Lynn Swann doesn’t see Megatron as a Hall of Famer

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Prime Time

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I would have to vehemently disagree with Swann. He was a very good player on a great team that won four Super Bowls. In his first Super Bowl he didn't even make a catch. In the Super Bowl against the Rams he caught five for 79 yards and one TD.

If Hall of Fame selections were based on a player's team winning a Super Bowl then there would be lots of players excluded. Eric Dickerson, Deacon Jones, Merlin Olson, Jackie Slater, and Jack Youngblood being among them.

Calvin Johnson just got stuck with a bad franchise but played great for them.
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http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/02/10/lynn-swann-doesnt-see-megatron-as-a-hall-of-famer/

Lynn Swann doesn’t see Megatron as a Hall of Famer
Posted by Michael David Smith on February 10, 2016

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AP

Former Steelers receiver Lynn Swann retired at age 30 with 336 catches for 5,462 yads and 51 touchdowns. But Swann says that Calvin Johnson, who’s expected to retire at the age of 30 with 731 catches for 11,619 yards and 83 touchdowns, shouldn’t join him in the Hall of Fame.

“I would think that it would be difficult for Calvin Johnson at this point to be considered a Hall of Famer,” Swann told the Detroit News. “Calvin Johnson has an extreme amount of talent and ability, but when you start to look at his team, the success of his team and did he lift that team; he made them a little bit better, but at the end of the day, I’m not quite sure.”

That argument is, frankly, ridiculous. Swann is essentially saying that because he won four Super Bowl rings on a 1970s Steelers team that was among the most talented ever, he belongs in the Hall of Fame. But because Johnson suffered the fate of being drafted onto a team built by Matt Millen, he doesn’t belong in the Hall of Fame.

Super Bowl rings are a team accomplishment, and no one would dispute that Swann was on much, much better teams than Johnson. But the Hall of Fame is about individual accomplishment, and on that score Megatron easily beats Swann. Megatron owns the all-time NFL record for receiving yards in a season, led the league in receiving yards twice and led the league in catches and touchdowns once each.

Swann never led the league in catches or yards and was only in the Top 5 in either category once, in 1977, when he was fourth in the league in receiving yards. Johnson was a first-team All-Pro three times; Swann was a first-team All-Pro once. Johnson was a six-time Pro Bowler; Swann was a three-time Pro Bowler.

But Swann harps on team accomplishments.

“Hard to say he’s going to be in the Hall of Fame when his team hasn’t gotten to a Super Bowl, and they don’t get a chance to get into the playoffs,” Swann said. “And that’s for a lot of guys across the board. If he had broken every passing record, like Danny Fouts, who didn’t win the Super Bowl, then yeah, I think there’s going to be consideration.”

Fouts didn’t actually break every passing record, but he and Swann are friends and former broadcasting colleagues, so apparently Swann is willing to bend the facts for a buddy. For Megatron, Swann would prefer to keep the Hall of Fame doors shut.
 

LACHAMP46

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Oh shit, just when I thought it was safe to come out an say I like a Steeler...See why I hate the Steelers?...Over 50% of the linemen were on Roids too I bet...He's just silly...And he didn't beat us...that other guy did...and I blame Pat Thomas & Rod Perry....With a lil help from Nolan....Ferragamo played a great game...so did....Wendel Tyler....
 

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  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
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http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...en-talking-about-hall-of-fame-qualifications/

Lynn Swann should tread lightly when talking about Hall of Fame qualifications
Posted by Mike Florio on February 10, 2016

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AP

Hall of Fame receiver Lynn Swann makes a good point about the Hall of Fame credentials of Lions receiver Calvin Johnson. Megatron simply may not have done enough in nine NFL seasons to earn a spot in Canton. By making the case against Johnson, however, Swann opens himself up for questions about his own spot in the Hall of Fame.

There’s no way the bronze bust will disintegrate, but that doesn’t mean folks can’t ask how Swann made it and argue that he shouldn’t have. Ultimately, he made it for two reasons: team accomplishments and his performance in Super Bowl X. So when Swann says Johnson doesn’t have the team accomplishments to get in, Swann is boosting his own presence by pointing out that it’s more about team achievements than individuals ones.

Indeed, if it’s about individual achievements, Swann has no business being there. He’s 222nd on the all-time receiving yardage list, via Pro Football Reference.

Not 22nd. Two hundred and 22nd.

The knee-jerk response will be this: The game has changed dramatically since then, allowing plenty of more modern players to pass him by. It’s a fair point, until considering the list.

The guy at 221, Jerry Smith with 5,496 yards, played from 1965-77. Chris Burford at 219 played from 1960-67. Ray Renfro at 218 played from 1952-63.

How about Max Speedie at 209? He generated 5,602 yards from 1946-52. Danny Abramowicz at 201 played from 1967-74. Gail Cogdill at 198 played from 1960-70.

Calvin Johnson is at 27, with 11,619 yards. That’s well over twice the amount that Swann generated for his career. And if Calvin Johnson had played for the Steelers of the ’70s, he’d easily be in the Hall of Fame.

Johnson may not make it as a Lion. But Swann probably shouldn’t have made it as a Steeler.
 

jetplt67

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Oh crap, just when I thought it was safe to come out an say I like a Steeler...See why I hate the Steelers?...Over 50% of the linemen were on Roids too I bet...He's just silly...And he didn't beat us...that other guy did...and I blame Pat Thomas & Rod Perry....With a lil help from Nolan....Ferragamo played a great game...so did....Wendel Tyler....

As my cousin was the starting LT for the Steelers for the entire 70's, if I were to say what you said about their linemen at one of my family reunions, I would be pummeled. :boxing: Was he on steroids, he sure was and still is very strong.

To the original post; "Hey Swann, those steroid shots are supposed to go into your butt not directly into your brain". Maybe he took too many SHOTS to the head?? Clearly a player and not a talent evaluator, Swann sounds really moronic for that statement.
 

Pancake

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Puhfuckinlease, Swann would have to play two of his measly careers to equal what CJ has done.

I have never agreed with the need for SB wins to be on a players resume for HOF consideration. SB wins are a measure of the team more than the player.
 

Roman Snow

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I'm sorry, but I missed the quote where Swann said he doesn't belong. Swann is not a flame thrower. He is a gentleman. These quotes speak to the current standards and what voters are looking at to earn their votes. Swann never once said he doesn't belong.

I think he should have chosen his words better, though. He's been around long enough to see how people in the media will twist words and context.

This writer obviously has a problem with Swann. Actually the schoolyard language he uses tell me he's not really a serious writer anyway.

And it is shocking looking at Swanns stats and arguing he is a Hall of Famer.
But that is why you cannot be a stats-only guy when looking at HOF qualifications. The passing game was not close to what it is today. It was rare for guys to catch even 50 balls a year. Swann was phenomenal and revolutionized the position. And he was TOUGH.

He went over the middle with the best of them. When defenders like Atkinson and Tatum would take your head off. Before receivers like Megatron were protected. They always called him "soft" because they were frustrated that he would not be intimidated. He would come back and beat them for a TD. Then he would hand the ball to the ref. Not grab his crotch, or do any other insecure look-at-me dance. Act like you've been there before. By the way I think Calvin Johnson probably is good enough for the HOF. I think we need to see the other shoe drop.

As for Fouts, he had a ton of NFL records set during his time. Some of them have since been broken by Dan Marino and Drew Brees. He had a very Warner-like career without the Super Bowls. Obviously, Swann cited him because of a personal relationship, but his point was valid.
 

LesBaker

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Swann and Namath should never have been let in the HOF. Swann wasn't even the best WR on his own team!!! If anyone should not comment on HOF credentials it's him first, then Namath.
 

LesBaker

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Oh crap, just when I thought it was safe to come out an say I like a Steeler...See why I hate the Steelers?...Over 50% of the linemen were on Roids too I bet...He's just silly...And he didn't beat us...that other guy did...and I blame Pat Thomas & Rod Perry....With a lil help from Nolan....Ferragamo played a great game...so did....Wendel Tyler....

The Chargers were the first team to use steroids, then the trainer went to work for the Steelers and they won 4 Super Bowls. You can google it and see a film and an article.

FYI not too many years ago while the Steelers were winning a couple more titles the team doctor was busted for buying HUGE amounts of HGH. As in prescription value of hundreds of thousands. ESPN did a piece on it that was good.

He was dismissed and nothing was ever made of it..........
 

Angry Ram

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This writer obviously has a problem with Swann.

Michael David Smith.

Mike Florio is the Regina George of PFT. MDS is Gretchen Weiners.

Anyway, I think what Swann is trying to say is that it's hard b/c his teams were so bad, they got down early and they had to play catch up a lot. That's where a lot of Megatron's yards came from. In fact the pass he caught to break single season record was in mop up time.

Also it's really hard for WRs to get in to begin with. There's a log jam. Just b/c you have a shit ton of yards doesn't mean you automatically should get in. You'd have to really change the game and have a historical moment (s). Right now, Julio and AJ Green could be just as good as Megatron.
 

LACHAMP46

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FYI not too many years ago while the Steelers were winning a couple more titles the team doctor was busted for buying HUGE amounts of HGH.
I remember a piece on Steve Curson (sp?) that SI wrote....I remember seeing a bunch of their players pre-maturely balding....Webster comes to mind...Several players were average college players then turned into beasts. Even that MLB...A coach of mine showed his highlight video...and all I could think of was how skinny he was, for a MLB, and he just made tons of plays... I graciously stated 50% of the line...and I'm pretty certain it was much more.....I think I remember that team doctor piece....in SI too...

His career should be re-examined. There is really no way he belongs in the hall in front of other wrs....Harold Jackson comes to mind....Hell, did Stalworth get in? I thought he was just as good as Swann.
 

DaveFan'51

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I would have to vehemently disagree with Swann. He was a very good player on a great team that won four Super Bowls. In his first Super Bowl he didn't even make a catch. In the Super Bowl against the Rams he caught five for 79 yards and one TD.

If Hall of Fame selections were based on a player's team winning a Super Bowl then there would be lots of players excluded. Eric Dickerson, Deacon Jones, Merlin Olson, Jackie Slater, and Jack Youngblood being among them.

Calvin Johnson just got stuck with a bad franchise but played great for them.
I couldn't agree with you more Prime!! Well said!!!!
 

DaveFan'51

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Oh crap, just when I thought it was safe to come out an say I like a Steeler...See why I hate the Steelers?...Over 50% of the linemen were on Roids too I bet...He's just silly...And he didn't beat us...that other guy did...and I blame Pat Thomas & Rod Perry....With a lil help from Nolan....Ferragamo played a great game...so did....Wendel Tyler....
Let's not forget JY!!!

1979-jack-youngblood.jpg
 

LesBaker

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I remember a piece on Steve Curson (sp?) that SI wrote....I remember seeing a bunch of their players pre-maturely balding....Webster comes to mind...Several players were average college players then turned into beasts. Even that MLB...A coach of mine showed his highlight video...and all I could think of was how skinny he was, for a MLB, and he just made tons of plays... I graciously stated 50% of the line...and I'm pretty certain it was much more.....I think I remember that team doctor piece....in SI too...

His career should be re-examined. There is really no way he belongs in the hall in front of other wrs....Harold Jackson comes to mind....Hell, did Stalworth get in? I thought he was just as good as Swann.

Stallworth was better than Swann for sure!!!!!

He got in a long time ago..........and he's even kinda iffy to me.
 

-X-

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I don't know if he should be a hall of famer either. Not because he isn't talented enough, but because he didn't play long enough. He's got better overall stats than a bunch of guys who are already in the hall. Art Monk, Fred Biletnikoff, Andre Reed, etc. But those guys played a bunch of years. I think if he played another 4 or 5 years, his chances would be higher, and his career would look a lot better. IMO.