Pead vs Stacey vs Cunningham

[albefree69]

CoachO sees the good stuff in Pead:
I know I am in the minority here, but I am seeing something totally different in Pead than the majority. Before I say why, I will be the first to acknowledge the back security is an issue, especially on the kickoff returns.

But for those of you who seem to think he hasn't shown any production carrying the ball out of the backfield, I guess we are just watching different things. Last night, his cuts were decisive, and his BEST run was called back on a holding penalty.

There isn't another RB on the roster who gets to the corner, and out runs a guy who has an angle on him on the 28 yard run. And please don't tell me he doesn't get the corner without the hold. He was already on the edge BEFORE the hold took place.

They ran him on 2 or 3 stretch plays, and his cuts were decisive, and gained 6-7 yards per carry.

I really don't understand what some people EXPECT out of him, but he has shown me he is more than capable of being a PRODUCTIVE RB in this league.

His blitz pickup is BY FAR, the best of anyone on the roster. And he seems to be showing much more confidence as the preseason as gone on.

For those of you who continue to question his role, how soon we forget about how many of Steven Jackson's typical game would be. Plenty of 1-2 yards carries, more than his share of carries for loss, then he would "break" loose for a 12-14 yard gain.

This is what I envision to happen throughout this year with BOTH Pead and Richardson. Plenty of less than stellar carries, but this difference being, when they "break" one, its going to be for 20+ yards.

Stacy will get his carries in "crunch time" short yardage situations. HE will split those reps with Richardson, most likely getting the majority of his reps to help close out games when we have the lead in the second half.

I agree with all of that and I was really impressed with his carries last night (as a RB). I'm totally unimpressed with his abilities in the return game. Using Cunningham as our kick returner will keep him active and be very effective. I see good roles for all 4 of them. Five if you count Reynolds on STs.

 

[bskrilla]

I know I am in the minority here, but I am seeing something totally different in Pead than the majority. Before I say why, I will be the first to acknowledge the back security is an issue, especially on the kickoff returns.

But for those of you who seem to think he hasn't shown any production carrying the ball out of the backfield, I guess we are just watching different things. Last night, his cuts were decisive, and his BEST run was called back on a holding penalty.

There isn't another RB on the roster who gets to the corner, and out runs a guy who has an angle on him on the 28 yard run. And please don't tell me he doesn't get the corner without the hold. He was already on the edge BEFORE the hold took place.

They ran him on 2 or 3 stretch plays, and his cuts were decisive, and gained 6-7 yards per carry.

I really don't understand what some people EXPECT out of him, but he has shown me he is more than capable of being a PRODUCTIVE RB in this league.

His blitz pickup is BY FAR, the best of anyone on the roster. And he seems to be showing much more confidence as the preseason as gone on.

For those of you who continue to question his role, how soon we forget about how many of Steven Jackson's typical game would be. Plenty of 1-2 yards carries, more than his share of carries for loss, then he would "break" loose for a 12-14 yard gain.

This is what I envision to happen throughout this year with BOTH Pead and Richardson. Plenty of less than stellar carries, but this difference being, when they "break" one, its going to be for 20+ yards.

Stacy will get his carries in "crunch time" short yardage situations. HE will split those reps with Richardson, most likely getting the majority of his reps to help close out games when we have the lead in the second half.

I'm with you CoachO. I'm beginning to think people are so turned off by his kick-returning that they gloss over how well he has played in the backfield.

 

[CoachO]

CoachO sees the good stuff in Pead:
I know I am in the minority here, but I am seeing something totally different in Pead than the majority. Before I say why, I will be the first to acknowledge the back security is an issue, especially on the kickoff returns.

But for those of you who seem to think he hasn't shown any production carrying the ball out of the backfield, I guess we are just watching different things. Last night, his cuts were decisive, and his BEST run was called back on a holding penalty.

There isn't another RB on the roster who gets to the corner, and out runs a guy who has an angle on him on the 28 yard run. And please don't tell me he doesn't get the corner without the hold. He was already on the edge BEFORE the hold took place.

They ran him on 2 or 3 stretch plays, and his cuts were decisive, and gained 6-7 yards per carry.

I really don't understand what some people EXPECT out of him, but he has shown me he is more than capable of being a PRODUCTIVE RB in this league.

His blitz pickup is BY FAR, the best of anyone on the roster. And he seems to be showing much more confidence as the preseason as gone on.

For those of you who continue to question his role, how soon we forget about how many of Steven Jackson's typical game would be. Plenty of 1-2 yards carries, more than his share of carries for loss, then he would "break" loose for a 12-14 yard gain.

This is what I envision to happen throughout this year with BOTH Pead and Richardson. Plenty of less than stellar carries, but this difference being, when they "break" one, its going to be for 20+ yards.

Stacy will get his carries in "crunch time" short yardage situations. HE will split those reps with Richardson, most likely getting the majority of his reps to help close out games when we have the lead in the second half.

I agree with all of that and I was really impressed with his carries last night (as a RB). I'm totally unimpressed with his abilities in the return game. Using Cunningham as our kick returner will keep him active and be very effective. I see good roles for all 4 of them. Five if you count Renolds on STs.

Well, its been said over and over again, the Kickoff Return aspect of the game just isn't a priority anymore. And what you see in Preseason Games are more for evaluating the BLOCKING than it is about the return guy.

So, why the KO return stuff keeps creeping its way into the conversation regarding Isaiah Pead, THE RUNNING BACK, just doesn't make sense to me.

All it does, IMO, is give the "fans" who have it out for Pead, more ammunition as to why they don't like him.

 

[Memphis Ram]

IMO, kick returning is a factor because he's not a starter. And if he's not starting, shouldn't he have some role on special teams? If not, that hurts the active game day roster.

But, in the end, I think the fumbles and the suspension are also being included in the opinions of posters. Not just the 3.3 yards per carry or special teams.

 

[CoachO]

IMO, kick returning is a factor because he's not a starter. And if he's not starting, shouldn't he have some role on special teams? If not, that hurts the active game day roster.

But, in the end, I think the fumbles and the suspension are also being included in the opinions of posters. Not just the 3.3 yards per carry or special teams.

IF they truly had a #1 RB, then yes, I would agree with you. But on THIS TEAM, like it or not, Richardson is 1A & YES, Pead will be 1B.

If you want to apply that standard, the exact same thing can be applied to Zac Stacy. He most definitely isn't considered a starter, and he doesn't add much at all to ST.

If anything, this may be the reason Cunningham is actually AHEAD of Stacy on Sundays, once Pead comes back week TWO.

Cunningham plays on coverage units on ST, Stacy doesn't play on any. Cunningham may in fact be the KO Return guy, especially week ONE, and that may catapult him ahead of Stacy.

Just don't see them dressing all 4 guys on Sundays. So, if it applies to Pead, who WILL play, then why doesn't it apply to Stacy.

 

[Zaphod]

Starter doesn't mean as much.

Richardson won't be the bell cow that Jackson was. So he'll be splitting time with Pead, who will also be used a lot in single back shot gun third down situations to keep the defense honest.

After that, they'll be throwing Cunningham and Stacy out there when they need a bigger back.

 

[Rabid Ram]

Pass blocking can be improved and i think cunningham has the drive to do it. Pead has talent dont get me wrong but he isnt consistent enough for the nfl. I really dont care of your comparisons of sj to him they are 2 different styles of running back. Pead rarely waits for a hole and is to fast to the hole, or he bounces outside way to fast yet agan not giving a hole time to develop. Pead also dances to much instead of just planting and taking 1 to 3 yards he ends up with negative yards.

 

[albefree69]

CoachO saying things I don't agree with:
Well, its been said over and over again, the Kickoff Return aspect of the game just isn't a priority anymore. And what you see in Preseason Games are more for evaluating the BLOCKING than it is about the return guy.

I'm not sure where you've heard that being said, but I've heard no one say that the Kickoff Return part of STs isn't a priority. More than 50% of all kickoffs are still being returned. It is still a priority to everyone from what I've read.

As for the second sentence, I see that differently too. The only part of the Kickoff Return game that is different in preseason is which kicks the returners choose to bring out. Some kicks that wouldn't normally be returned are being returned for the reason you mentioned.

So, why the KO return stuff keeps creeping its way into the conversation regarding Isaiah Pead, THE RUNNING BACK, just doesn't make sense to me.

This issue is not creeping into the discussion about Pead the RB, it's a very pertinent part of the discussion of who should be returning kickoffs. Pead just happens to be one of the players who are being looked at to fill that role.Every role, including ST play, should be part of the conversation about the relative worth of a player to the team IMO.

All it does, IMO, is give the "fans" who have it out for Pead, more ammunition as to why they don't like him.

Where would we be if we didn't say something because someone with an agenda might twist it to support their hate? I know of no one on this board who fits that description. Even if there were posters like that I would not let that effect what I chose to write.

 

[RamFan503]

Pead is still #2 without a doubt.. Although I think it's possible Cunningham just made a huge statement tonight vs stacy

I agree,but only because he's the investment. He'll get more chances to prove he's an NFL back. Thats fine,but the "other guys" are doing more in my eyes in terms of showing that they want the #2 job with their play on the field and just plain running harder. Pead got additional PT vs the Ravens scrubs tonite and he had one good run IMO(and an outstanding blitz pickup). Not enough for me. Maybe im being unfair? I dont think so.

Show me something.

I don't think it has anything to do with his draft position - he's out played the other 2 in stacy and cunningham (i like cunningham but he's vs guys that won't be playing in the nfl next week)..and Pead has been without question the best back in pass protection - head and shoulders above the other 3. He'll be #2 for that reason alone.

And of all 3 backs I like Pead the most physically

This^^^

 

[rhinobean]

Memphis, I watched the play over and it sounds like Faulk was politely saying Pead wasn't carrying the ball right. My bad! Hate to see any of our players fumble, good D play or not!

 

[Rabid Ram]

IMO, kick returning is a factor because he's not a starter. And if he's not starting, shouldn't he have some role on special teams? If not, that hurts the active game day roster.

But, in the end, I think the fumbles and the suspension are also being included in the opinions of posters. Not just the 3.3 yards per carry or special teams.

IF they truly had a #1 RB, then yes, I would agree with you. But on THIS TEAM, like it or not, Richardson is 1A & YES, Pead will be 1B.

If you want to apply that standard, the exact same thing can be applied to Zac Stacy. He most definitely isn't considered a starter, and he doesn't add much at all to ST.

If anything, this may be the reason Cunningham is actually AHEAD of Stacy on Sundays, once Pead comes back week TWO.

Cunningham plays on coverage units on ST, Stacy doesn't play on any. Cunningham may in fact be the KO Return guy, especially week ONE, and that may catapult him ahead of Stacy.

Just don't see them dressing all 4 guys on Sundays. So, if it applies to Pead, who WILL play, then why doesn't it apply to Stacy.

I think we can get your point without all the use of capslock. I respect alot of what you say but the capslock gets kinda to where it feels you are trying to put an exclamation on the fact that your opinion is the only right opinion. I know you aren't trying to just trying to let you know how it comes across.

 

[bskrilla]

Pass blocking can be improved and i think cunningham has the drive to do it. Pead has talent dont get me wrong but he isnt consistent enough for the nfl. I really dont care of your comparisons of sj to him they are 2 different styles of running back. Pead rarely waits for a hole and is to fast to the hole, or he bounces outside way to fast yet agan not giving a hole time to develop. Pead also dances to much instead of just planting and taking 1 to 3 yards he ends up with negative yards.

I haven't noticed this as a major trend and it definitely didn't happen last night. Here are his runs.

6,5,6,3,2,3,2

And then he had the 28 yarder called back on holding.

Also caught 2 passes for 16 yards.

 

[Memphis Ram]

IMO, kick returning is a factor because he's not a starter. And if he's not starting, shouldn't he have some role on special teams? If not, that hurts the active game day roster.

But, in the end, I think the fumbles and the suspension are also being included in the opinions of posters. Not just the 3.3 yards per carry or special teams.

IF they truly had a #1 RB, then yes, I would agree with you. But on THIS TEAM, like it or not, Richardson is 1A & YES, Pead will be 1B.

If you want to apply that standard, the exact same thing can be applied to Zac Stacy. He most definitely isn't considered a starter, and he doesn't add much at all to ST.

If anything, this may be the reason Cunningham is actually AHEAD of Stacy on Sundays, once Pead comes back week TWO.

Cunningham plays on coverage units on ST, Stacy doesn't play on any. Cunningham may in fact be the KO Return guy, especially week ONE, and that may catapult him ahead of Stacy.

Just don't see them dressing all 4 guys on Sundays. So, if it applies to Pead, who WILL play, then why doesn't it apply to Stacy.

But, who said that it doesn't apply to Stacy? Not me.

Quite frankly, while I'm not a Pead fan, I'm probably not as down on him as some others. As stated in other threads, I'm fine with him as a 3rd down back.

That said, while you've gone to the practices and have seen and talked to some people in the know, when I see that the 1A RB only has 9 carries in the preseason and the so-called 1B back lead the team with 26, I can't help but to wonder how sold they are on him. For all we know they could be showcasing and shopping him.

 

[RamFan503]

I think we can get your point without all the use of capslock. I respect alot of what you say but the capslock gets kinda to where it feels you are trying to put an exclamation on the fact that your opinion is the only right opinion. I know you aren't trying to just trying to let you know how it comes across.

I didn't get that at all. It is often easier to use caps to add some emphasis on a few words than italics because italics don't really show all that well. I would agree if there were an inordinate number of caps used as that always comes off as screaming your point but... I think a lot of us can come off like we think our opinion is fact but it doesn't seem to take caps for me to leave with that feeling.

Of course, it may not hurt that I agreed with him. :sly:

 

[RamFan503]

That said, while you've gone to the practices and have seen and talked to some people in the know, when I see that the 1A RB only has 9 carries in the preseason and the so-called 1B back lead the team with 26, I can't help but to wonder how sold they are on him. For all we know they could be showcasing and shopping him.

Could be. Guess we'll see. It wouldn't surprise me with this staff. They seem to be willing to try almost anything to work the roster.

 

[CGI_Ram]

We've got a lot more data on Pead that we do Stacy and Cunningham.

To me, the depth chart is;

Richardson
Stacy
Cunningham
Pead

 

[RamFan503]

We've got a lot more data on Pead that we do Stacy and Cunningham.

To me, the depth chart is;

Richardson
Stacy
Cunningham
Pead

Hater! :tooth:

 

[DR RAM]

I think we can get your point without all the use of capslock. I respect alot of what you say but the capslock gets kinda to where it feels you are trying to put an exclamation on the fact that your opinion is the only right opinion. I know you aren't trying to just trying to let you know how it comes across.

I didn't get that at all. It is often easier to use caps to add some emphasis on a few words than italics because italics don't really show all that well. I would agree if there were an inordinate number of caps used as that always comes off as screaming your point but... I think a lot of us can come off like we think our opinion is fact but it doesn't seem to take caps for me to leave with that feeling.

Of course, it may not hurt that I agreed with him. :sly:

I use caplocks too, and I do it for emphasis.

 

[CGI_Ram]

We've got a lot more data on Pead that we do Stacy and Cunningham.

To me, the depth chart is;

Richardson
Stacy
Cunningham
Pead

Hater! :tooth:

That wasn't an option! I chose realist! :sly:

I'm not rooting against anyone.

 

[Rabid Ram]

We've got a lot more data on Pead that we do Stacy and Cunningham.

To me, the depth chart is;

Richardson
Stacy
Cunningham
Pead

Hater! :tooth:

That wasn't an option! I chose realist! :sly:

I'm not rooting against anyone.

more like
Richardson
Cunningham
Stacy
Pead