that O change. Lethal.

Or even Wussell. Effective playing to his talents.

And with the junk we've had at the QB position, it wouldn't be hard to make an improvement. Plus they'd have Todd. Not many rooks if any get that luxury.

 

[RamFan503]

The Giants gave up two of them for Eli Manning. The Redskins gave up the three to us and still are making the playoffs this year.(despite RGIII failing) The team can overcome it. It's worth it for a franchise QB.

I'd give up five first round picks for prime Peyton Manning or Tom Brady.

And we likely would have made the playoffs in that division. And are you putting Goff anywhere near that level?

 

[RamFan503]

Alright, let's move this conversation in a more realistic direction. Would you be willing to trade two 1st round picks, one 2nd, and a 3rd/4th to get Goff?

My answer would depend on what true NFL evaluators think of the guy. I don't personally see him worth it but if he is, someone will likely make a play. SF is in as dire of need of a QB and would only need to move up a few spots to secure him. I guess we'll see how it plays out. Would I give up those picks for the next elite QB? Absolutely.

 

[Memphis Ram]

Alright, let's move this conversation in a more realistic direction. Would you be willing to trade two 1st round picks, one 2nd, and a 3rd/4th to get Goff?

I'd rather stand pat or give up FAR less (if necessary) to select Wentz.