Covid 19 thread

[RamBall]

We are one effective ant-viral away of going back to normal.

That simple.

The biggest problem is that Trump publicly stated hydroxychloroquine was showing positive results. So of course many refuse to believe it, even though the Drs that are prescribing it are all claiming it is working great. If Trump hadnt plublicly touted hydroxychloroquine it would be the go to drug and we would get to the end of this sooner.

Hopefully this doesnt turn this discussion to a political discussion. Just stating my opinion of where we stand right now.

 

[Dieter the Brock]

Okay my girlfriend and I arrived in lovely Tucson last week. Just in Time for the state shut down preventing us from getting a place to live. So we're staying with my brother and nephew in their lovely house South of Tucson. Definitely possibilities when things turn around as there's a brand new development going up across the street with houses starting about $220,000 for a 3-bedroom 1400 square foot home and new homes going up right next door to my brother which are twice the the size and start a $350,000. Okay enough of that part. Onto what this posting is all about.

I have always believed and still do that although this is an extremely serious pandemic that it was certainly a manageable one if handled competently. But the evening of our arrival in Tucson while unpacking the car I witnessed and example of why this thing has gotten totally out of control. The people who live in this neighborhood are a mixture of professionals and military. Standing in the middle of the street talking in close proximity i.e. not practicing social distancing, where a group of six or seven neighbors. Among them were 3 military and four nurses. What were they talking about? The Governor had just ordered basically a shutdown of the state. Yet these people were planning a block party. I was dumbfounded of all people the nurses should know better. The American public has not been able to wrap their heads around this situation and do what is necessary which is to exercise self-control and common sense. These people were all in their thirties and forties they were not teenagers, they should know better but they don't. So with parents like these is it no wonder that the idiot kids are partying on the beach?

There is no question in my mind that this whole situation has been exacerbated by a lack of political leadership and personal responsibility on the part of individuals. What's so striking is that these people live in beautiful homes with adequate money to provide for the necessities. They will have jobs to go back to. What is so hard about sitting in your own backyard drinking iced coffee like we are, while listening to good music and taking in the beautiful weather?

Sahuarita is the only place i know of south of Tucson. I looked at houses down there back in 2005. My business was just starting and I would ship a ton outta this post office in Temecula where we had rented this house and the postal guy was an ex-navy cat who recommended it - he had bought a place there — but when i saw it I thought it was a total wasteland - i bet things have built out since. We ended up in Austin instead which was a good move.

There is this idea that Britain was throwing out there until the numbers came back in that was just to get everyone sick and build antibodies to it and move forward faster than the “self quarantine” idea we are doing now, which takes longer to get through. I mean, maybe they will all get this virus and survive. And then they’ll be able to get back to work.

Italy is trying to turn the page on this thing here soon - they are talking about issuing “Covid Survivor” ID’s so they can go back to work with “Covid Free” ID’d people who have yet to get sick. Then just isolating those that are.

Anyway. Stay safe man.

 

[Dieter the Brock]

The biggest problem is that Trump publicly stated hydroxychloroquine was showing positive results. So of course many refuse to believe it, even though the Drs that are prescribing it are all claiming it is working great. If Trump hadnt plublicly touted hydroxychloroquine it would be the go to drug and we would get to the end of this sooner.

Hopefully this doesnt turn this discussion to a political discussion. Just stating my opinion of where we stand right now.

That drug has shown mixed results

Check out this article for up to date products (pills, vaccines, antibodies) being used in clinical trials/ currently in development

Redirect Notice

www.google.com

 

[RamBall]

That drug has shown mixed results

Check out this article for up to date products (pills, vaccines, antibodies) being used in clinical trials/ currently in development

Redirect Notice

www.google.com

The only negative report I am aware of is the case of the husband and wife that consumed the chloroquine aquarium cleaner, which is not the same as hydroxychloroquine. I have read and seen a few interviews of Drs that believe it could be a game changer. Although if there is a shortage of the drug that creates another problem.

 

[Dieter the Brock]

The only negative report I am aware of is the case of the husband and wife that consumed the chloroquine aquarium cleaner, which is not the same as hydroxychloroquine. I have read and seen a few interviews of Drs that believe it could be a game changer. Although if there is a shortage of the drug that creates another problem.

I think those fools ate the stuff meant to clean a fishtank - maybe I’m wrong.

I’m talking about these French studies

Redirect Notice

www.google.com

COVID-19: More Hydroxychloroquine Data From France

Further promising data from the Marseille group on the impact of hydroxychloroquine for COVID-19 patients have been posted, but one French expert warns that doubts remain over the quality of the results.

www.medscape.com

Check out that list i post - there are other possible game changing drugs in trails right now

 

[thirteen28]

Oh don't try to hit me with that, of course I feel for those people.

Oh I most certainly will hit you with that. Multiple times on this thread you have stated that if the economy can't survive this lockdown, then it wasn't a good economy to begin with. Tsk tsk. No concern shown for the human toll of an economic disaster, just you wagging your finger.

However, as our economy grows and changes, that means people must be willing to adapt. Life isn't static, jobs and industries often change, innovation drives everything, and those who fail to adapt more often than not are doomed to fail. That doesn't mean I don't sympathize with those who lose their jobs, but industries dying out and job markets shifting to different types of work isn't anything new.

Complete non sequiter. We are not talking about simple innovation changing an economy over time, putting some people out of job and creating more. This is not a case of the PC displacing the mainframe and turning IBM from a giant company dominating the industry to a much smaller software and services company. The current situation is nothing even comparable to what you are discussing, so I don't know why you are even bringing it up.

This is an unprecedented shutdown of the economy, something this country has never done before, even with other pandemics. Despite what you think, the economy is not a piece of steak you can toss in the freezer and then thaw out when your ready to grill it again.

Even the strongest, most robust economies cannot take a shutdown like this without severe damage, some of which we have already seen with 10 million jobs lost in the last week. And those are just the first order effects, there will be a cascade of effects if this continues that will make the human toll far worse than what it would be if we handled the virus with a smarter, more surgical approach over the current, one-size-fits-all extreme lockdown approach.

An economy is a dynamic thing, you simply can't put it in stasis. And I can't believe I even have to type this.

I'm also not calling on many more people suffering and dying from pandemic so my stock portfolio doesn't plummet.

Yep, that's me. Rich tycoon. I'm actually not typing this post myself, my personal secretary is taking dictation. Also, I'm waiting for my butler to serve me;

(Yelling: Rochester!! Bring me my tea and crumpets, and do it now, you filthy vagabond!)

 

[thirteen28]

The biggest problem is that Trump publicly stated hydroxychloroquine was showing positive results. So of course many refuse to believe it, even though the Drs that are prescribing it are all claiming it is working great.

Dirty little secret: some people don't want that drug to work. I'll leave it to you to speculate on the motives, although I think you already have an idea.

That drug has shown mixed results

The drug has shown far more positive results than negative, enough for the FDA to approve off-label use. I posted upthread a link about a doctor who had at the time used it on 699 COVID-19 patients, with a 100% success rate. The drug is also very old, generic now, with very well-known side effects. It's been widely used (e.g., our soldiers in Vietnam were administered this drug on a widespread basis).

Another interesting data point - you know who's NOT getting COVID-19? People diagnosed with lupus. You'd think they'd be pretty vulnerable given that lupus is an autoimmune disease. But lupus patients are administered a drug to help them manage their condition. The drug is called ... hydroxychloroquine.

 

[thirteen28]

This thread in a nutshell when someone has a different opinion on how to deal with the virus, or has other concerns about the effects of the current plan:

 

[Dieter the Brock]

Dirty little secret: some people don't want that drug to work. I'll leave it to you to speculate on the motives, although I think you already have an idea.



The drug has shown far more positive results than negative, enough for the FDA to approve off-label use. I posted upthread a link about a doctor who had at the time used it on 699 COVID-19 patients, with a 100% success rate. The drug is also very old, generic now, with very well-known side effects. It's been widely used (e.g., our soldiers in Vietnam were administered this drug on a widespread basis).

Another interesting data point - you know who's NOT getting COVID-19? People diagnosed with lupus. You'd think they'd be pretty vulnerable given that lupus is an autoimmune disease. But lupus patients are administered a drug to help them manage their condition. The drug is called ... hydroxychloroquine.

Can you post the articles about Lupus patients not having flu infections. I wonder how that can be since the coronavirus is a flu virus and there are tons of coronaviruses - not just c19. Are you saying that people with lupus who are on this drug never get the flu? That would be weird. I would like to see those lucky lupus patients haha. Plus isn’t Plaquenil meant for malaria as well. I think malaria is a virus, no? Is it 100% successful with the treatment of malaria?

I would be all for Plaquenil and it’s generic version being successful for treating this version of coronavirus.

Have you seen the other drugs on the list i posted?

Fujifilm’s Avigan is a nice one too and Gilead’s remdesivir is also a strong contender.

* I will say this on a side note - conspiracy theories and theorists and alluding to them like you have is not appropriate on this forum. Personally I have appreciated all your posts, and have been totally open to all your views. Lets try and leave that stuff out of these discussions or this entire thread will get shut down.

 

[Dieter the Brock]

Results from a Controlled Trial of Hydroxychloroquine for COVID-19

A placebo-controlled trial of hydroxychloroquine in patients hospitalized with COVID-19 finds the drug shortened time to recovery, possibly lessened severity.

www.contagionlive.com

 

[thirteen28]

I will say this on a side note - conspiracy theories and theorists and alluding to them like you have is not appropriate on this forum. Personally I have appreciated all your posts, and have been totally open to all your views. Lets try and leave that stuff out of these discussions or this entire thread will get shut down.

I did nothing of the sort (alluding to conspiracy theorists), and if you took it that way, you read it wrong. Yes, my post did require reading between the lines, but it had absolutely nothing to do with any conspiracy. On the other hand, it had to do with the ugly side of human nature, especially in certain arenas that overlap with some of the nouns in the post to which I responded.

I heard about the thing with lupus in an interview, but I'll try to find a link for you. So far most of what I can find are links to articles citing an increased demand for the drug and how it's making it more difficult for lupus patients to fill their prescriptions. But that's an easy problem to overcome.

 

[Mojo Ram]

conspiracy theories and theorists and alluding to them like you have is not appropriate on this forum.

Dieter, there is no such violation on ROD, as long as the conspiracy content isn't political or religious...rare as that may be, lol.

For example, if one was to claim that mainstream media chooses to report only two statistics in relation to C19 with a bullhorn (case numbers and deaths) because it gets better ratings than say reporting case numbers recovered and pre-existing medical status/age profiles of who is dying...that wouldn't be a violation.

 

[den-the-coach]

Hopefully this doesnt turn this discussion to a political discussion. Just stating my opinion of where we stand right now.

My God, I would hope by now everyone would set aside partisan politics and focus on the true enemy defeating the various.....Anything other than working cohesively so to save lives should be damned and it doesn't matter who is able to uncover how to combat COVID-19, if it works and saves lives, then let's move forward and thank the good lord accordingly.

 

[Dieter the Brock]

Dieter, there is no such violation on ROD, as long as the conspiracy content isn't political or religious...rare as that may be, lol.

For example, if one was to claim that mainstream media chooses to report only two statistics in relation to C19 with a bullhorn (case numbers and deaths) because it gets better ratings than say reporting case numbers recovered and pre-existing medical status/age profiles of who is dying...that wouldn't be a violation.

Thought it was full on political - as if the drug is being suppressed because it’s being promoted by the president - guess i read it differently — thus the dangers of “read between the lines” type of posts

 

[Dieter the Brock]

My God, I would hope by now everyone would set aside partisan politics and focus on the true enemy defeating the various.....Anything other than working cohesively so to save lives should be damned and it doesn't matter who is able to uncover how to combat COVID-19, if it works and saves lives, then let's move forward and thank the good lord accordingly.

Yes! 1000%

 

[thirteen28]

Thought it was full on political - as if the drug is being suppressed because it’s being promoted by the president - guess i read it differently — thus the dangers of “read between the lines” type of posts

Well, full on political is not the same as conspiracy theory. And downplaying the effectiveness of something is not the same as suppressing it either.

And while I certainly share the sentiments of Den-the-Coach as expressed above, don't be naive and think that's not an issue in play here (by here I don't mean this forum, but generally in society, our own country definitely included). Sadly, that's just the way of the world, as much as we wish it were different.

It's not a pleasant thought that there are a large swath of humans that can't set aside their more petty squabbles and focus on the bigger picture. But it is what it is.

 

[Dieter the Brock]

For example, if one was to claim that mainstream media chooses to report only two statistics in relation to C19 with a bullhorn (case numbers and deaths) because it gets better ratings than say reporting case numbers recovered and pre-existing medical status/age profiles of who is dying...that wouldn't be a violation.

In regards to this above - I think the way the media is handling this is ridiculous and only making matters worse.

For example - Here

The flu has hit at least 22 million people in the U.S. so far. Four months into the flu season, at least 22 million U.S. residents have contracted influenza — and possibly as many as 31 million people, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC)

So that’s approx 31 million over the course of 4 months. If you say 30,000 in every state (50) over 6 months at 1% that would be 300 dead a month +. What would happen if the news and media outlets would publish those numbers? It would look like a pandemic, wouldn’t it? What’s going to happen next year? Will we get the flu scoreboard like we are now? Another thing is - do these tests know how to differentiate between Covid - 19 or Influenza? Anyway, it’s a huge issue how the media is playing this thing. We will find out by way of leaks and whistleblowers years from now all the bullshit that has blown thing into massive hysteria

Anyway, this is what i was getting at when I said this won’t end anytime soon. Cause the way the media is playing this is perpetuating the problem

 

[Dieter the Brock]

Well, full on political is not the same as conspiracy theory. And downplaying the effectiveness of something is not the same as suppressing it either.

And while I certainly share the sentiments of Den-the-Coach as expressed above, don't be naive and think that's not an issue in play here (by here I don't mean this forum, but generally in society, our own country definitely included). Sadly, that's just the way of the world, as much as we wish it were different.

It's not a pleasant thought that there are a large swath of humans that can't set aside their more petty squabbles and focus on the bigger picture. But it is what it is.

I get what you are saying, wrong choice of words then
I just think this will piss people off
I think you know what I am concerned about.

 

[thirteen28]

"Credulous at best
Your desire to believe in
Angels in the hearts of men
Pull your head out of your hippie haze
And give a listen
Shouldn't have to say it all again
The universe is hostile, so impersonal
Devour to survive, so it is
So it's always been"


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_TUP2vuaDs

 

[thirteen28]

I get what you are saying,
I just think this will piss people off

It might. But again, the truth is what it is.

To be clear, what I said in the post you responded to does not apply to anyone here, even those with whom I have had rather spirited debates and vehement disagreement. If nothing else, I'll give them credit for wanting this pandemic to be gone stat.

But what I said does apply to some people in the wider society of ours.