Tim Barnes why? I don't get the love?

  • To unlock all of features of Rams On Demand please take a brief moment to register. Registering is not only quick and easy, it also allows you access to additional features such as live chat, private messaging, and a host of other apps exclusive to Rams On Demand.

ausmurp

Starter
Joined
Aug 15, 2013
Messages
569
Ranked 32/40 centers that played last yr in the NFL. Pro football focus. That is literally the worst starting center in the league. Why are fans seemingly fine if Barnes is the guy? Are you all being homers or what? Dude sucks seriously. We better get a replacement or the middle of our line will suffer again. and for those pro football focus haters just watch the tape, Barnes was pushed back to the QB on passing plays quite a bit...
 

CGI_Ram

Hamburger Connoisseur
Moderator
Joined
Jun 28, 2010
Messages
48,216
Name
Burger man
Ranked 32/40 centers that played last yr in the NFL. Pro football focus. That is literally the worst starting center in the league. Why are fans seemingly fine if Barnes is the guy? Are you all being homers or what? Dude sucks seriously. We better get a replacement or the middle of our line will suffer again. and for those pro football focus haters just watch the tape, Barnes was pushed back to the QB on passing plays quite a bit...

I don't know?

Gurley gains >1100 yards on an injury shortened season.

Sacks? We were at a league low.

Not sure if you have the data to support your angst.
 

woofwoofmo

65 Toss Power Trap
Joined
Jan 23, 2014
Messages
598
For those of you using PFF as your sole measure for a player, you need to wake up and realize their stats are almost totally subjective when it comes to evaluating Offensive Lineman. You are 100% wrong in your evaluation and obviously don't watch Offensive Line play during a game or at least understand how one works. And if Barnes pass protection is so bad, explain to me how he is one of the top rated centers in the league in sacks allowed per game. His numbers are better than Mack, Frederick, Mangold among others.

Just accept the fact there's a reason the front office and coaches love this guy and that your evaluations are bogus.
 
Last edited:

Ramhusker

Rams On Demand Sponsor
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
Jul 15, 2010
Messages
14,017
Name
Bo Bowen
I'm ok with it. Could we upgrade? Sure, but I think he is a serviceable Center. Will he be going to the Pro Bowl next year? Probably not but he may be enough of a talent for the Rams to win.
 

RAMpage28

Hall of Fame
Joined
Aug 23, 2014
Messages
2,080
Not a big fan and think he can be improved upon, but I appreciate his effort and think he is valuable as a back-up
 

RamFan503

Grill and Brew Master
Moderator
Joined
Jun 24, 2010
Messages
33,961
Name
Stu
Ranked 32/40 centers that played last yr in the NFL. Pro football focus. That is literally the worst starting center in the league. Why are fans seemingly fine if Barnes is the guy? Are you all being homers or what? Dude sucks seriously. We better get a replacement or the middle of our line will suffer again. and for those pro football focus haters just watch the tape, Barnes was pushed back to the QB on passing plays quite a bit...
His first real playing time at Center and PFF has him at 32. First of all, PFF has some funky grading criteria. Second, PFF doesn't look at the overall experience standing next to him. Third, watching the guy play and get to the second and third level is likely what people saw in him. And I might suggest you watch the tape. I think you will actually find that he didn't get pushed back into the QB as often as you are trying to make out and even a homer can watch tape and see he had lapses. But trying to say that he was ACTUALLY the worst center in the league or was bad considering the situation, is ignoring what no doubt the coaches and many of us were seeing in his game.
 

RamFanWA

Rams On Demand Sponsor
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
Oct 15, 2015
Messages
3,170
Name
DavidG
Didn't Barnes land on, force or recover a couple of fumbles more than a few yards downfield?? that took some hustle!
 

-X-

Medium-sized Lebowski
Joined
Jun 20, 2010
Messages
35,576
Name
The Dude
Ranked 32/40 centers that played last yr in the NFL. Pro football focus. That is literally the worst starting center in the league. Why are fans seemingly fine if Barnes is the guy? Are you all being homers or what? Dude sucks seriously. We better get a replacement or the middle of our line will suffer again. and for those pro football focus haters just watch the tape, Barnes was pushed back to the QB on passing plays quite a bit...
K.
 

-X-

Medium-sized Lebowski
Joined
Jun 20, 2010
Messages
35,576
Name
The Dude
PFF doesn't look at the overall experience standing next to him.
It doesn't. It's an individual ranking *ANALYSIS* based on what they see a player doing on any particular play. To that end, he was the only one who had a positive grade in the 2nd Seattle game, which is indicative of how he came on in the latter half of the season.

And yeah, I'm a homer.
So what?
 

thirteen28

I like pizza.
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
Jan 15, 2013
Messages
8,368
Name
Erik
I wonder how Mike Gruttadaria rated on the '99 Rams OL ...

Point being, the whole OL grading system, in addition to being subjective, is further incomplete since you really have to evaluate OL as a unit.
 

Riverumbbq

Angry Progressive
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
May 26, 2013
Messages
11,962
Name
River
Close, … but no cigar. I'm a subscriber, and PFF graded Barnes 29 out of 39 for 2015. He was one away from dead last at mid-season, so he had improved a bit during the second half of the season. Still, there was better available thru free agency.
 

…..

Legend
Joined
Jan 26, 2013
Messages
5,089
He's serviceable, will play as good as those around him, and by now has turned into a decent professional. Quiet, no drama, knows the locker room and doesnt get hurt and miss games.

HELL YES, I want Tim Barnes on this team with that cap friendly contract.
 

RamFan503

Grill and Brew Master
Moderator
Joined
Jun 24, 2010
Messages
33,961
Name
Stu
Close, … but no cigar. I'm a subscriber, and PFF graded Barnes 29 out of 39 for 2015. He was one away from dead last at mid-season, so he had improved a bit during the second half of the season. Still, there was better available thru free agency.
While I would agree that on scores or stats or what have you, there were one or two better options through FA. How did grabbing Wells and Brown before him work out in that area? We took a run at Mack but didn't get him. I'm just not so sure that paying a 30 year old that kind of jack is wise even if he scores higher on the PFF system. Would another C coming in with no experience with our system or line mates or QB fair better than Barnes? Maybe. Maybe not. To me, he looks like a pretty good young center that is improving and has upside. Proof is always in the pudding and I too am wanting us to just get it done and challenge for the SB. I'm just not a big fan of paying huge money on a center or guard in FA. I'd rather see what we can build over time. That to me will be the way we stay consistent and in the chase each year.
 

tahoe

Pro Bowler
Joined
May 19, 2014
Messages
1,664
Why should we settle for servicable? Why should we go get the best center available?
 

woofwoofmo

65 Toss Power Trap
Joined
Jan 23, 2014
Messages
598
Close, … but no cigar. I'm a subscriber, and PFF graded Barnes 29 out of 39 for 2015. He was one away from dead last at mid-season, so he had improved a bit during the second half of the season. Still, there was better available thru free agency.

This horse has been beaten in numerous threads the last few months.:deadhorse:

For those of you who think PFF is gospel, there's no changing your minds. For those of us, which includes players and coaches, who believe PFF ratings are far from perfect and often paint a very inaccurate picture almost to the point of being laughable, they are pretty much disregarded. PFF's ratings especially when it comes to OL are almost totally subjective. They are making judgments without any knowledge of what the line call was, if the QB made a bad read, receiver ran a wrong route leading to a sack, RB hit the wrong hole, any number of variables that impact the OL. They don't take into any account the necessary cohesion in a line that leads to better play by all. When the analysis is likely done by someone who never played the game and is guessing what they think should have been done, you can understand why it's not highly regarded by players and coaches, and yes I've had those discussions with them. The Rams line all year was beaten up by PFF, yet they almost set a record for fewest sacks allowed and graded the road for the Offensive Rookie of the Year.

To me the much better indicator of a players worth and value is if a team is willing to invest and keep reinvesting in a player. The Front Office and Coaches certainly know much better what is going on than a rating service based in the UK. (No Offense @UKram ):rolllaugh:
 

Ladoc

UDFA
Joined
Jul 4, 2014
Messages
92
Name
Garth
Ranked 32/40 centers that played last yr in the NFL. Pro football focus. That is literally the worst starting center in the league. Why are fans seemingly fine if Barnes is the guy? Are you all being homers or what? Dude sucks seriously. We better get a replacement or the middle of our line will suffer again. and for those pro football focus haters just watch the tape, Barnes was pushed back to the QB on passing plays quite a bit...
I agree with you totally although he is "the best we have". Strong DTs bullrushed him all year like he was a curtain.
 

StealYoGurley

Pro Bowler
Joined
Jan 13, 2016
Messages
1,131
We all should know by now Fisher will start a rookie anywhere but center. With that in mind. Wisniewski is a slight upgrade at best? Mack? 10 mil a year for a 30 year old center with injury problems who is at best on the back end of his prime. No thanks to both. Barnes solid center who is improving and we aren't breaking the bank to see how much he improves
 

Ladoc

UDFA
Joined
Jul 4, 2014
Messages
92
Name
Garth
This horse has been beaten in numerous threads the last few months.:deadhorse:

For those of you who think PFF is gospel, there's no changing your minds. For those of us, which includes players and coaches, who believe PFF ratings are far from perfect and often paint a very inaccurate picture almost to the point of being laughable, they are pretty much disregarded. PFF's ratings especially when it comes to OL are almost totally subjective. They are making judgments without any knowledge of what the line call was, if the QB made a bad read, receiver ran a wrong route leading to a sack, RB hit the wrong hole, any number of variables that impact the OL. They don't take into any account the necessary cohesion in a line that leads to better play by all. When the analysis is likely done by someone who never played the game and is guessing what they think should have been done, you can understand why it's not highly regarded by players and coaches, and yes I've had those discussions with them. The Rams line all year was beaten up by PFF, yet they almost set a record for fewest sacks allowed and graded the road for the Offensive Rookie of the Year.

To me the much better indicator of a players worth and value is if a team is willing to invest and keep reinvesting in a player. The Front Office and Coaches certainly know much better what is going on than a rating service based in the UK. (No Offense @UKram ):rolllaugh:
Yes I agree with your synopsis outlining all the variables are not known but this is an aggregate of information that equally applied to all the other centers in the league. Why would Barnes be picked out and unfairly graded or compared to the others based on the same uncertainties.
 

DaveFan'51

Old-Timer
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
Apr 18, 2014
Messages
18,666
Name
Dave
It doesn't. It's an individual ranking *ANALYSIS* based on what they see a player doing on any particular play. To that end, he was the only one who had a positive grade in the 2nd Seattle game, which is indicative of how he came on in the latter half of the season.

And yeah, I'm a homer.
So what?
I thought Barnes seemed to be getting it all together towards the end of the season. I want to see how he looks in our next Camp! I like him!