Do we have unrealistic expectations for Fisher?

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Rams43

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Some may say yes, some may say no.

I was thinking about this and a lightbulb went on as I connected a couple of dots.

Defensive Coordinator Todd Bowles is in his rookie year as HC for the Jets. The Jets are currently 4-1. Wow!

Defensive Coordinator Dan Quinn is in his rookie year as HC of the Falcons. The Falcons are currently 5-1. Another Wow!

Jeff Fisher is 2-3 in his FOURTH season as HC of the Rams. An overall 22-30-1 with the Rams.

And please. I know what Fisher inherited. But with 20 years of experience, all those extra premium draft picks, and after a third of his 4th Ram season? C'mon.

These new HC's didn't inherit SB teams, themselves. And they're rookies!

Did I mention that both Quinn and Bowles had been Defensive Coordinators? Yet they both have more than good D's. Imagine that!

I believe Quinn and Bowles, along with Arians, are all shining examples of what the right HC can accomplish as soon as his very first season.

I think we have become accepting of low expectations, frankly.

I also think that Fisher is vastly overrated. And overpaid, as well.

DANG! This really burns me up...
 

drasconis

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No we don't, JF is a coach in his 4th year. No one is requiring/expecting SB this year, just a winning record/playoff appearance. You would be hard pressed to find a pro level coach who wasn't required to have a winning record/playoff appearance by this point in the last 20 years (if you far enough back it becomes more common).
 

Rmfnlt

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Get back to me on this in about 5 games.

(maybe after Sunday).
 

FRO

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He has this season to get into the playoffs. If not he should be gone. The division is down this year and he is in his 4th year. He has greatly improved the team, but we need to compete for the division every year.
 

…..

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Do you mean expecting a winning program and ultimately a nice shiny trophy?

Hell NO it is not unrealistic to expect that.

I expect a winner. If the coach cannot provide one, that coach has to go. I am not "Fire the coach" guy, but his time is getting near.

If we rattle of 5 wins in a row this thread will die die die. If we go 2-3 over the next 5, there is a problem.
 

Boston Ram

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He has this season to get into the playoffs. If not he should be gone. The division is down this year and he is in his 4th year. He has greatly improved the team, but we need to compete for the division every year.
^This. They should of been a playoff team IMO
 

yrba1

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I initially expected at least 8 wins but now that the division is down, Fisher better at least accumulate 9 wins or more by the end of the season; anything less than that should warrant the hot seat. Even though Cignetti continues to follow Schotty's scheme, it has a lot of adjustments that may need some continuity to be more effective.
 

F. Mulder

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I backed the Fisher hiring as someone who was a veteran coach with a solid resume. He was what this club desperately needed coming off a very bad version of the Three Stooges meet the Marx Brothers prior to that. With that said I have to wonder if Fisher's role is done/achieved and it's time to move to the next level.

For me here are the positives: I group Fisher and Snead in the same view FWIW since they do work hand in hand with Snead getting guys (or types of guys) that Fisher wants and leaving it up to Fisher to make it click. I would be remiss to give a big support to Kevin D for some solid cap management and flexibility.

Here are the positives of F/S IMO:

-Provided and young, talented, professional group of players who have the ability to take this team from a laughingstock to a dangerous playoff caliber team. Fisher has the Rams, for the most part, playing hard aggressive, decent football. Snead has his hits and misses like any GM, but for every different philosophy the Rams say they want he has tried to accommodate. Early on the Rams wanted to get younger and get more athletic players. They wanted more team speed. They wanted players who could ascend, given the right circumstances. For the most part Snead has provided that obviously with Fisher's input.

-Provided a professional looking team vs. a team I think my neighborhood girls and boys could challenge on previous Sundays. The Rams have had their share of stinkers but FOR THE MOST PART they seem to be well prepared and competitive for 60 minutes. I used to turn the TV off by halftime during past regimes.

-Has provided a definition for what he wants the Rams to be. A tough D and a ball control running offense that takes its chances when given them.

-Finally, for the most part he has kept this team unified and out of the criminal thread/diva player crap we see from many other teams.

With that said, here are my negatives:

-A constantly changing view of what this team is. This season is a prime example. The OL was a major problem for many years and yet THIS is the year the light bulb went on and he agreed that we needed not only quality, but quantity in the OL. That's great and if you hit on more than 60% of your picks you are set and not overpaying for average at best OLineman, BUT instead of working 1-2 in each season we now have basically a full young/unproven OL. Now they may gel and become average to above average but EVERYONE, including Fisher/Snead, said there would be growing pains. Well the short answer of growing pains is sacrificing games and potential wins while this unit not only tries to learn and gel, but also as the HC/GM evaluate who they have and who they think will pan out vs who won't.

-A change in OL blocking. Not only do you completely revamp the OL but you change the blocking schemes to zone blocking.

-G Williams says he had to scale back the D last season because it was too complicated for some of the young players to learn and it was still a relatively new D unit. Now he says he can open the book. The scaling back stuff came at the expense of a lot of average to crappy previous D performances either due to players not playing without thinking or simply being the wrong players for the system he wanted. I get there is a learning curve with the DC and his group but again, it is at the expense of wins and losses.

Fisher has put himself in the excuse category both due to real circumstances and his own doing.

He now has HIS QB, a game manager who can stay healthy (for the most part) handle the ball, make the plays that are there, and move the Offense. He did not have that with Bradford and the other putzes shouldn't have been in the NFL to start with IMO. Still,, if you are a Fisher guy you say, "hey, give the guy a chance to operate the offense with his new QB, his stud RB, his developing OL, and a new OC." However, year 4 seems a bit late to make such a dramatic change when other HCs make those changes immediately. I understand the Bradford situation is the red herring in that he could only work with what he had, but still, the OL issue was handled very very poorly IMO.

Also, it is up to HIM and HIS COACHES to get the most out of these young ascending players that he asked for. I get that every player won't pan out but looking at the roster, especially at the offensive side, you seem to have a weird mis-mash of players who don't seem to fit. If you are going to run a 3 headed monster TE than Cook will, and has broken your heart and Kendricks remains a Prick Tease. Harkey is a warrior but guys like him are a dime a dozen. The WR corp is the same. Either this group is just a bunch of WRs who can have a nice play or game and then disappear or they aren't being used to fully develop their potential. We have seen Britt have solid games and then be the bad Britt and disappoint. We have seen Sted make some key catches and plays and then disappear. We are starting to see what made them trade up to get TA but for me the book is still out on him as a WR vs a gadget player (you don't get gadget players with a trade up and the 8th overall IMO). Quick is coming off a tough injury but at what point do we know if we have the ascending Quick who is getting it all together or the Quick that is forever a physical specimen without the production. Again, the league is filled with physical studs who don't perform.

Finally, Fisher is really good on getting this team up against teams that frankly I never thought we could beat or even compete with at times. I have never been so proud and happy on some of the wins and dog fights this team has put out vs elite teams. With that said, the key to success in the NFl, unless you are truly elite, is consistency. The Redskins game this year was deja vu all over again (Yogi Berra). The same things have happened since year one. Tough game or win vs a top team and then an egg vs a team ON PAPER you should beat.

The Fisher defenders will rightful cite the improvement of talent on the team, the big wins, the new OL, the new QB, the new OC BUT this is year 4 of his administration. For me the key is the second half of the season. The Rams lost a lot of games Colonel Sanders would have won if he were QB last year BUT, you need to take care of business vs Cleveland at home. You need to take care of a beaten down/mutinous SF team etc. Obviously you won't win every game and weird stuff happens along the way BUT, again, ON PAPER if the Rams and Fisher did their homework and adjustment during the bye week this could be a team that 7-4 or even 8-3 and make believers out of all of us. If not, it may be time for thanking JF for getting the Rams back on track but also to welcome someone who can take this talented, young team to the next level.
 
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VegasRam

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I'm a pretty big Fisher fan, and ironically wasn't in favor of his hire. I am a little bit on the fence on this.
I totally disagree with those who, while acknowledging it, totally downplay the dumpster fire he inherited,
as well as the "look at this guy, and look at that guy" comparison - first of all, season ain't over yet, and second, there are simply WAY too many variables involved.

That said, I would like him to get his five years, but if he doesn't come up with at least 9 wins this year, would agree that replacing him would be justified.
(If and when) whoever replaces him is going to walk into a pretty good situation.
 

Selassie I

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The jets and the falcons still have 10+ games remaining to play. I have a feeling their records will come back to Earth as the season grinds on.

Count me in the group that is thankful and happy to have Fisher running the show. It's nice to have consistency in the management and coaching staffs. There are no quick fixes in this league.
 

Leuzer

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If we don't have a winning record at the end of the season then I'm done with Fisher. 9-7 or better is my goal. I'd like playoffs, but I just want a winning record. His first 3 years we had no quarterback and had plenty of time and picks to build a winning team. Didn't he also say, when we first hired him, that it will be a 3 year plan? Here is year 4 so isn't this the year it's supposed to come together?

I like the guy and I think he's made us into a great competitor, but after the loss to Washington and Pittsburgh - and the constant reminder of teams being .500 under Fisher, there's a shadow of doubt beginning to grow in my mind.

Also, I agree with Dave. :deadhorse:
 

HometownBoy

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Nope, I think it's completely realistic to expect the guy to be making some significant strides with his 4th year with the team and anybody who's taken the kid gloves off is completely justified. There's only so much time you should be allowed to 'rebuild' before the build eventually has to come to fruition. If we can turn the corner with this cupcake schedule then like others have said, I'm done with Fisher.

As of right now, there is only 3 winning teams on our remaining schedule, the Cardinals(Who we've beaten already), Vikings and the Bengals and even that puts our opponents records at 25-33. If we can't turn the corner on that then Fisher simply put, just cannot get it done in this league anymore.
 

RamzFanz

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I would willingly fill a grocery cart with reasons he's failed starting with Bradford, but no more.

Crap or get off the pot this season. If he didn't make serious adjustments to the O during the bye, he's in for a long season.
 

cvramsfan

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I am not saying Fisher is the right or wrong guy, god knows I couldn't do better so who am i to judge. But I will say this, I think he was the right guy to pull us out of the rut, and I think he was hired thinking that the team was moving West (not saying the move is good or bad, hell I don't care where they play, just starting winning again). I also think he may have taken this team as far as he can and now we need the next guy to take us to the next level.
 

gabriel18

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Any team can be turned around in 4 years . The Pats , Steelers , pack , and other teams are competitive every year . Enough said .
Just do it
 

Memento

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If he can't bring the playoffs in such a weak division (the Packers and Panthers are the only teams that I'd consider true contenders at this point. The Whiners and Seahags don't scare me at all, and Arizona is beatable), maybe it'll be time to get a new head coach. There's absolutely no reason why we shouldn't win this division...if we make the right moves:

Mason has to get more involved in this offense if we're going to go anywhere. He's arguably the third best weapon behind Gurley and Austin, and he's sitting on the bench. Get him in the slot, give him space, give him whatever he needs to get, and let him fly. He can do it. I know he can do it.

Bailey should be the primary slot receiver instead of Cook on third downs. He has better hands, runs better routes, and is just a better option at this point.

Speaking of Jared Cook, he should be traded for whatever we can get. Maybe we can send him to New Orleans for a fifth or something. I don't know. But I'm completely done with the guy.

Wichmann should get starts at right guard instead of Reynolds. I know that Reynolds is a veteran and that offensive lines could use veterans. But let's be honest. This is already the youngest and most inexperienced line in the league by far. What will it hurt to give the more talented youngster a shot over a guy who failed in places like Atlanta and Detroit? Listen, I like Reynolds, but as a backup option. Wichmann is more talented, and he should start. It's not like things can get much worse with the line.

Keep the offensive line in place otherwise. Robinson should not be moved to guard. That talk has to stop. Yes, he had a horrible game against Clay Matthews, but it's Clay Matthews we're talking about. He's a top two 3-4 outside linebacker (Justin Houston being the only one who's playing better at this moment). Let G-Rob settle in. He's raw, yes, but his talent is immense, and he's not even through with his second year yet. He was compared to Willie Roaf for a reason. I have zero issues with Brown, Barnes, and Havenstein right now. They're young, but Barnes is making the right calls, and Brown and Havenstein are rookies.

Otherwise, I can't think of much to do with the offense. But Fisher has to realize it. I'm not willing to let Snead go yet (because he's been a very good GM for us), but if Fisher can't deliver this year, I don't have faith that he will be able to deliver.
 

FrantikRam

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First, I think that up until this season, Fisher has had a valid excuse - so to me, it's not fair to throw his record as the coach out there and blast him for it. His first year was his first year...we all know what he inherited. Then his 2nd and 3rd years were littered with backup QB play. We all saw the improvement, but it wasn't reflected in the W/L column, and as losing your starting QB is a deathblow to every NFL team, it's not something Fisher can really be held accountable for. He wasn't even the one that brought said QB to the Rams.

So for me, it starts this year. If we don't win 8 games, there better be a good reason.

Which brings me to...

I look at the schedule and I see the "bad" teams ahead...I feel great about our defense and special teams. I feel great about our running game. I feel okay about the QB/WRs. But the OL....I'm just not sure it will hold up. I look at the schedule and I see wins....but then I think about our offensive line and those Ws turn to Ls...

Hopefully these guys figured it out during the bye.
 

Mojo Ram

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That said, I would like him to get his five years, but if he doesn't come up with at least 9 wins this year, would agree that replacing him would be justified.
(If and when) whoever replaces him is going to walk into a pretty good situation.
I would agree with this.