What's to be enamored with Bortles/Carr?

[drasconis]

I think the drafting of Mannion shows complete arrogance, because the plan was to red-shirt him his rookie year and develop him into the second year (hence the Foles 1-yr deal) and make him our starter in his 3rd year.

Why I say arrogance is that he must feel really secure to continue on that path, I mean, why stick to that plan so staunchly at this point if you have a QB issue and you fear you're gonna lose your job? Throw the kid in and see how he does - or during your presser why not say Kennum and Mannion will battle it out -- but that's not his plan

And Fisher isn't at all concerned about his future

I seriously worry about the plan here. Maybe it is the fact that JF doesn't have a history of developing young guys or making a plan to do so. He has a preference to only have 2 QBs on his teams and I am not rally sure he knows how to develop a guy in the #3 spot. Several posters on here during the year pointed out how little work the #3 starter got so that they would be ready to start - this was pointed out as one of the major reasons we did not want to start him late in the season. It is tough to say how you handle him next year, if you draft a guy to be #1 you are likely to have either Foles/Keenum as the #2 back-up so you have that veteran ready to go just in case. In theory if you trade for/sign a FA QB then you can move Mannion on up to #2 so he gets reps, and you have either Foles/Keenum as #3 assuming that either one due to experience will be able to be game ready even as a #3.

I know it seems like I am making the Skins out to be great, and to be clear I do not think they are as an organization...I think they had HC that were smart enough to handle it right (possibly against upper managements plans/wishes). They got Cousins as a 4th rounder and made him a #2 so he got the reps and development in so they could play him (to see what they had) if needed, and had a veteran as a #3 that could reasonably step into #1 if emergency arose and the lack of reps at the #3 spot really wouldn't set back to badly.

 

[Stel]

Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

To be clear, I did not say he is a wasted pick... Instead it seems like a wasted pick if he's on some developmental projection that is too long. By either contract expiring, or us using a high draft choice on someone else "before he is ready".

Now, to be fair, we haven't heard the Rams say he's not going to be part of the competition next season.

I guess for me, it goes back to the draft at the time of the selection. A 3rd round pick is in a stretch of the draft I don't like taking a QB. It's too rich for a developmental guy and too far removed from the top of the draft to be confident in his abilities.

My personal guess, they took Mannion expecting him to develop behind Foles for two years, then become the starter. I think they intended to have a veteran back up the first year and then determine whether Mannion was ready to be the back up for 2016. Look at Foles contract. After 2016 he becomes a cheap discard. The whole think looks like they had the expectation of the starting QB being: 2015 Foles, 2016 Foles, 2017 Mannion.

 

[Moostache]

The Rams are a broken record at the QB position and really across the offense in general. Mannion was a waste of a pick if you are not going to use him late in the season, when the playoffs were out and the games were essentially 2016 tryouts. Leaving the team in the hands of Keenum instead was the clearest indication that the Rams offensive "braintrust" has neither brains nor trust in their own draft selections. If Sean Mannion, as a 3rd round pick, could not be ready enough for a dress rehearsal viewing in weeks 16 and 17, then he and the coaches are a lost cause.

Seeing as Sean did not make the decision to not play, I will leave all of the blame on the coaches (where is belongs).

BTW, put Carr, Bortles or Bridgewater on the Rams with the same coaches and you would NOT get a playoff team...you'd get MAYBE an 8-8 team, but most likely the same old non-winning season Jeff Fisher Rams.

 

[fearsomefour]

So, you're saying that you'd out bid everyone to bring Sammy back I guess.

Um, no.
Although, it will be interesting to see what sort of bidding war comes (or doesn't) to Bradford this off season.
As I have said, I get the rational for the trade. The Rams got out from under one year of Bradfords contract. In the process of doing that they downgraded the most important position in football in terms of talent. Because of Foles horrendous play they have no clear leader at the position going forward....but, they do have Foles extended.
Generally I support Snead and Fisher and personal wise I think they have done a pretty good job.
However, the trade was a blunder. Bold moves are all well and good, you just have to be right and they were not.

 

[LACHAMP46]

Why simple answer to you is what @jrry32 said....

I guess I'm just saying, it seems like a wasted draft pick. Either the guy is starter material or he shouldn't have been selected. Because here we sit, looking for a QB in the 2016 offseason.

It was interesting....It was like a slap in some scouts faces, that they took the more "pro ready" QB...and yet he's still not ready...It will really hurt if QB's drafted after him(Hundley & Petty) happen to get in games sooner and perform well....

We never had a chance to get Bortles.

Yes we did...this was the G-Rob draft...Bortles went 3rd I believe...

 

[Selassie I]

Um, no.
Although, it will be interesting to see what sort of bidding war comes (or doesn't) to Bradford this off season.
As I have said, I get the rational for the trade. The Rams got out from under one year of Bradfords contract. In the process of doing that they downgraded the most important position in football in terms of talent. Because of Foles horrendous play they have no clear leader at the position going forward....but, they do have Foles extended.
Generally I support Snead and Fisher and personal wise I think they have done a pretty good job.
However, the trade was a blunder. Bold moves are all well and good, you just have to be right and they were not.

1st... I actually used blue font. How did you miss that?


2nd... you can call the Foles extension a blunder, but not the trade...that was brilliant.

 

[Athos]

Yep @LACHAMP46 .

We could have had any QB we wanted in that draft. We went GRob.

 

[Selassie I]

Why simple answer to you is what @jrry32 said....

It was interesting....It was like a slap in some scouts faces, that they took the more "pro ready" QB...and yet he's still not ready...It will really hurt if QB's drafted after him(Hundley & Petty) happen to get in games sooner and perform well....

Yes we did...this was the G-Rob draft...Bortles went 3rd I believe...

You're correct about him going #3. Technically we could have drafted him. It would have been a very strange pick to draft Blake at #2 with Sam in the barn is what I meant to say.

I predicted Blake would be the 1st QB taken in that draft when most said otherwise. I would have been delighted had we made him our pick. I wonder if we would have been able to get a 2nd for Sam under that scenario.

 

[LACHAMP46]

It would have been a very strange pick to draft Blake at #2 with Sam in the barn is what I meant to say.

Not really...was it Sam's first ACL injury? It would have been wise insurance....great. planning & foresight.

 

[Selassie I]

Not really...was it Sam's first ACL injury? It would have been wise insurance....great. planning & foresight.

I think adding a stud LT is wise insurance, planning and foresight too. Especially for a QB coming off an ACL.

 

[Athos]

2014 pre season was SAMs second ACL.

Woulda been fantastic insurance. And for the ones wanting Sam gone, you maybe coulda swung Sam for a first.

 

[Selassie I]

It would not have been "insurance" if we drafted Blake... it would have been Sam's REPLACEMENT.

 

[Warner4Prez]

Not really...was it Sam's first ACL injury? It would have been wise insurance....great. planning & foresight.

It would have meant taking out insurance on a car you can't drive. I believe Jake Long, Wells and (probably) Saffold ended the year on IR. Sure it would have been nice to have a backup plan, but when we didn't even know if we'd have a starting tackle going into week 1, it'd take some big stones to take the luxury pick of another top of the draft QB.

 

[blue4]

Yep @LACHAMP46 .

We could have had any QB we wanted in that draft. We went GRob.

We could have had any QB we wanted, any LT we wanted, and a couple of trade down options that would have left us with someone like Zack Martin and yet another 1st round pick in the Gurley draft. And we went GRob.

Gotta get the full scale of the blunder. Even if GRob manages to become average in his third year the worst we would have done is a pro bowl guard and another player to go with Gurley, so it's still a blunder.

 

[Dieter the Brock]

However, the trade was a blunder. Bold moves are all well and good, you just have to be right and they were not.

Sam Bradford was Sam Bradford for the Eagles

If this move was a blunder it was for Chop Kelly - Chop decided he'd be the smartest guy in the room and go against a proven track record of disappointment and trade for Bradford and give us a 2nd and a 4th in this upcoming draft - look what it got him FIRED

Bradford was not signing an extension so we got what we could, yes we got an equally garbage QB in Folds

With that extra 2nd we have the ability to trade up or get a player we really need - we have options

If we had kept Bradford today we'd be in even worse shape at the QB position

 

[DaveFan'51]

I liked Carr coming out, But I thought we got the Foles of a couple of years ago after the trade! As a lot of us hoped! And I was wrong!
There have been a lot of good QB's taken in the 3rd round and later! We haven't seen enough of Mannion to make an informed decision on his abilities yet!

 

[jrry32]

We never had a chance to get Bortles. I watched all of his UCF college games. Before he was drafted, I told everyone here that he would be the top QB drafted and that he deserved to be by far. Most of the Draft Gurus here at ROD said otherwise. Again, we never had a shot of getting Blake. Take him out of this.

The other 2...

Carr seems to be a good player to me. He does have one hell of a talent at WR who helps his cause,,, but I like Carr.

Don't like Teddy. Pass.


We had Sammy in the stable here when these guys were coming out. Carr and Bridgewater weren't the best options for this team when their #s came up on draft day. Again, Blake wasn't an option.

I'm just thankful our decision makers were somehow able to get out from under Sammy before his contract ran out. That was a real miracle to me.

We certainly had the ability to draft Blake even if there was no chance it was going to happen. In hindsight, it arguably would have been the right move.

 

[RamsFan14]

I loved Derek Carr, wish he had drafted him in that second round! Blake Bortles reminded me of Big Ben during his first preseason games, it's been impressive seeing him try to lift that offense in Jacksonville. Although I never really thought drafting him was an option for us. Bridgewater did not have the kind of impact I thought he'd have this season, but still has a solid ceiling and has a lot to show down the line. For a draft class that got criticized, it's been pretty solid! Solid group of QBs!

 

[Selassie I]

We certainly had the ability to draft Blake even if there was no chance it was going to happen. In hindsight, it arguably would have been the right move.

I already cleared this up. We weren't looking to replace Sam... we were looking to protect him. Especially after his ACL.

You were banging Teddy's drum before that draft. You even told me that Teddy would be drafted, and should be drafted before Blake. I said Bortles was.

Hindsight could change the world if we could use it beforehand.

 

[jrry32]

I already cleared this up. We weren't looking to replace Sam... we were looking to protect him. Especially after his ACL.

You were banging Teddy's drum before that draft. You even told me that Teddy would be drafted, and should be drafted before Blake. I said Bortles was.

Hindsight could change the world if we could use it beforehand.

Yep. I was banging Teddy's drum.(and had him ranked as my #1 QB with Bortles ranked #2) Still banging his drum now. Didn't stop me from banging Bortles's drum too. I'm an equal opportunity drum banger.

Yep, it could. But it's not hindsight to say quite a few Rams fans wanted the Rams to have a good Plan B behind Bradford and were willing to draft a QB early on (not at #2) to accomplish that task.