Lol @ Jacksonville

[jrry32]

I don't think it's arrogance. What I'm saying is, on a professional level, there should never be a question of "what if". With what you said, I would rather take the chance to get a few more yards to get an easier attempt at a game winning field goal. If you don't get it, you have the same chance as you did before on 3rd down. And yes, I didn't realize Scobee was as good as his statistics say at longer field goals. Back to the original point, regardless of your talent, you need to be able to to take chances in the NFL. That's how you win games. Not by attempting a long field goal on 3rd and short with 12 seconds left in the game. 31 other teams would go for that first down in that situation.

There will always be a question of "what if". The Jaguars aren't QBed by Peyton Manning. They've got a rookie QB with a bad OL and mostly rookie WRs. You're risking a lot there.

31 other teams would not go for the first down in that situation. There would be a mix of teams that would try for the first and a mix of teams that would kick it...which would depend on the kicker of each team and the offensive talent/QB of each team as well as the philosophy of each coach.

Also, there's been countless coaches that came in and clearly didn't know what the freak they were doing. Spags and Linehan come to mind. You really don't think you could coach a team to a 2-14 record?

Spags and Linehan not knowing how to be head coaches has nothing to do with their overall knowledge of the game. Both of them would blow you, me, and any fan out of the water when it comes to knowledge of football. Football in the NFL is a whole another language. It takes awhile to learn it. If you were put in a room with guys like that, I doubt you could understand much of what they're talking about. Neither could I...and I know that for a fact.

Could I coach a team to a 2-14 record? I don't know. Maybe. But winning 2 games wouldn't have anything to do with my competency. It would just show how hard it is in the NFL to lose 15 or 16 games with the talent level...unless you're the 2009 Rams. I doubt I could get a single win with that team...one of the worst teams I've ever seen...if not the worst.

There's tons of different combinations of an out route. You could go bunch formation, spread, H-back. Try to get it out to your full back or something. This is obviously just nit picking but I think decisions like that are the reason teams like us and the Jaguars are at the bottom every year.

I think the whole letting the kick get blocked is a better reason for that.

 

[jrry32]

I don't think it's arrogance. What I'm saying is, on a professional level, there should never be a question of "what if". With what you said, I would rather take the chance to get a few more yards to get an easier attempt at a game winning field goal. If you don't get it, you have the same chance as you did before on 3rd down. And yes, I didn't realize Scobee was as good as his statistics say at longer field goals. Back to the original point, regardless of your talent, you need to be able to to take chances in the NFL. That's how you win games. Not by attempting a long field goal on 3rd and short with 12 seconds left in the game. 31 other teams would go for that first down in that situation.

There will always be a question of "what if". The Jaguars aren't QBed by Peyton Manning. They've got a rookie QB with a bad OL and mostly rookie WRs. You're risking a lot there.

31 other teams would not go for the first down in that situation. There would be a mix of teams that would try for the first and a mix of teams that would kick it...which would depend on the kicker of each team and the offensive talent/QB of each team as well as the philosophy of each coach.

Also, there's been countless coaches that came in and clearly didn't know what the freak they were doing. Spags and Linehan come to mind. You really don't think you could coach a team to a 2-14 record?

Spags and Linehan not knowing how to be head coaches has nothing to do with their overall knowledge of the game. Both of them would blow you, me, and any fan out of the water when it comes to knowledge of football. Football in the NFL is a whole another language. It takes awhile to learn it. If you were put in a room with guys like that, I doubt you could understand much of what they're talking about. Neither could I...and I know that for a fact.

Could I coach a team to a 2-14 record? I don't know. Maybe. But winning 2 games wouldn't have anything to do with my competency. It would just show how hard it is in the NFL to lose 15 or 16 games with the talent level...unless you're the 2009 Rams. I doubt I could get a single win with that team...one of the worst teams I've ever seen...if not the worst.

 

[Legatron4]

There will always be a question of "what if". The Jaguars aren't QBed by Peyton Manning. They've got a rookie QB with a bad OL and mostly rookie WRs. You're risking a lot there.

31 other teams would not go for the first down in that situation. There would be a mix of teams that would try for the first and a mix of teams that would kick it...which would depend on the kicker of each team and the offensive talent/QB of each team as well as the philosophy of each coach.



Spags and Linehan not knowing how to be head coaches has nothing to do with their overall knowledge of the game. Both of them would blow you, me, and any fan out of the water when it comes to knowledge of football. Football in the NFL is a whole another language. It takes awhile to learn it. If you were put in a room with guys like that, I doubt you could understand much of what they're talking about. Neither could I...and I know that for a fact.

Could I coach a team to a 2-14 record? I don't know. Maybe. But winning 2 games wouldn't have anything to do with my competency. It would just show how hard it is in the NFL to lose 15 or 16 games with the talent level...unless you're the 2009 Rams. I doubt I could get a single win with that team...one of the worst teams I've ever seen...if not the worst.



I think the whole letting the kick get blocked is a better reason for that.

Very nice argument jerry. I tend to agree with what you are saying but I never said anything about football knowledge. I'm talking about being a coach in general. I'm sure Spags knew a ton about defense but it's putting what you know to use. There were at least 2 dozen times that he would make a decision and you had to sit there and just think "wtf are you doing?". There's plenty of people who are "experts" at what they do. But when it comes to important decisions they suck at it. You can learn the X's and O's of almost anything but knowing how to use that knowledge is what matters. I'm not trying to get all philosophical over here but I think your being short sited by saying because they allegedly know so much more about the sport then us that they do a better job of utilizing talent and making decisions. Being 0-4, I would do anything I could to assure that first win. And I stick by trying to get extra yards on 3rd and short.

 

[jjab360]

Very nice argument jerry. I tend to agree with what you are saying but I never said anything about football knowledge. I'm talking about being a coach in general.

The one thing you seem to be overlooking here is that you can't be a coach without football knowledge. No offense, but that's common sense. It's like thinking you could do a better job than the president without knowing the first thing about politics...

 

[jjab360]

Idk, you said it yourself that it should have been an out. Wouldn't that be what the defense covers? Interception or sack and you are out, and who do the Jags have to lean on? If you have a Calvin Johnson, or Roddy White and Julio Jones, perhaps you try. I personally try the kick in their situation.

Pretty much, the defense is going to be all over the sidelines. Best case scenario, you take advantage of that and go down the middle and then spike the ball, but that's a huge risk with only 12 seconds left. Worst case, your QB tries to force the ball to the sideline and gets picked off, tries to throw it away and gets an intentional grounding penalty, or holds on too long and gets sacked out of FG range. Pretty much there's way more things that could go wrong than just getting an extra couple yards from a 55 yard FG which is already in your kicker's range.

Jags made the right decision.

 

[jrry32]

Very nice argument jerry. I tend to agree with what you are saying but I never said anything about football knowledge. I'm talking about being a coach in general. I'm sure Spags knew a ton about defense but it's putting what you know to use. There were at least 2 dozen times that he would make a decision and you had to sit there and just think "wtf are you doing?". There's plenty of people who are "experts" at what they do. But when it comes to important decisions they suck at it. You can learn the X's and O's of almost anything but knowing how to use that knowledge is what matters. Being 0-4, I would do anything I could to assure that first win. And I stick by trying to get extra yards on 3rd and short.

Football knowledge is a requisite of being a Head Coach in the NFL. You can't do the job without it.

I'm not trying to get all philosophical over here but I think your being short sited by saying because they allegedly know so much more about the sport then us that they do a better job of utilizing talent and making decisions.

I don't think I am. In order to utilize talent, you have to be capable of not only understanding the scheme you're using...but understanding the schemes that other teams use.

Utilizing talent is far from simple. There is no universal way of how to utilize a player. You have to utilize offensive players differently for each defensive scheme you face.

As far as decisions go, you have to be capable of getting yourself to that place where decisions are made...and you have to accept that your decision will always be second guessed by people who believe they know better than you if you get it wrong.

And the issue of it is that you rarely have much time to make these decisions. They're snap judgments that have no right and wrong answer.

I don't agree with your stance here. I think once it was your job to make those snap judgments, you'd find there are a lot of people out there that "know better than you" as soon as things don't go as planned. You could make the right decision...and still be wrong. For example, who really expects a kick to be blocked? It doesn't happen that often. Odds are that Scobee makes that FG if the kick isn't blocked. And if that happens, Bradley made the right decision. I'd say the odds of that kick being blocked are, at worst, the same as the odds that Bortles is sacked or the WR is tackled in bounds on that 3rd down play if they go for it.

 

[jrry32]

Pretty much, the defense is going to be all over the sidelines. Best case scenario, you take advantage of that and go down the middle and then spike the ball, but that's a huge risk with only 12 seconds left. Worst case, your QB tries to force the ball to the sideline and gets picked off, tries to throw it away and gets an intentional grounding penalty, or holds on too long and gets sacked out of FG range. Pretty much there's way more things that could go wrong than just getting an extra couple yards from a 55 yard FG which is already in your kicker's range.

Jags made the right decision.

I'll even back off of my earlier point that they made the "right" decision. There's plenty of argument to be made that there's no true "right" decision. But in the moment, I completely agreed with the decision they made. When the brought the kicker out, I thought it was the right move given the circumstances on offense.

 

[Legatron4]

The one thing you seem to be overlooking here is that you can't be a coach without football knowledge. No offense, but that's common sense. It's like thinking you could do a better job than the president without knowing the first thing about politics...

I didn't say you didn't require football knowledge. I thought that could go unsaid. Linehan might know more then Jason Garrett but obviously Garrett is a better NFL coach. I'm not sure why this turned into a "who knows more about football" thread. Because that's not what it's supposed to be. I believe that the Jaguars fucked up and I would have made a different decision.

 

[jjab360]

I didn't say you didn't require football knowledge. I thought that could go unsaid. Linehan might know more then Jason Garrett but obviously Garrett is a better NFL coach. I'm not sure why this turned into a "who knows more about football" thread. Because that's not what it's supposed to be. I believe that the Jaguars fucked up and I would have made a different decision.

Maybe because you said you could do the job of an NFL head coach? You didn't say you could make one decision better, you said you could do their entire job. That's a ridiculously bold statement.

 

[Ramrasta]

The Jaguars and Raiders look like they cannot pull out a win even when handed every opportunity. We might have our first ever scenario of two winless teams if they continue to find ways to fail. The Jags can't even execute the blocks necessary to get off a game winning field goal and Carr cries after throwing a misguided interception to a covered WR when they are on the edge of field goal range down by 3.

Very happy we have pulled one out already.