Hypothetical OC Discussion

[Merlin]

At this point there's a million unknowns. We don't know whether Fish will be the coach (that contract is no guarantee of his return), or whether he'll even be so inclined to make a change at OC. But regardless and for the purpose of this discussion let's say Fish returns and makes a change at OC. Who would you hire? Who should he hire? Who do you think he'll hire? And let's leave the Fish bashing to the other threads!

My take:

Who he should hire, and who I'd go after is Payton Manning. Payton has had a year off, the dude is competitive as F, and I am sure he might consider coming in as OC if the Rams throw some money at him. If Fish were to convince Stan to put up a big offer to get him in here, he'd have a young, top talent QB to work with and an elite RB just waiting for a better schematic approach and better blocking. Payton was effectively an OC in this league for a long time. Nobody has a better passing game resume, Fish should beat the drum to get a contract to get him in here, and should give him the leeway to make the required changes to get this offense rolling.

Payton on retirement: "I think I've earned one fall anyway to kind of go at my own pace," Manning said. "I think this fall will kind of give me some answers kind of what it is you miss, what it is you don't miss. What you might want to do. I've actually stayed pretty busy this fall."

Backup option that I would pursue, and who I think they should go after is Martz. Mad Mike's had time to simmer in his juices, admits he misses the game, and admits he still loves the Rams and has trouble watching them because of the old feelings. Behind Manning this is the perfect hire for Fish to put in place and let him do his thing. Fish can play the Vermiel role of keeping him calm and grounded in the run game particularly later in games as they build leads.

Who I think he'll hire is Mike Shanahan. Mentioned this before, that I think the friendship between the two plus the fact that Mike's had a break now for a while weigh in Fisher's favor. Also, Mike isn't going to throw his name into the head coaching ring in a year when his son is poised to be the top name. Going to the Rams represents an opportunity for him to rebuild his name in this league by building around two top-notch pieces in the offensive backfield. And I think it will work if Fish does this too, btw. Gurley is a very nice one cut and go type of back for that scheme.

 

[Zodi]

I see literally none of that happening.

If anything, I think Manning would be an analyst. If he gets into coaching, it'll probably be with his Vols. Plus, great players don't necessarily make good coaches... altho if I had to bet, Manning would be the exception.

Practically everyone would like to see Martz back, but coming back to the team he coached as an OC under the guy he beat in the SB under the same job title? Extreme long shot imo.

I think Shanahan is done. Maybe a HC, but I think it'd be hard for him to accept a OC role after having so much success as a HC.

Hopefully Cleveland cans Jackson and Fisher jumps at signing him, like he should've done years ago.

 

[KJD_Ram]

Knowing that Martz has worked with Norv Turner before, I think that would be a perfect combo...Hire Norv to be the OC and bring Martz in as QB coach to work with Goff...and have Stan tell JF to let them do their jobs.

I'd like Norv to then fill out his offensive staff with proven position coaches, with a OL coach as being top priority.

Failing that...I would like to see the entire Offensive staff replaced, and at minimum a new OC and OL coach.

 

[LACHAMP46]

If we change the scheme, will it effect the players positively or negatively? That's the key...While I hate canning Boras this soon...I don't see a chance that the way the offense runs, it will improve enough to lead to wins...

If we change the OC & OL coach...I think we'll need to change a bunch of players....

 

[FRO]

I think Shanahan is the best fit as far a scheme. That is the offense the Rams need to run. Gurley would be great in that scheme as would Goff. I think Shanahan would be a guy Fish would leave alone. Shanahan picked Trent Williams, Kirk Cousins, Jordan Reed. I think he would be a good fit. I'm not sure how great of a play caller he is though since he hasn't done it in forever. Martz isn't a fit and while he was great for us he did ruin two very good QBs. His style needs a great line. Rams have a horrible line. Norv isn't a fit either, but I suspect he will be Fisher's guy.

 

[FRO]

If we change the scheme, will it effect the players positively or negatively? That's the key...While I hate canning Boras this soon...I don't see a chance that the way the offense runs, it will improve enough to lead to wins...

If we change the OC & OL coach...I think we'll need to change a bunch of players....

Dead last in the league, a change of scheme, coaches, and talent is a must. Too often Fisher has scapegoated one aspect of the offense (QB normally). They are talent depleted on the line and at receiver.

 

[Dodgersrf]

I think Shanahan is the best fit as far a scheme. That is the offense the Rams need to run. Gurley would be great in that scheme as would Goff. I think Shanahan would be a guy Fish would leave alone. Shanahan picked Trent Williams, Kirk Cousins, Jordan Reed. I think he would be a good fit. I'm not sure how great of a play caller he is though since he hasn't done it in forever. Martz isn't a fit and while he was great for us he did ruin two very good QBs. His style needs a great line. Rams have a horrible line. Norv isn't a fit either, but I suspect he will be Fisher's guy.

Have to disagree on Martz.
I really don't see Martz as ruining 2 very good QBs. I see him as building a handful of good /great qbs.
He trained Trent Green, Warner, Bulger and Fitzpatrick. All had good careers. Even Jamie Martin and a decent career as a backup. None of which were prime draft talent coming out of college.

I'd really like to see what Martz could do with Goff.

 

[Merlin]

If we change the scheme, will it effect the players positively or negatively? That's the key...

If the new OC is a good teacher, no. If he's a guy who can wow in interviews but doesn't translate what he knows well to players, like Schotty Jr, then yes it will be a problem.

This is why Fish, IF he gets next year, can't F around with another unknown or a castoff coach's son who has yet to field a top offense. He needs to bring in a known quantity at OC. Someone who is capable of re-establishing a run game and developing Goff and the passing game as a strong complement.

 

[FaulkSF]

My wishlist:

1) Hue Jackson, Martz as Asst/QB coach.
2) Tom Cable (worked with Hue)
3) Chudzinski if Pagano gets fired
4) Chris Petersen

I think in any of these picks I'm open to Mad Mike being asst OC & QB Coach.

 

[Merlin]

3) Chudzinski if Pagano gets fired

I've always had respect for Chud as an offensive mind. But I'm still irritated with the way he ran to the Colts and all to function as water boy or whatever, vice jumping right back into it with another team in an OC capacity. His hiring would excite me, though, no doubt.

 

[Dodgersrf]

I really don't see Hue Jackson getting fired.
.....but then again, it is the Browns were talking about.

 

[drasconis]

It will be hard to get a high regard OC in under JF. it is going to be tough to get a them to come in for a head coach that is going to be under heavy scrutiny and has 1 year to prove himself.

As for the OP list I think all 3 are VERY unlikely:

1. Manning...not sure why he would jump to working under JF to start his coaching career...yes there is some young talent, but no 1st round to augment with. once again a coach with 1 year to prove himself, if it goes south it would happen fast and leave a mark on his rep (marketing).

2.Shanahan is very unlikely to come back. Once again with the pressure to turn it around in 1 year it can only hurt his reputation. Also note that coming back would delay his vote to the HOF (not sure what his chances are), not sure anyone would put themselves 2yrs back for an OC with this many questions to it.

3. Martz....he might do it, I mainly question his ability to get along with JF. He is already got a rep of not getting along and can't see him and JF being buddy buddy (heck they have history).

Norv might be the best option, can't imagine to many other teams going for him (age and the way he left the Vikes was odd), he isn't going to be up for another head coaching job so he doesn't need to worry about reputation or a stain on his resume.

 

[CanRamFan]

I've never thought of Petyon Manning as an option but I love the idea. Can't think of a better person to mentor Goff as he becomes acclimated to the NFL game. I think it could work if there was a no interference from Fisher clause in the contract, but I'm almost certain that Fisher is coaching his last few games with the Rams organization.

I think we are going to be looking at a completely new coaching staff next year. They'll all be gone.

 

[iamme33]

I've never thought of Petyon Manning as an option but I love the idea. Can't think of a better person to mentor Goff as he becomes acclimated to the NFL game. I think it could work if there was a no interference from Fisher clause in the contract, but I'm almost certain that Fisher is coaching his last few games with the Rams organization.

I think we are going to be looking at a completely new coaching staff next year. They'll all be gone.

I think I remember fisher saying in a press conference that they had changed oc twice so they wouldn't be doing that again which kind of tells me there is no clause in contract.

 

[JackDRams]

Peyton Manning is cool and all. But we need an experienced coordinator. I'm not sitting through rookie struggles for a new coordinator. I've had enough of this crap. 23 need someone that knows what they're doing.

 

[LACHAMP46]

This is why Fish, IF he gets next year, can't F around with another unknown or a castoff coach's son who has yet to field a top offense. He needs to bring in a known quantity at OC. Someone who is capable of re-establishing a run game and developing Goff and the passing game as a strong complement.

I think it's part job security...He doesn't hire guys that could conceivably replace him as HC....Hence, Boras, Cig, after Schotty jr.....Any top OC is also a potential HC.

 

[Merlin]

I think it's part job security...He doesn't hire guys that could conceivably replace him as HC....Hence, Boras, Cig, after Schotty jr.....Any top OC is also a potential HC.

You might be right on that. Although at the time he hired Schotty he was inexplicably a hot HC name. Never could understand that one based purely on the body of his work with the Jets and unfortunately it continued with us.

The worst thing here wrt Boras is I have that little voice in the back of my mind telling me that maybe he's good enough IF he hadn't been saddled with a backup QB. That maybe if he had been allowed to tell the offensive staff Goff is going to start the kid would have gotten enough attention and snaps to where he would have been clickin by game 6 or so, and this whole thing would look much different.

But then I remember we have a steaming pile of excrement at the skill positions, not to mention a porous OL. Meh.

I pray that if he returns ownership twists his arm to make a real hire and get it fixed. I can't stomach any more of this BS, need to have some kind of hope for next year.

 

[OldSchool]

One thing that cracks me up with these discussions is people who think a successful college head coach will go to the NFL and take a pay cut to be an OC. If they get fired sure it could happen but winning coaches don't take a step back like that.

 

[Merlin]

One thing that cracks me up with these discussions is people who think a successful college head coach will go to the NFL and take a pay cut to be an OC. If they get fired sure it could happen but winning coaches don't take a step back like that.

It doesn't necessarily have to be a pay cut. Jason Garret was famously pulling in $3 mil as OC with the Cowboys way back when. I think when you stack owners by value and willingness to pony up the bucks we have an advantage similar to the Cowboys, where Stan would have no problem with it provided he thinks it's the right hire.

If you look HERE you can see some major college programs paying $3 mil range for their coaches, like UCLA with Mora. David Shaw pulls in $4 mil at Stanford. I don't think the Rams would have a problem putting up that kind of money or a little more for the guy they want. Money, IMO, is not the hurdle with Stan.

I do agree it's difficult to attract college head coaches to be OCs, to the point where teams basically won't even try to do it very often, but not because of money. The reason is they're not going to want to come in and work for someone once they've had a taste of success running the whole thing.

Oh and btw looking at that link above it makes me wonder whether Saban is irritated by Harbaugh's compensation. Nick is reportedly rather huffy when it comes to things like that, might that be why he was sniffing around with the NYG in reports last year?

 

[Warner4Prez]

I've read rumors that if Payton comes back to the NFL, it's in a front office role a'la John Elway so he could position himself to become GM sooner than later.

Beyond that, more of the same does nothing for me. Shanny got crushed under the media scrutiny in DC during the RG3 fiasco, I don't think another already hot seat would entice him.

Norv's offense was downright anemic in MN the past couple of years, especially because the offensive line was crumbling. Sound familiar?