Jonathon Vilma file suit against Roger Goodell

[AsylumGuido]

And now for a BIGGIE.

Jonathon Vilma has just filed suit against Roger Goodell in the Eastern District of Federal Court.

See the entire suit here:

Vilma v. Goodell

You must pardon me, but I am so loving this.

:lmao:

 

[Stranger]

FUCK Yeah! And he is going to win, too, if they don't force an out of court settlement.

Now, we will finally get to expose the NFL PR BS.

"Commissioner Goodell opted to enter into the public arena rather than proceed appropriately and deliberately within the confines of the NFL process," Vilma's attorney, Peter Ginsberg told NFL.com. "In doing that, he made a series of horrific and false accusations about Jonathan. The commissioner, having wandered into the public arena, is now being asked to answer for the damage he's done in making those erroneous accusations.

"He made some serious accusations, which we will be able to prove in a fair forum, that were irresponsible."

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8 ... statements

 

[steferfootball]

Re:

freak Yeah! And he is going to win, too, if they don't force an out of court settlement.

Now, we will finally get to expose the NFL PR BS.

"Commissioner Goodell opted to enter into the public arena rather than proceed appropriately and deliberately within the confines of the NFL process," Vilma's attorney, Peter Ginsberg told NFL.com. "In doing that, he made a series of horrific and false accusations about Jonathan. The commissioner, having wandered into the public arena, is now being asked to answer for the damage he's done in making those erroneous accusations.

"He made some serious accusations, which we will be able to prove in a fair forum, that were irresponsible."

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8 ... statements

Aren't you applying for a job with the NFL BS PR?

 

[Stranger]

Re: Re:

Aren't you applying for a job with the NFL BS PR?

:cheese:

 

[Angry Ram]

I think this is stupid on Vilma's part. You got caught, somehow/someway, your name got brought up and pay the consequences. You didn't see James Harrison turn around and sue when he was made the poster boy of "improper" hits.

 

[Warner4Prez]

It does seem to be a bit of a gamble, but the whole situation is kinda fishy to me. I get that some pretty serious stuff has been said, and the Williams audio is pretty damning...but where's the real evidence? No one was ever hurt, there weren't any more dirty hits applied than what other teams were penalized for...can you really go this far with supposed intent?
The whole back and forth between Goodell/Saints has been really entertaining.

 

[Stranger]

I think this is stupid on Vilma's part. You got caught, somehow/someway, your name got brought up and pay the consequences. You didn't see James Harrison turn around and sue when he was made the poster boy of "improper" hits.

what evidence is there other than the williams' audio?

well, hopefully we find out in court what the NFL really has or does not have.


But what if Vilma is right, what if this is largely a case of heresay with no hard evidence. What then? What conclusion will you draw about Goodell, the NFL and Vilma?

 

[Thordaddy]

I think this is stupid on Vilma's part. You got caught, somehow/someway, your name got brought up and pay the consequences. You didn't see James Harrison turn around and sue when he was made the poster boy of "improper" hits.

what evidence is there other than the williams' audio?

well, hopefully we find out in court what the NFL really has or does not have.


But what if Vilma is right, what if this is largely a case of heresay with no hard evidence. What then? What conclusion will you draw about Goodell, the NFL and Vilma?

Well ,I guess there is the "what if" you raise ,but I don't think Goodell is Al Sharpton.

IMO people consistently underestimate Goodell, if he were to lose this suit ,IMO he'd be opening the league to multitudinous suits of similar nature.
Just my sense of the people involved is that Vilma is setting himself up for even more public ridicule, I seriously doubt a man entrusted with the power Goodell has been entrusted with hasn't conferred at length with learned legal council previous to taking those actions.

Greg Williams is taking the smartest course on this, shut up take your medicine and move on.

I would however like to say that IMO the year long suspension for Vilma was over the top considering he's a player and the proportional harm it does to his career vs. the harm it does to a coach being suspended for a similar period of time.

I also think the possibility that he's being funded by the union in this suit has to be considered ,which is just bazaar when it's basically the union protecting an assault by one member upon another.

 

[Stranger]

The central issue here is not public opinion but law. So, why did Goodell exclusively rely on public opinion if he had such a strong case? The only logical answer is that there are unstated motives at work.

I just hope this is allowed to come out and that Vilma does not cave to pressure. Last time we had evidence that exposed the NFL (spygate) the tapes were destroyed.

 

[Stranger]

Greg Williams is taking the smartest course on this, shut up take your medicine and move on.

I just slump down in my chair when I hear comments like this. What, a man is not allowed to defend himself in this country anymore? The little guy is supposed to just fall in-line when the big guys blast them in the media? What ever happened to the concept of burden of proof?

What is with all of this implicit trust in an organization (the NFL) with such a long track record of unethical (and illegal) behavior? These guys have never been choir boys.

 

[-X-]

Re:

Greg Williams is taking the smartest course on this, shut up take your medicine and move on.

I just slump down in my chair when I hear comments like this. What, a man is not allowed to defend himself in this country anymore? The little guy is supposed to just fall in-line when the big guys blast them in the media? What ever happened to the concept of burden of proof?

What is with all of this implicit trust in an organization (the NFL) with such a long track record of unethical (and illegal) behavior? These guys have never been choir boys.

Don't you think that if Williams was completely, 100% sure of his innocence, that he would have fought this thing already? We're only getting spoon-fed little pieces of evidence at a time. I'm not saying he's innocent or guilty, but I am saying that he doesn't seem to be the type of person to lay down under false allegations either.

 

[ramsince62]

Re:

Greg Williams is taking the smartest course on this, shut up take your medicine and move on.

I just slump down in my chair when I hear comments like this. What, a man is not allowed to defend himself in this country anymore? The little guy is supposed to just fall in-line when the big guys blast them in the media? What ever happened to the concept of burden of proof?

What is with all of this implicit trust in an organization (the NFL) with such a long track record of unethical (and illegal) behavior? These guys have never been choir boys.

Outside of defending oneself, whatever happened to accepting responsibility for ones actions?

 

[Yamahopper]

If it gets to court, and it won't we would get some transparency. But it would have nil impact on the suspensions since the time frame for a judicial verdict would exceed Vilma's punishment. And it would be nice to see the actual evidence before it's destroyed like it was in the case of pervy Pats videos.

 

[AsylumGuido]

It does seem to be a bit of a gamble, but the whole situation is kinda fishy to me. I get that some pretty serious stuff has been said, and the Williams audio is pretty damning...but where's the real evidence? No one was ever hurt, there weren't any more dirty hits applied than what other teams were penalized for...can you really go this far with supposed intent?
The whole back and forth between Goodell/Saints has been really entertaining.

It not a gamble at all if Vilma is telling the truth. There is a very real possibility that Goodell acted on misinformation and/or faulty evidence. There is very little chance that Vilma wins this suit because he would have to prove malice, but they would be able to subpoena the evidence and challenge its validity. If it proves to be invalid Goodell will still win as long as he thought it was reasonably believable. But, that would also clear Vilma's name and most likely eliminate the suspension.

And have no doubt, Vilma is doing this to clear his name. Since day one he has vehemently denied the publicized charges.

 

[Thordaddy]

Re:

Greg Williams is taking the smartest course on this, shut up take your medicine and move on.

I just slump down in my chair when I hear comments like this. What, a man is not allowed to defend himself in this country anymore? The little guy is supposed to just fall in-line when the big guys blast them in the media? What ever happened to the concept of burden of proof?

What is with all of this implicit trust in an organization (the NFL) with such a long track record of unethical (and illegal) behavior? These guys have never been choir boys.

I'll do my best to answer those questions:

First the Saints GM , HC and Asst HC ALL filed appeals which asked the league to reconsider during which whatever evidence the league had was doubtless reviewed and the commissioner gave them a chance to refute it,I assume they were unable to do so and their punishment INCLUDING the forfeiture of draft choices was upheld.

SO It would stand to reason that with the indefinite duration Goodell adjudicated was apropos for Williams,his best course of action IMO was to plead contrition and seek mercy rather than defy. Additionally considering the yearly salary Williams was due to be paid if he hadn't consulted his agent and his agent involved a lawyer he's guilty of monumentally greater stupidity than just the bounty program suggests.

It is the "age of litigation" as my Auditing text termed it, things involving 7 figures don't go down without consulting council so IMO Williams knows he's had and is again doing the right thing because he is pretty sure the "burden of proof " is prolly satisfied.

Big and little btw are terms that make me slump down in my chair because the size of the respective parties is irrelevant but clearly you think it's relevant. As you say proof not attitudes.

I do share a great deal of your mistrust of the league, but since Vilma is going outside the channels of the appeal process I doubt he has much to stand upon there and is trying to bluff the league into backing down due to the "hazards of litigation".

IMO Goodell was hired to clean up the game ,to shield the league from suit, it is inconsistent to me that he would open one door in order to try to close another.

I don't think people GET how adroit Goodell is,I would think somewhere in the suit there will be a request for an injunction prohibiting Goodell from enforcing the year long ban and attempting to delay this long enough for Vilma to play his last year then serve his suspension in a year he wasn't going to play anyway.

OTOH he may be contemplating the chewbakka defense

 

[-X-]

I also think the possibility that he's being funded by the union in this suit has to be considered ,which is just bazaar when it's basically the union protecting an assault by one member upon another.

I thought that too, but as it turns out, he's doing this without the Union.

[nfl]09000d5d8292ef4e[/nfl]

 

[Thordaddy]

Well then I suppose it's time for the

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4eCRMOBOqpU[/youtube]

 

[AsylumGuido]

Re: Re:

Greg Williams is taking the smartest course on this, shut up take your medicine and move on.

I just slump down in my chair when I hear comments like this. What, a man is not allowed to defend himself in this country anymore? The little guy is supposed to just fall in-line when the big guys blast them in the media? What ever happened to the concept of burden of proof?

What is with all of this implicit trust in an organization (the NFL) with such a long track record of unethical (and illegal) behavior? These guys have never been choir boys.

I'll do my best to answer those questions:

First the Saints GM , HC and Asst HC ALL filed appeals which asked the league to reconsider during which whatever evidence the league had was doubtless reviewed and the commissioner gave them a chance to refute it,I assume they were unable to do so and their punishment INCLUDING the forfeiture of draft choices was upheld.

SO It would stand to reason that with the indefinite duration Goodell adjudicated was apropos for Williams,his best course of action IMO was to plead contrition and seek mercy rather than defy. Additionally considering the yearly salary Williams was due to be paid if he hadn't consulted his agent and his agent involved a lawyer he's guilty of monumentally greater stupidity than just the bounty program suggests.

It is the "age of litigation" as my Auditing text termed it, things involving 7 figures don't go down without consulting council so IMO Williams knows he's had and is again doing the right thing because he is pretty sure the "burden of proof " is prolly satisfied.

Big and little btw are terms that make me slump down in my chair because the size of the respective parties is irrelevant but clearly you think it's relevant. As you say proof not attitudes.

I do share a great deal of your mistrust of the league, but since Vilma is going outside the channels of the appeal process I doubt he has much to stand upon there and is trying to bluff the league into backing down due to the "hazards of litigation".

IMO Goodell was hired to clean up the game ,to shield the league from suit, it is inconsistent to me that he would open one door in order to try to close another.

I don't think people GET how adroit Goodell is,I would think somewhere in the suit there will be a request for an injunction prohibiting Goodell from enforcing the year long ban and attempting to delay this long enough for Vilma to play his last year then serve his suspension in a year he wasn't going to play anyway.

OTOH he may be contemplating the chewbakka defense

I disagree. First, the alleged evidence against the players was not shared with them prior to their imposed punishment and would not be shared with them in their appeal. If Vilma is innocent, as he claims, of the charges against him and wishes to clear his name, personal litigation against Goodell is his only legitimate chance. Goodell would forced to turn over ALL evidence he used to determine guilt in his mind. Vilma's lawyers would then get the chance to challenge the evidence. If Vilma is innocent the law team should be able to discredit the evidence used.

Now, if Goodell had reasonable belief that the evidence he used was valid at the time of making his decision he would be cleared of the charges in the suit. But, Vilma would still be cleared in name and in action and could be reinstated.

I know that Goodell is not stupid, but I also know that he was very motivated to make an example of someone to get out in front of the concussion lawsuits. It is very believable that he may have trusted sources beyond a safe point.

 

[Angry Ram]

I think this is stupid on Vilma's part. You got caught, somehow/someway, your name got brought up and pay the consequences. You didn't see James Harrison turn around and sue when he was made the poster boy of "improper" hits.

what evidence is there other than the williams' audio?

well, hopefully we find out in court what the NFL really has or does not have.


But what if Vilma is right, what if this is largely a case of heresay with no hard evidence. What then? What conclusion will you draw about Goodell, the NFL and Vilma?

"What if" he's (Vilma) is trying to save his ass?

His HC got suspended, he didn't sue.

No, it's not about not being allowed to defend themselves. In business, you do something against the rules, you pay for it. I got a personal story myself that's similiar to this. I can't give out full details, but it involves something said about me and as a result, I paid the consequence. I don't think w/e allegation against me is true, but I can't do anything about it. Unless I sue, which isn't even worth it IMO. Nor do I want to.

 

[Thordaddy]

Re: Re:

Greg Williams is taking the smartest course on this, shut up take your medicine and move on.

I just slump down in my chair when I hear comments like this. What, a man is not allowed to defend himself in this country anymore? The little guy is supposed to just fall in-line when the big guys blast them in the media? What ever happened to the concept of burden of proof?

What is with all of this implicit trust in an organization (the NFL) with such a long track record of unethical (and illegal) behavior? These guys have never been choir boys.

I'll do my best to answer those questions:

First the Saints GM , HC and Asst HC ALL filed appeals which asked the league to reconsider during which whatever evidence the league had was doubtless reviewed and the commissioner gave them a chance to refute it,I assume they were unable to do so and their punishment INCLUDING the forfeiture of draft choices was upheld.

SO It would stand to reason that with the indefinite duration Goodell adjudicated was apropos for Williams,his best course of action IMO was to plead contrition and seek mercy rather than defy. Additionally considering the yearly salary Williams was due to be paid if he hadn't consulted his agent and his agent involved a lawyer he's guilty of monumentally greater stupidity than just the bounty program suggests.

It is the "age of litigation" as my Auditing text termed it, things involving 7 figures don't go down without consulting council so IMO Williams knows he's had and is again doing the right thing because he is pretty sure the "burden of proof " is prolly satisfied.

Big and little btw are terms that make me slump down in my chair because the size of the respective parties is irrelevant but clearly you think it's relevant. As you say proof not attitudes.

I do share a great deal of your mistrust of the league, but since Vilma is going outside the channels of the appeal process I doubt he has much to stand upon there and is trying to bluff the league into backing down due to the "hazards of litigation".

IMO Goodell was hired to clean up the game ,to shield the league from suit, it is inconsistent to me that he would open one door in order to try to close another.

I don't think people GET how adroit Goodell is,I would think somewhere in the suit there will be a request for an injunction prohibiting Goodell from enforcing the year long ban and attempting to delay this long enough for Vilma to play his last year then serve his suspension in a year he wasn't going to play anyway.

OTOH he may be contemplating the chewbakka defense

I disagree. First, the alleged evidence against the players was not shared with them prior to their imposed punishment and would not be shared with them in their appeal. If Vilma is innocent, as he claims, of the charges against him and wishes to clear his name, personal litigation against Goodell is his only legitimate chance. Goodell would forced to turn over ALL evidence he used to determine guilt in his mind. Vilma's lawyers would then get the chance to challenge the evidence. If Vilma is innocent the law team should be able to discredit the evidence used.

Now, if Goodell had reasonable belief that the evidence he used was valid at the time of making his decision he would be cleared of the charges in the suit. But, Vilma would still be cleared in name and in action and could be reinstated.

I know that Goodell is not stupid, but I also know that he was very motivated to make an example of someone to get out in front of the concussion lawsuits. It is very believable that he may have trusted sources beyond a safe point.

Well guido, thanks for that slant, don't agree, but you certainly articulated Vilma's point of view well and ya know this being an adversarial proceeding Vilma vs. Darth Roger, the opposite POV is entitled to be heard.