Goff superior to Wentz (long)

[Mackeyser]

Remember how excited and CONFIDENT Fisher was in that new WCO based offense? The one that tanked so badly?

Much of the internal discussion reported was that they didn't have the personnel to run it, namely the QB.

I think that Fisher's ALWAYS going to have shortcomings on offense as a HC and Steve McNair bailed him out with his ability to create. Wentz has that ability, too.

I think Goff has the ability to be just Lightning in a system. WCO or Coryell. I don't think he has the deep ball for certain Earhardt Perkins variants (Pittsburgh comes to mind) and some Coryell variants would stress him, but overall, he'd be money in most offenses out there. The problem is that we don't have a functioning system.

Of the two, Wentz covers up the inadequacies so much better. We've been watching the holes in the system and watching QBs get injured and watching WRs run wrong routes and watching plays not get be made... because there wasn't someone to take advantage of what was there.

Was McNair ever a TOP QB? Heck no. But...he tied up a lot of loose ends. I remember that Super Bowl and I remember those playoff games where teams thought they had Tennessee by the neck...

When they go with Goff, we're only going to have reinforced how many loose ends there are. I will have to hope that Fisher and Co can do something he hasn't done in over 20 years of coaching... figure out a coherent offense so that Goff can succeed.

Or... he can draft Wentz.

Yet another reason I'm certain it's Goff.

 

[jrry32]

I'm not gonna get sucked in to this

I'm not gonna get sucked in to this

Ok - I'm in.

Someone tell me why we can expect Goff to win at the NFL level when he did so little of it in college? I know his team stunk, he had no o line, no WRs, pee pee poor defense,, etc - but haven't we had a great QB who couldn't win with a subpar cast already here? Can anyone name a QB whose teams lost as much as Cal did who turned into a star at the NFL level?

And for the record - I already know the counterpoint here. Goff is the reason that they ever won any games - he got them to a bowl game. He turned that program around by himself. And all of that is true.

I see a kid who can move in the pocket, can make every throw, and can take hit after hit and keep going. I like him - I do. But someone talk to me about the winning.

John Elway, for one. If you want another, Johnny Unitas.

 

[jrry32]

And that doesn't even take into account the several (was it 3 or 4) literally last minute come from behind wins, couple of which were in the playoffs. Funny... all of the come from behind victories, they were behind by 4 points. I think it was 4 different games, but I lose track. Anyway, super clutch. I don't recall him NOT winning in the clutch.

That's big to me.

To me, Fisher has a chance to succeed at being the next Pittsburgh or failing at being the next New Orleans (because they don't know how to be that complex on offense).

Seems easy enough to me, but I'm down thinking that they'll go with Goff.

I don't get it, but that's the way I think they'll go.

You're acting like if you swapped Roethlisberger and Brees, they wouldn't still be great QBs on the other team.

 

[Mackeyser]

Not as great, no.

I don't think Big Ben processes as fast as Brees so wouldn't be as effective in Payton's Gulf Coast offense.

I don't think Brees has the gun Big Ben has and couldn't make some of the clutch, long throws Big Ben has made to win games in really cold weather chucking that hard rock 60+ yards downfield. As well, I think Big Ben has escaped a ton of sacks and made game saving or winning plays that Brees simply would have taken a sack on.

They're just different players.

I don't think they'd do as well in the other system. I think Brees is tailor made for a WCO and Big Ben is perfect of the EP system. I don't think you can just swap them and get the same result.

They'd be really, really good, but great? The greats have pedestrian games in systems they know by heart and suit them perfectly. Imagine the games they could have in systems that don't suit them...

 

[tavian]

Remember how excited and CONFIDENT Fisher was in that new WCO based offense? The one that tanked so badly?

Much of the internal discussion reported was that they didn't have the personnel to run it, namely the QB.

I think that Fisher's ALWAYS going to have shortcomings on offense as a HC and Steve McNair bailed him out with his ability to create. Wentz has that ability, too.

I think Goff has the ability to be just Lightning in a system. WCO or Coryell. I don't think he has the deep ball for certain Earhardt Perkins variants (Pittsburgh comes to mind) and some Coryell variants would stress him, but overall, he'd be money in most offenses out there. The problem is that we don't have a functioning system.

Of the two, Wentz covers up the inadequacies so much better. We've been watching the holes in the system and watching QBs get injured and watching WRs run wrong routes and watching plays not get be made... because there wasn't someone to take advantage of what was there.

Was McNair ever a TOP QB? Heck no. But...he tied up a lot of loose ends. I remember that Super Bowl and I remember those playoff games where teams thought they had Tennessee by the neck...



When they go with Goff, we're only going to have reinforced how many loose ends there are. I will have to hope that Fisher and Co can do something he hasn't done in over 20 years of coaching... figure out a coherent offense so that Goff can succeed.

Or... he can draft Wentz.

Yet another reason I'm certain it's Goff.

Excellent thinking outside of the box.This from a Goff fan

 

[dieterbrock]

I'm not gonna get sucked in to this

I'm not gonna get sucked in to this

Ok - I'm in.

Someone tell me why we can expect Goff to win at the NFL level when he did so little of it in college? I know his team stunk, he had no o line, no WRs, pee pee poor defense,, etc - but haven't we had a great QB who couldn't win with a subpar cast already here? Can anyone name a QB whose teams lost as much as Cal did who turned into a star at the NFL level?

And for the record - I already know the counterpoint here. Goff is the reason that they ever won any games - he got them to a bowl game. He turned that program around by himself. And all of that is true.

I see a kid who can move in the pocket, can make every throw, and can take hit after hit and keep going. I like him - I do. But someone talk to me about the winning.

So if winning is the be all end all, why draft Wentz when the QB that played before him won more games and championships? Or better yet, how bout the QB that filled in for Wentz this year and won 4 or 5 reg season games and a couple of playoff games?

 

[12intheBox]

So if winning is the be all end all, why draft Wentz when the QB that played before him won more games and championships? Or better yet, how bout the QB that filled in for Wentz this year and won 4 or 5 reg season games and a couple of playoff games?

The point is - when a stud doesn't win - part of the evaluation is to figure out why.

Generally the #1 overall pick is so good that he makes a big difference for his college team in the W-L column - and let's not mix words - Goff did. Just maybe not as much as Id like.