Memento's Final Shot at a 2015 NFL Draft.

  • To unlock all of features of Rams On Demand please take a brief moment to register. Registering is not only quick and easy, it also allows you access to additional features such as live chat, private messaging, and a host of other apps exclusive to Rams On Demand.

Memento

Your (Somewhat) Friendly Neighborhood Authoress.
Joined
Jul 30, 2010
Messages
17,384
Name
Jemma
Not going to guess with free agents at this point. This is strictly a trade/draft/priority UDFA thread.

TRADES:

#10 overall to the New Orleans Saints for #13 overall, #78 overall, and a 2016 third.

Cooper and White are both way off the board in this scenario (the first round plays out this way: Winston, Williams, Fowler, White, Mariota [Eagles], Beasley, Cooper, Ray, Shelton). New Orleans can't believe that Bud Dupree is still on the board, and they move up as insurance to take him to be their future defensive star. Meanwhile, we get their first, their later third, and a future third for ammunition to get a franchise quarterback next year. Not bad.

Zac Stacy to the San Diego Chargers for the #153 overall pick (5th).

The Chargers currently have nothing at running back, and they're built to run the ball. A fifth round pick is a fair trade for Stacy, who has the potential to be a solid number two behind whichever running back they draft, be it Gurley or Gordon.

#41 overall to the Detroit Lions for #54 overall and #88 overall.

With A.J. Cann and Quinten Rollins both gone and Jordan Phillips still on the board when we pick because of back issues, Detroit gladly sacrifices their second and third (they do not have a fourth in this draft) to take Phillips, a talent who would be top twenty if he was healthy, and - if he reaches his full potential - could be a slightly-lesser Dontari Poe.

Chris Givens to the Baltimore Ravens for a 2016 seventh.

Simply getting something for Givens, who walks at the end of this year. Without Torrey Smith and Jacoby Jones, the Ravens no longer have a deep threat. They take a flyer on Givens to see if they can get something from him.

William Hayes and Eugene Sims to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers for a 2016 fourth and sixth.

It's the last year of Hayes' and Sims' contracts, but Tampa is desperate for any kind talent at defensive end (they lost Clayborn, cut Johnson, will probably lose a massive disappointment in Bowers, have signed a bust in English and a perennial underachiever in Sidbury, Gholston is always hurt and ineffective, and with all due respect to Jacquies Smith, a Mizzou alumni, if he's your starter, you're in serious trouble). They have holes practically everywhere, and they have no veteran leadership at defensive end. Hayes and Sims aren't going to be re-signed, so why not get something for them before they leave? A short-term risk? Yeah. Could it pay off long-term. Yes.

DRAFT:

#13 - Andrus Peat, OT, Stanford.

0ap2000000368585.jpg


Comparison - slightly better D'Brickshaw Ferguson.

A true dancing bear (6'7", 313 lbs.) with plenty of room to pack fifteen more pounds on his frame. Very quick feet, which he uses to mirror pass-rushers. Strong lower body and wide base which stones bull-rushers cold. Good punch, could work on it. Good, but not consistently so at the second level; when he gets to his man, it's over, but he needs to do it all the time. Surprisingly underrated run-blocker; not nearly as good as G-Rob was coming out. Needs to put a little more nastiness in his game. Pass-protection, while it's good, has mechanical flaws; he will come off too high at times. Occasionally gets lazy and bends at the waist, although he is a natural knee-bender. Intelligent and comes from a PBS scheme already. A rare high-floor, high-ceiling prospect. Low-risk, very-high reward.

#54 - Rashad Greene, WR, Florida State.

rashad-greene-ncaa-football-clemson-florida-state-850x560.jpg


Comparison - poor man's Isaac Bruce.

If Cooper had stayed, would have been the best route-runner in this class. More consistent deep threat than Perriman because of his ability to sell his routes. Fast in pads, accelerates out of cuts, great hands, and the ability to make all of the NFL catches. Rail-thin frame (5'11", 182 lbs.) with not much room to grow. Not the athlete that Cooper, White, or Perriman are. Lacks functional strength in blocking and in contesting catches. Not afraid to go over the middle and always pops back up after he takes a lick. Intelligent; will have no trouble grasping an NFL playbook. Maturity and leadership are both off the charts. Can play X, Y, and Z. Is a consummate professional and teammate. Low-risk, high-reward.

#72 - Ty Sambrailo, OT, Colorado State.

hi-res-6e7121434e2a317ee1f3ddcd1142f5ff_crop_north.jpg


Comparison - taller prime Harvey Dahl.

Big (6'6", 311 lbs.) with a nasty streak the size of Antarctica. Four-year starter with versatility to play three positions on the line (right tackle, right guard, left guard). Team captain. Not the best athlete, but he gets the job done. Hard worker and holds others accountable. Lacks functional strength; really needs to spend a ton of time in an NFL weight room. Sound technique. Character issues in 2012 need to be explored further. Minor durability concerns. Plays through injury. Low-risk, medium-high reward.

#78 - Paul Dawson, LB, TCU.

8726


Comparison - smaller Lavonte David/Vontaze Burflict.

Don't care about atrocious Combine; he proved his worth on film. Extremely talented in pass-coverage, hits like a tank, doesn't back down from anyone. Nearly impossible to block at the second level, blitzes well, uncanny instincts, sideline-to-sideline defender. Practices and plays at full-throttle; doesn't know the meaning of taking it easy. Wish that his film habits were as good as his game habits. Major character issues. Not loved by TCU. Needs to stick to Laurinaitis' hip pocket. Short (6'0", 235 lbs.), may need to stick at WILL. High-risk, high-reward.

#88 - Ifo Ekpre-Olomu, CB, Oregon.

6a839a0e3ea191289f9a77b5642983b5_400x400.png


Comparison - Brent Grimes.

Would be first-round pick if not for ACL. Turnover machine (eighteen career takeaways), small (5'9", 192 lbs.), but sound in run-support, swivel hips, extremely instinctive. Competitive, hard worker, diagnoses plays when they happen and quick-twitch athleticism allows him to make plays. Lacks extraordinary speed, struggles with physical receivers, lacks makeup speed. ACL to consider. Can easily play in press or off-man coverage. Will need to start season on IR or PUP. Medium-risk, high-reward.

#119 - Lynden Trail, DE, Norfolk State.

5fa842_5b5a8f23908b47df9a82e8c243ba3b0c.jpg_srz_970_510_85_22_0.50_1.20_0.00_jpg_srz


Comparison - very raw Willie McGinest.

Definitely looks the part (6'7", 269 lbs. with almost 35" arms), has the speed for the part, but doesn't play the part...yet. Oozes potential, but too raw to translate into games as of now. Doesn't turn speed into power. Really needs to work on technique if he's going to be a starter, but Waufle can easily teach that. Hard worker and coachable. Too passive; should change when he focuses on defensive end position instead of tight end. Should probably be much later, but someone's going to take this kid on his potential. Might as well be us. High-risk, very-high-reward.

#153 - Jamil Douglas, OG, Arizona State.

17051890-mmmain.jpg


Comparison - rich man's Earl Watford.

Strictly a guard and somewhat light for a PBS (6'4", 306 lbs.), but looks the part (body fat in the teens), has a huge mean streak, and is very strong (noted athletic freak and weight room warrior who translates it to the field). Overpowered unprepared opponents at left tackle. Has a tackle's feet, but is too short and doesn't have the arm length to stick there. Great at pulling, getting to the second level, and delivering blows to unsuspecting defenders. Solid in pass-protection; could struggle against exceptionally-powerful defensive tackles, but will be good against most. Character issues, but it was in 2010. Team captain. Technique concerns. Could be solid starter; will be in this league a very long time. Low-risk, medium-reward.

#215 - Ryan Delaire, DE, Towson.

77661403.jpg


Comparison - broke man's Jadeveon Clowney.

Incredible speed off the edge. Wasn't able to showcase it at the Combine because of a groin injury and knee surgery, but is an incredibly-gifted and lengthy (6'4", 257 lbs.) pass-rusher who has recorded two double-digit sack seasons, as well as 14.5 tfls and three forced fumbles in his senior year. Late bloomer. Needs to put bulk on his frame to stay at end. Needs to learn more pass-rushing moves besides a speed rush, but Waufle should help in that regard. Has proved his worth against D1 teams as well as top D2 teams. Low-risk, medium-high-reward.

#227 - Terrell Watson, RB, Azusa Pacific.

600x360


Comparison - poor man's Christian Okoye.

Broke Okoye's rushing records at Azusa Pacific under the tutelage of Jackie Slater. Big (6'1", 239 lbs.) and fast (4.49 at his Pro Day) back who needs work as a pass-catcher. Uncanny vision; is like a second coach on the field. Needs to use his size more; if he did, he'd easily be a fourth-round pick. Could go higher than this, but this feels like a safe projection, due to the talent and depth in this class and his lack of physicality. Hard worker; has fought through parental abandonment (his grandparents raised him after their daughter - his mother - left him at their house) and a severe learning disability to get where he is. Durable workhorse; has never missed even a practice. High-risk, high-reward.

Priority UDFAs:

Kristjan Sokoli, DT, Buffalo.

AR-140828799.jpg&maxW=602&maxH=602&AlignV=top&Q=80


Comparison - Malik Jackson.

Albanian-born defensive tackle is not a huge pass-rushing threat, but can play nose tackle and three-technique, and Waufle can develop him further. At 6'5", 290 lbs., Sokoli dominated his Pro Day: would've had the fastest 40, highest vertical, longest broad jump, and the fastest three-cone of any defensive tackle if he had been at the Combine. He also cranked out 31 reps on the bench, which would have tied him for seventh. Workout warrior? Maybe. But he was a dominating force on Buffalo's defense even without Khalil Mack. Definitely worth a shot as a fourth defensive tackle and backup plan in case Fairley doesn't pan out. Low-risk, medium-reward.

Taylor Heinicke, QB, Old Dominion.

QAELOSMDNBYHUWF.20130606204738.jpeg


Comparison - Chase Daniel.

Timing-based system would be best for the small (6'1", 217 lbs.) Heinicke, but we're running some elements of the Packers' offense, so that's about as close to a timing-based system as you're going to get. Good release, great accuracy, better arm strength than given credit for, great pocket awareness, very good composure in the pocket. Never rattled. Can throw on the move. Highly intelligent; knows his position and how to play it. Not a starter, but could easily beat out Davis and Keenum for the backup quarterback job. Low-risk, medium reward.

Tayo Fabuluje Jr., OG, TCU.

0ap1000000230163.jpg


Comparison - Marcus Cannon.

Powerful and massive (6'6", 355 lbs.) man; once he gets his hands on you, it's all over. Age, weight, and supposed character issues for transfers knocks him out of draft, but he transferred to TCU out of homesickness, back to BYU so his sister could find a home (did not play football at BYU in that season), and transferred back to TCU. Dominated at left and right tackle for the Horned Frogs, but is strictly a right guard at the next level. Slow out of his breaks, slow to the second level, will need to cut his weight down twenty pounds in order to truly be effective. Low-risk (would be high-risk if he was drafted), medium reward.

Al-Hajj Shabazz, CB/FS, West Chester.

Clarion+2013_177.jpg


Comparison - Malcolm Butler.

Tall (6'2", 200 lbs.) shutdown cornerback in the Pennsylvania Conference (DII), may not have enough long speed to stick at cornerback, but enough physicality to move to free safety if necessary, and enough instincts to possibly remain at cornerback. Dominated NFLPA Collegiate Bowl (didn't surrender a single first down pass), was coached by Mike Martz, had glowing reviews from mentors at the Bowl, such as Hall of Famers Andre Reed and Darrell Green, as well as Az-Zahir Hakim. Really caught Reed's eye. Five interceptions, eleven pass breakups, and thirty-nine tackles when nobody tested his side. Started for West Chester as a true freshman. Hard worker. Could back up Joyner at free safety and replace Cody Davis. Low-risk, medium-reward.

Mark Nzeocha, OLB, Wyoming.

543d9493107de.preview-620.jpg


Comparison - Bryan Braman

German-born player is raw as all get out, but is also an unbelievable athlete and was Wyoming's best player before he went down with an ACL. Could immediately be a special teams dynamo. Has improved every year. Former safety has enough meat on him (6'3",. 237 lbs.) to play both outside linebacker positions. Might need to be on IR or PUP like IEO, but definitely worth a look at. Low-risk (medium if drafted), medium-reward.

53-Man Roster:

(Italics = starter)

QB - Nick Foles, Taylor Heinicke, Case Keenum.

RB - Tre Mason, Benny Cunningham, Terrell Watson, Trey Watts, Chase Reynolds.

WR - Kenny Britt, Stedman Bailey, Tavon Austin, Brian Quick, Rashad Greene.

TE - Jared Cook, Lance Kendricks, Cory Harkey.

OL - Greg Robinson, Ty Sambrailo, Demetrius Rhaney, Rodger Saffold, Andrus Peat, Barrett Jones, Garrett Reynolds, Jamil Douglas, Tayo Fabuluje.

DE - Robert Quinn, Chris Long, Ryan Delaire, Ethan Westbrooks, Lynden Trail.

DT - Aaron Donald, Michael Brockers, Nick Fairley, Kristjan Sokoli.

OLB - Alec Ogletree, Akeem Ayers, Paul Dawson, Maurice Alexander, Korey Toomer.

MLB - James Laurinaitis, Daren Bates.

CB - Janoris Jenkins, Trumaine Johnson, E.J. Gaines, Marcus Roberson, Al-Hajj Shabazz.

FS - Lamarcus Joyner, Rodney McLeod.

SS - T.J. McDonald, Mark Barron.

K - Greg Zuerlein.

P - Johnny Hekker.

LS - Jake McQuaide.

KR - Benny Cunningham.

PR - Tavon Austin.

IR/PUP - Ifo Ekpre-Olomu, Mark Nzeocha.

2016 draft picks:

1st.

2nd (Eagles).

2nd.

3rd (Saints).

3rd/4th (based on Eagles trade).

4th (Buccaneers).

5th.

6th (Buccaneers).

6th.

7th (Ravens).
 
Last edited:

thehammer

Rookie
Joined
Jul 2, 2010
Messages
245
any mock that has Mark Nzeocha, Al-Hajj Shabazz, Terrell Watson, Ryan Delaire, Ifo Ekpre-Olomu and Jamil Douglas in it gets my attention...hope we draft Peat if Scherff is gone
 

paceram

Pro Bowler
Joined
Jul 29, 2010
Messages
1,732
any mock that has Mark Nzeocha, Al-Hajj Shabazz, Terrell Watson, Ryan Delaire, Ifo Ekpre-Olomu and Jamil Douglas in it gets my attention...hope we draft Peat if Scherff is gone

Agree! Peat is my 1st Round OL hope if Scherff is already gone!
 

DaveFan'51

Old-Timer
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
Apr 18, 2014
Messages
18,666
Name
Dave
Well to say I don't care for this mock would be a massive under-statement, Peat is OK, But I just think we can do better than all the rest!
William Hayes and Eugene Sims to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers for a 2016 fourth and sixth.
And I don't think you got good value with your trades, especially with this^! Your trading our best D-Line Depth for 'Future Picks' would KILL our rotation!! JMHO
 

Memento

Your (Somewhat) Friendly Neighborhood Authoress.
Joined
Jul 30, 2010
Messages
17,384
Name
Jemma
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #5
Well to say I don't care for this mock would be a massive under-statement, Peat is OK, But I just think we can do better than all the rest!

And I don't think you got good value with your trades, especially with this^! Your trading our best D-Line Depth for 'Future Picks' would KILL our rotation!! JMHO

Better than Greene, Dawson, Sambrailo, and Ekpre-Olomu? Greene is a pro-ready receiver who has significant upside; he's - in my honest opinion - the fourth-best draftable receiver in this class (behind Cooper, White, and Parker). Dawson is probably the best linebacker in the draft, if not for character issues. Sambrailo is probably the best offensive lineman at that point in the draft. Ekpre-Olomu would be an easy first-round pick without that ACL. I'll freely admit that the others seem underwhelming, but there is significant upside with all of them. That's what I go for: upside.

As for the trade values...we're not going to get a second from the Saints by moving down three slots. We're lucky to get that future third. Stacy is well-worth a fifth. A second and third for our second (Lions trade) is quite good; if it were another team, it would possibly be their second and a fourth. Givens has no value; the only reason that the Ravens take a flyer on him is because Steve Smith is their only proven wide receiver at this time - and he's no deep threat at this stage of his career.

And I know that trading Hayes and Sims for futures is a short-term risk, but Westbrooks is a good backup option for both sides, and I'd rather not let them walk for absolutely nothing, especially when there's a deep defensive line class such as this one.

But I respect your honest opinion. I just have to disagree with it.
 

Memphis Ram

Legend
Joined
Jun 26, 2010
Messages
7,008
Lost me with the many Rams slanted and/unrealistic trades.

The only two that seem somewhat realistic to me was the 2nd round trade down and the Givens deal.

And the Eugene Sims / William Hayes deal actually HURTS the team, IMO.
 

Memento

Your (Somewhat) Friendly Neighborhood Authoress.
Joined
Jul 30, 2010
Messages
17,384
Name
Jemma
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #7
Lost me with the many Rams slanted and/unrealistic trades.

The only two that seem somewhat realistic to me was the 2nd round trade down and the Givens deal.

And the Eugene Sims / William Hayes deal actually HURTS the team, IMO.

Hurts the team in the short-term. What's going to hurt the team long-term is if we have too many holes to fill in the 2016 draft and not enough picks to fill them with. We're already down maybe a third or a fourth and a seventh. We're going to need a franchise quarterback in the first/second round, possibly another wide receiver or two, at least one cornerback (because re-signing both Jenkins and Johnson is highly unlikely, if not impossible), possibly strong safety (Barron), definitely at least one defensive end (if only for Chris Long being a cap casualty, not to mention that we probably will not re-sign Hayes or Sims), possibly more work on the offensive line (depending on what Snisher does), possibly a kicker (if Zuerlein isn't re-signed), etc.

I know that you can't fill every hole in a single season, I realize that I'm creating a hole short-term, but we have veteran talent across that entire defensive line already. What we don't have is young, cost-effective depth on the defensive and offensive line. Hayes and Sims already cost quite a bit towards the cap for backups. Fairley's a costly backup as well, and he's unreliable. We still have to re-sign Brockers, Barron, and one of Jenkins or Johnson (although I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if both of them left via free agency), maybe Quick if he bounces back. That's not even including next year's draft. That's a lot of money for as little cap room as we have.

Also, I gave my reasons for the other trades.
 

DaveFan'51

Old-Timer
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
Apr 18, 2014
Messages
18,666
Name
Dave
Better than Greene, Dawson, Sambrailo, and Ekpre-Olomu? Greene is a pro-ready receiver who has significant upside; he's - in my honest opinion - the fourth-best draftable receiver in this class (behind Cooper, White, and Parker). Dawson is probably the best linebacker in the draft, if not for character issues. Sambrailo is probably the best offensive lineman at that point in the draft. Ekpre-Olomu would be an easy first-round pick without that ACL. I'll freely admit that the others seem underwhelming, but there is significant upside with all of them. That's what I go for: upside.

As for the trade values...we're not going to get a second from the Saints by moving down three slots. We're lucky to get that future third. Stacy is well-worth a fifth. A second and third for our second (Lions trade) is quite good; if it were another team, it would possibly be their second and a fourth. Givens has no value; the only reason that the Ravens take a flyer on him is because Steve Smith is their only proven wide receiver at this time - and he's no deep threat at this stage of his career.

And I know that trading Hayes and Sims for futures is a short-term risk, but Westbrooks is a good backup option for both sides, and I'd rather not let them walk for absolutely nothing, especially when there's a deep defensive line class such as this one.

But I respect your honest opinion. I just have to disagree with it.
I respect and understand your opinion too! We just disagree! Neither one of us will probably get our way, in the end, anyway!;):)
 

leoram

LA/St Louis/LA fan
Joined
May 25, 2013
Messages
1,291
I can't fault the effort in this mock. An eye for the future sure seems to be the Snisher M.O. As outlandish as it would be to execute all these trades, I would be happy with them except for the Hayes/Sims trade. IMO, their locker room value exceeds their potential cost. This defense is coming together in performance and chemistry. I prefer the continuity.
 

Memento

Your (Somewhat) Friendly Neighborhood Authoress.
Joined
Jul 30, 2010
Messages
17,384
Name
Jemma
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #10
I can't fault the effort in this mock. An eye for the future sure seems to be the Snisher M.O. As outlandish as it would be to execute all these trades, I would be happy with them except for the Hayes/Sims trade. IMO, their locker room value exceeds their potential cost. This defense is coming together in performance and chemistry. I prefer the continuity.

If anyone can pull off those trades, it's Snead. Look what he got for Bradford. Look what he got for the 2012 #2 overall pick.

They have incredible value in the locker room. I will not deny that. But they're probably not going to be with us after the 2015/2016 season, so why not get a head start while we still can?

If we're going to compete in this division, we're going to have to do what Seattle is doing, like it or not. We're going to have to get solid finds in the later rounds and in UDFA, target our best free agents, let likeable players go or trade them for future needs (see, Malcom Smith, Brandon Browner, Max Unger for Seattle).
 

leoram

LA/St Louis/LA fan
Joined
May 25, 2013
Messages
1,291
If anyone can pull off those trades, it's Snead. Look what he got for Bradford. Look what he got for the 2012 #2 overall pick.

They have incredible value in the locker room. I will not deny that. But they're probably not going to be with us after the 2015/2016 season, so why not get a head start while we still can?

If we're going to compete in this division, we're going to have to do what Seattle is doing, like it or not. We're going to have to get solid finds in the later rounds and in UDFA, target our best free agents, let likeable players go or trade them for future needs (see, Malcom Smith, Brandon Browner, Max Unger for Seattle).

I believe they will do like they did with Barnes and Barks. They want them back at the right price. Sims won't ever be highly paid and Hayes would give us a hometown discount. And I don't like the Seahawk model in spite of recent successes,
 

Elmgrovegnome

Legend
Joined
Jan 23, 2013
Messages
22,026
That would be a risky draft. I would think Snead was partying with Reggie Bush and drank one of those special drinks that he hands out.
 

Memento

Your (Somewhat) Friendly Neighborhood Authoress.
Joined
Jul 30, 2010
Messages
17,384
Name
Jemma
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #14
I believe they will do like they did with Barnes and Barks. They want them back at the right price. Sims won't ever be highly paid and Hayes would give us a hometown discount. And I don't like the Seahawk model in spite of recent successes,

Sims is already making 1.4 million-per-year as a fourth defensive end. What do you think he's going to command on the open market? Hayes has absolutely no reason to give us a hometown discount, and he costs 3.4 million-per-year. It'll cost a fair bit to retain him; he's already our eleventh-highest paid player in overall salary and base salary, according to spotrac. Then you have Chris Long to worry about. Even if you don't like the Seahawks' model, that's going to be the way that we keep our window open. That's how you become perennial contenders in the salary cap era.

Trading away our D-line depth just isn't smart imo.

Losing three defensive linemen in one year (Long, Hayes, and Sims in 2016) and getting nothing in return is also not smart. Keeping aging or unreliable backup linemen at 3.4 (Hayes), 1.4 (Sims), and 5 million (Fairley) or higher (which will likely happen if we re-sign them in 2016) is also not a smart way to do business. That's what will happen if we don't draft one or two for the future this year. Westbrooks is ready to step in right now, but we'll need more than just him.

That would be a risky draft. I would think Snead was partying with Reggie Bush and drank one of those special drinks that he hands out.

Risky at the bottom, yes. Not at the top. All three of the top prospects are low-risk and could start immediately (with the exception of Greene, and even he has a shot to start at the number two slot if Quick isn't ready. Douglas and Delaire, despite being fifth and sixth round picks respectively, are also low-risk. Only one (Dawson) has major character issues (as Sambrailo's and Douglas' seem to have been resolved). Dawson, Trail, and Watson are the only real high-risks (as IEO's game has never been based on speed), and in all of their cases, if they pan out, they could literally start for us.
 

PressureD41

Les Snead's Draft Advisor
Rams On Demand Sponsor
Joined
Jan 9, 2012
Messages
3,806
Name
Eddy
Excellent effort but a few things that standout for me are:

A) Trading down from a premium pick at 41 for a 54 & 88 doesn't "appear" to be worth it value wise .. Since Cann is gone I would think Tre Jackson OG Fla State would be still be a possible pick.. Part of my thinking was at 41 you could pair w/ GRob a stud OG and run wild to the left. At 41 you will be able to match value and need at OG imho.

B) I too agree w/ the masses on trading away our depth at DL. Both are old and I just don't see them being valued by other teams when this draft is deep at DE. both 30+ in age.
 

Memphis Ram

Legend
Joined
Jun 26, 2010
Messages
7,008
Hurts the team in the short-term. What's going to hurt the team long-term is if we have too many holes to fill in the 2016 draft and not enough picks to fill them with. We're already down maybe a third or a fourth and a seventh. We're going to need a franchise quarterback in the first/second round, possibly another wide receiver or two, at least one cornerback (because re-signing both Jenkins and Johnson is highly unlikely, if not impossible), possibly strong safety (Barron), definitely at least one defensive end (if only for Chris Long being a cap casualty, not to mention that we probably will not re-sign Hayes or Sims), possibly more work on the offensive line (depending on what Snisher does), possibly a kicker (if Zuerlein isn't re-signed), etc.

I know that you can't fill every hole in a single season, I realize that I'm creating a hole short-term, but we have veteran talent across that entire defensive line already. What we don't have is young, cost-effective depth on the defensive and offensive line. Hayes and Sims already cost quite a bit towards the cap for backups. Fairley's a costly backup as well, and he's unreliable. We still have to re-sign Brockers, Barron, and one of Jenkins or Johnson (although I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if both of them left via free agency), maybe Quick if he bounces back. That's not even including next year's draft. That's a lot of money for as little cap room as we have.

Also, I gave my reasons for the other trades.


I see what Snead got for QBs. But, these other trades are different. What I try to to is look at the trade from both perspectives.

Example. Would I trade Stacy to the Chargers for a 5th round pick? Sure. Make it so.

But, if the tables were turned, would I want the Rams to a 5th Round pick for a backup running back who has averaged 3.9 yards per carry for his NFL career and only had 239 yards last year. No way. 7th Rounder at BEST.

As for the Bucs trade, I wouldn't even consider it from either perspective, but that's JMHO.
 

Memento

Your (Somewhat) Friendly Neighborhood Authoress.
Joined
Jul 30, 2010
Messages
17,384
Name
Jemma
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #17
Excellent effort but a few things that standout for me are:

A) Trading down from a premium pick at 41 for a 54 & 88 doesn't "appear" to be worth it value wise .. Since Cann is gone I would think Tre Jackson OG Fla State would be still be a possible pick.. Part of my thinking was at 41 you could pair w/ GRob a stud OG and run wild to the left. At 41 you will be able to match value and need at OG imho.

B) I too agree w/ the masses on trading away our depth at DL. Both are old and I just don't see them being valued by other teams when this draft is deep at DE. both 30+ in age.

I don't like any of the FSU O-linemen in this draft. Erving would've been good in the second, but people are talking about him in the teens when he's only ever been good at center. He's not even close to where Mangold and Mack were coming out. Jackson and Matias are third round picks at best who go higher because of their physical skillsets. Jackson has atrocious technique, has had trouble with his weight and conditioning. and isn't the dominant run-blocker you'd expect him to be with his size (doesn't drive through opponents). Matias is passive as a run-blocker, also has poor technique, and dropped too much weight for the Combine. Out of all of them, only Erving could help you from day one.

Hence why they're traded for Day Three futures. Tampa Bay needs some kind of veteran presence on their D-line; have you known a Lovie team to not have one or two veteran figures at end? Aside from that, Tampa has the cap room, and they could easily compete in a horrid NFC South if they have a quarterback or a running back to speak of - and they could easily have the latter if the Muscle Hamster bounces back (a possibility) and Sims stops going backwards on rushing attempts.

I see what Snead got for QBs. But, these other trades are different. What I try to to is look at the trade from both perspectives.

Example. Would I trade Stacy to the Chargers for a 5th round pick? Sure. Make it so.

But, if the tables were turned, would I want the Rams to a 5th Round pick for a backup running back who has averaged 3.9 yards per carry for his NFL career and only had 239 yards last year. No way. 7th Rounder at BEST.

If I'm the Rams, and I don't have a running back to speak of, and there's a backup on the market who rushed for almost 1,000 yards and seven touchdowns while only starting twelve games in 2013, had an 8.4 average in receptions while only receiving eighteen passes in 2014 (almost thirty in 2013, so you know he could do it if needed), then I'd gladly give a fifth (because what running back are you going to find that's better in the fifth round? Josh Robinson's gone by the time the Chargers pick in the fifth round, and he's the only one superior to Stacy from a skillset standpoint) and draft Gordon or Gurley to compliment him. You don't need Stacy to be the guy with one of those two ahead of him; you just need him to spell them when they get tired.

Stacy is well worth a fifth to a running team that is completely lacking any sort of running back.
 

Elmgrovegnome

Legend
Joined
Jan 23, 2013
Messages
22,026
Sims is already making 1.4 million-per-year as a fourth defensive end. What do you think he's going to command on the open market? Hayes has absolutely no reason to give us a hometown discount, and he costs 3.4 million-per-year. It'll cost a fair bit to retain him; he's already our eleventh-highest paid player in overall salary and base salary, according to spotrac. Then you have Chris Long to worry about. Even if you don't like the Seahawks' model, that's going to be the way that we keep our window open. That's how you become perennial contenders in the salary cap era.



Losing three defensive linemen in one year (Long, Hayes, and Sims in 2016) and getting nothing in return is also not smart. Keeping aging or unreliable backup linemen at 3.4 (Hayes), 1.4 (Sims), and 5 million (Fairley) or higher (which will likely happen if we re-sign them in 2016) is also not a smart way to do business. That's what will happen if we don't draft one or two for the future this year. Westbrooks is ready to step in right now, but we'll need more than just him.



Risky at the bottom, yes. Not at the top. All three of the top prospects are low-risk and could start immediately (with the exception of Greene, and even he has a shot to start at the number two slot if Quick isn't ready. Douglas and Delaire, despite being fifth and sixth round picks respectively, are also low-risk. Only one (Dawson) has major character issues (as Sambrailo's and Douglas' seem to have been resolved). Dawson, Trail, and Watson are the only real high-risks (as IEO's game has never been based on speed), and in all of their cases, if they pan out, they could literally start for us.

I mostly was referring to trading away the teams Dline depth for draft picks, considering draft picks miss way more often than they hit. The chances of getting two depth players that produce as much as William Hayes and Eugene Sims is not likely, especially with third day picks.

Otherwise I don't like Sambrailos soft body, I could live with Dawson's attitude to a degree but his speed is worrisome. I don't think Greene is an improvement over what the Rams have at WR. I have never been a fan of Peat either. He is what I call a Woulda, Coulda, shoulda player. It's funny how so many felt this way but changed their minds once they saw he was visiting the Rams. Now many like him at ten even.

Of course I could be wrong about all of this but I am just going by what I think I know, like everyone else does. I don't mean to offend.
 

Memento

Your (Somewhat) Friendly Neighborhood Authoress.
Joined
Jul 30, 2010
Messages
17,384
Name
Jemma
  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #19
I mostly was referring to trading away the teams Dline depth for draft picks, considering draft picks miss way more often than they hit. The chances of getting two depth players that produce as much as William Hayes and Eugene Sims is not likely, especially with third day picks.

Otherwise I don't like Sambrailos soft body, I could live with Dawson's attitude to a degree but his speed is worrisome. I don't think Greene is an improvement over what the Rams have at WR. I have never been a fan of Peat either. He is what I call a Woulda, Coulda, shoulda player. It's funny how so many felt this way but changed their minds once they saw he was visiting the Rams. Now many like him at ten even.

Of course I could be wrong about all of this but I am just going by what I think I know, like everyone else does. I don't mean to offend.

Hayes and Sims were both third day picks as well. Fourth and sixth round respectively. Just like Trail and Delaire. Fourth and sixth round respectively. Plus we have Ethan Westbrooks to pick up some left end snaps while Trail acclimates to the NFL. Delaire can play special teams (taking Sims' spot).

Sambrailo has a soft body, yeah. He can still start at left guard while getting a year in an NFL weight room. Dawson's speed isn't the question, unless you're talking Combine times (and Burflict was worse, so...yeah). Greene is easily an improvement over Quick. I wouldn't make an Isaac Bruce comparison lightly. And that's why I traded down to take Peat. He's the rare guy in the top of this class who has a high floor. Probably the only tackle in this class with a high floor. And I always had a good feeling about Peat.

And I know you don't mean to offend. I appreciate what you're saying, I honestly do. It would be a very dull world if everyone agreed on everything, you know. :)