Best Pocket Passer in College Football...Johnny Football!

[moklerman]

Considering Fisher's past, now even I think Manziel might be a possibility. His whole career had been either McNair or Young starting at QB each year. Maybe he wants to get back to that?

 

[-X-]

1550 is a bad score on the SAT.

Yeah, that's about the National average nowadays. I'd be interested in taking that again now that 1600 is no longer a perfect score.

 

[blackbart]

The Rams would suck for 5 more years if they were to dump Bradford in favor of Manziel.

I don't care how much you hype him he is not a starting caliber NFL QB in 2014

 

[BigRamFan]

Yeah, that's about the National average nowadays. I'd be interested in taking that again now that 1600 is no longer a perfect score.

I would be interested in the outcome too, but it much easier just to extrapolate my old score into the new scale.

 

[LesBaker]

Considering Fisher's past, now even I think Manziel might be a possibility. His whole career had been either McNair or Young starting at QB each year. Maybe he wants to get back to that?

Fisher had several guys play QB for him, all different kinds of guys, while he was in TENN. Mobile guys, not so mobile guys and statues. And Kerry Collins.

 

[dieterbrock]

The Rams would suck for 5 more years if they were to dump Bradford in favor of Manziel.

I don't care how much you hype him he is not a starting caliber NFL QB in 2014

The Rams went 4-5 in a really tough stretch of games last year with Kellen Clemens as the starter. And in nobody's book is he considered "starting caliber NFL QB".
I'm not saying he's the answer, or that he's better option than Bradford. But I'd expect him to play better than Clemens did

 

[dieterbrock]

Fisher had several guys play QB for him, all different kinds of guys, while he was in TENN. Mobile guys, not so mobile guys and statues.

Kerry Collins allegedly ran a 40 yard dash against one of Tennessee o-lineman. The o-lineman won the race at 14.88 seconds and last I heard Kerry was almost at the finish line.

 

[MerlinJones]

The Rams would suck for 5 more years if they were to dump Bradford in favor of Manziel.

I don't care how much you hype him he is not a starting caliber NFL QB in 2014

How did you arrive at your five year time frame?

Would the five years of sucking after Bradford be as bad as or worse than the previous five years of sucking?

 

[jrry32]

The problem with stats? They don't provide context. From watching a lot of film, (this is all my opinion, of course) Manziel was the highest rated passer from the pocket because he worked within a spread offense that utilized half and quarter field reads with pre-determined options for the ball. So Manziel went through 1 or 2 progressions and either hit the open WR from the pocket or he took off and scrambled.

Why would that inflate his pocket stats? As I said, if he was throwing without scrambling, he was likely doing it to one of his first two progressions who were very likely open almost immediately. Simple reads and easier throws. Also, keep in mind that every screen pass they ran counts as a throw from the pocket.

From watching a significant amount of his film, the statistics do not reflect reality. Johnny Manziel is not the best pocket passer in this class. Not even close to Bridgewater in that regard.

Ironically enough, Teddy Bridgewater is actually statistically superior outside the pocket and on the run if I remember correctly when compared to Manziel. And, imo, it's for that same reason. Manziel scrambled when his first couple options were covered to buy time making plays more difficult. Bridgewater often was throwing boot-legs and sprints when throwing outside the pocket(as well as extending the play too) which simplified his read from a full to half field read and often left him with more open receiving options.

I'd definitely say Manziel is the better improviser outside the pocket even if the stats don't bear it out just like Bridgewater is the better pocket passer.

The simple truth is that college offenses play a large factor in terms of statistics and Manziel's Air Raid offense is known for inflating stats. It's similar to the offense run at Texas Tech and is the same offense that Case Keenum played within at Houston.

 

[blackbart]

The Rams went 4-5 in a really tough stretch of games last year with Kellen Clemens as the starter. And in nobody's book is he considered "starting caliber NFL QB".
I'm not saying he's the answer, or that he's better option than Bradford. But I'd expect him to play better than Clemens did

He won't be playing for the Rams with the same team or the same schedule so comparing them is next to impossible. IF he starts somewhere they will get to endure a 2 or 3 years of adjustment if he can keep from being rag dolled to death. All the escapability he showed is not going to work as well in the NFL. He will have a huge learning curve and no way picks up a full NFL playbook. He does not read defenses particularly well and will revert to first read and run.

 

[blackbart]

How did you arrive at your five year time frame?

Would the five years of sucking after Bradford be as bad as or worse than the previous five years of sucking?

I don't believe Manzeil will last as an NFL starter and it would take the next guy that long to develop. It's my opinion just like everyone else posting here.

Any more sucking for this franchise and it will be another lost decade for fans. The way out of suckiness for the Rams is with Bradford, a rebuilt O line and a dominant defense.

 

[moklerman]

Fisher had several guys play QB for him, all different kinds of guys, while he was in TENN. Mobile guys, not so mobile guys and statues. And Kerry Collins.

I forgot that McNair sat on the bench for a while. For some reason I thought he started right away but there were quite a few games started by Chris Chandler back then. That actually eases my mind a little bit. Kind of weird history. McNair and Young could both really run while Chandler and Collins were about as statue-like as QB's can get. Not much in-between ground in terms of style of play.

 

[LesBaker]

The problem with stats? They don't provide context. From watching a lot of film, (this is all my opinion, of course) Manziel was the highest rated passer from the pocket because he worked within a spread offense that utilized half and quarter field reads with pre-determined options for the ball. So Manziel went through 1 or 2 progressions and either hit the open WR from the pocket or he took off and scrambled.

Why would that inflate his pocket stats? As I said, if he was throwing without scrambling, he was likely doing it to one of his first two progressions who were very likely open almost immediately. Simple reads and easier throws. Also, keep in mind that every screen pass they ran counts as a throw from the pocket.

From watching a significant amount of his film, the statistics do not reflect reality. Johnny Manziel is not the best pocket passer in this class. Not even close to Bridgewater in that regard.

Ironically enough, Teddy Bridgewater is actually statistically superior outside the pocket and on the run if I remember correctly when compared to Manziel. And, imo, it's for that same reason. Manziel scrambled when his first couple options were covered to buy time making plays more difficult. Bridgewater often was throwing boot-legs and sprints when throwing outside the pocket(as well as extending the play too) which simplified his read from a full to half field read and often left him with more open receiving options.

I'd definitely say Manziel is the better improviser outside the pocket even if the stats don't bear it out just like Bridgewater is the better pocket passer.

The simple truth is that college offenses play a large factor in terms of statistics and Manziel's Air Raid offense is known for inflating stats. It's similar to the offense run at Texas Tech and is the same offense that Case Keenum played within at Houston.

That was a pretty well thought out post.

 

[LesBaker]

I forgot that McNair sat on the bench for a while. For some reason I thought he started right away but there were quite a few games started by Chris Chandler back then. That actually eases my mind a little bit. Kind of weird history. McNair and Young could both really run while Chandler and Collins were about as statue-like as QB's can get. Not much in-between ground in terms of style of play.

Billy Volek got a lot of games in too, I looked up the Titans franchise history on profootballreference.com.

I have no flippin idea what label to put on him or where he fits in here LOL.

 

[moklerman]

Billy Volek got a lot of games in too, I looked up the Titans franchise history on profootballreference.com.

I have no flippin idea what label to put on him or where he fits in here LOL.

I remember Volek(speaking of FFL, he won me a championship that year) but I don't really consider him one of the real options. He started a few games but he was never supposed to play. I'm mainly talking about guys that Fisher planned to roll with.

 

[-X-]

Billy Volek got a lot of games in too, I looked up the Titans franchise history on profootballreference.com.

I have no flippin idea what label to put on him or where he fits in here LOL.

I had Billy on my fantasy team in 2004 (bench), and while the Titans didn't win much with him, there was a stretch where he produced a lot of fantasy points. And we all know that fantasy production is the true measure of a QB's worth.

 

[TheDYVKX]

Yeah, that's about the National average nowadays. I'd be interested in taking that again now that 1600 is no longer a perfect score.

Obviously you can't judge somebody's intelligence by their SAT scores, but bragging about a 1550 on the new 2400 format is not at all good. Ideally, you'd like an exceptionally bright QB who has a lot of football knowledge. I don't know too much about Manziel, but he doesn't strike me as that guy.

I also would like to retake the SAT. I want to know what I'd get. My nephew just took it last month and he got a 1950, so I'd be looking to beat him

 

[Memphis Ram]

I forgot that McNair sat on the bench for a while. For some reason I thought he started right away but there were quite a few games started by Chris Chandler back then. That actually eases my mind a little bit. Kind of weird history. McNair and Young could both really run while Chandler and Collins were about as statue-like as QB's can get. Not much in-between ground in terms of style of play.

While it's a team sport, it's not hard to notice that Collins and Chandler had one winning season and one .500 season between them. Meanwhile, Fisher had five 10+ win seasons & four .500 seasons with the guys who can make plays with their feet.

 

[moklerman]

While it's a team sport, it's not hard to notice that Collins and Chandler had one winning season and one .500 season between them. Meanwhile, Fisher had five 10+ win seasons & four .500 seasons with the guys who can make plays with their feet.

I think you'd have to be real careful about gleaning too much from this particular sample. Chandler was leading the mostly Pardee Oilers in Fisher's first year as HC and Collins only got 1 year to start full time.

 

[moklerman]

I had Billy on my fantasy team in 2004 (bench), and while the Titans didn't win much with him, there was a stretch where he produced a lot of fantasy points. And we all know that fantasy production is the true measure of a QB's worth.

Yeah, Volek was mostly a #3 QB but he did start a hand full of games that one year. They'd been using Neil O'Donnell as McNair's backup but eventually he got too old and Fisher went with Volek. Then McNair got hurt and Volek started almost a half a season.

In FFL, he put up back to back 40+ point weeks that one year. It went against everything you learn as an FFL'r to start him that 2nd week but the league I was in had NO options at QB after my guy got hurt. I had to start him and he came up big that 2nd week. Although I wasn't actually chasing his 40 point week since I had started him that week too.