What if one of the Top DEs are there at 10?

[Memento]

That's what they said about Leonard Little and Jason Taylor.

Unlike those two, Beasley doesn't have any more weight that he can pack onto his frame without losing his coveted speed. His only position is as a pass-rushing linebacker. I don't want a severely-undersized left end; opponents will run with impunity toward that side.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Beasley is too small.

the upgrade in pass rush would be offset by having to bak him up to stop the run. And,Ogletree is usually on the right, do the backup isn't the best at shedding blocks and tackling either.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

That's what they said about Leonard Little and Jason Taylor.

Teams ran over Little with ease

 

[Memphis Ram]

Unlike those two, Beasley doesn't have any more weight that he can pack onto his frame without losing his coveted speed. His only position is as a pass-rushing linebacker. I don't want a severely-undersized left end; opponents will run with impunity toward that side.

Same concerns with Little and Taylor. I don't want an undersized LE either. But, I don't believe that would be Beasley's role. I think he'd be a situational pass rusher and LB with the Rams. And I'd even spell Quinn with him when he needs a rest. That way you've got a STUD pass rusher attacking on almost every play.

 

[Memphis Ram]

Teams ran over Little with ease

They probably ran by him more than anything else. Or was it the other way around.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

But we don't need a LT.

We don't need a DE either, technically. Plus Collins can play ORT or Guard. He would be a solid, and versatile player for the Oline.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Same concerns with Little and Taylor. I don't want an undersized LE either. But, I don't believe that would be Beasley's role. I think he'd be a situational pass rusher and LB with the Rams. And I'd even spell Quinn with him when he needs a rest. That way you've got a STUD pass rusher attacking on almost every play.

That would work I guess.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

I don't think anyone questions the value of the position at all. The debate is the value of the selection of which they are selected as opposed to other positions.

I was listening to Gil Brandt on Sirius NFL Radio just last night talk about how finding quality pass rushers are much harder to find than OLinemen who can be had later. He even went on naming former college defensive lineman who were converted into quality NFL OLinemen with the most recent being the Seahawks former 7th rounder J.R. Sweezy.

BTW, while the Rams tried to trade back into round one to select Martin, let's also not forget that they could have simply selected him instead of Donald in the first place. Wonder why they didn't with Brocker and Langford set at DT and a hole on the OLine? Value.

Also, regarding Iupati, Long, and Martin. Not one of them were top ten selections. Not even top 15 selections. And each had a comparable talent selected after them.

In fact, the last interior OLinemen selected in the top 10 were Jonathan Cooper and Chance Warmack in 2013. I don't recall there being higher rated OGs in years. Today one is approaching bust status (Cooper) and the other took 1 1/2 seasons to shake his potential bust status. And prior to them, the last interior lineman selected that high was Chris Naeole way back in 1997.....and he disappointed in just being an average to above average player and not elite.

Good points on the last paragraph but citing Gil Brandt's opinion is a reach. He hasn't drafted since 5 RBs would go in round 1. He has been out of the game too long. I have heard Cassserly say OGs are as important as OTs these days. If understand emphasizing positions but when there are so few good prospects that grade highly, Scherf just might have the best value at 10.

 

[Memphis Ram]

Good points on the last paragraph but citing Gil Brandt's opinion is a reach. He hasn't drafted since 5 RBs would go in round 1. He has been out of the game too long. I have heard Cassserly say OGs are as important as OTs these days. If understand emphasizing positions but when there are so few good prospects that grade highly, Scherf just might have the best value at 10.

We aren't talking specific player analysis here. Brandt may not have been making the selections, but he's still talks to NFL people, follows the draft and sees what has been going on over the years hasn't he? My guess is that he already knows the information I provided in the last paragraph better than any of us.

And one may consider a position as important, but that still doesn't mean that they believe that they should use a top 10 selection on that position. And that's the critical issue when it comes to the NFL Draft.

It's just the nature of the position. Scherff would have to clearly elite (along the lines of Hutchinson, Allen, Faneca, etc.) for their to be a noticeable difference in an OLines success vs. an above average to good guard, IMO.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

We aren't talking specific player analysis here. Brandt may not have been making the selections, but he's still talks to NFL people, follows the draft and sees what has been going on over the years hasn't he? My guess is that he already knows the information I provided in the last paragraph better than any of us.

And one may consider a position as important, but that still doesn't mean that they believe that they should use a top 10 selection on that position. And that's the critical issue when it comes to the NFL Draft.

It's just the nature of the position. Scherff would have to clearly elite (along the lines of Hutchinson, Allen, Faneca, etc.) for their to be a noticeable difference in an OLines success vs. an above average to good guard, IMO.

Two things:

Regarding you comment about being clearly elite. That goes with what I was saying about having a better grade than what is left on the board, in a way. I'd rather take a Guard with a 93 rating than a DE with a 86 rating, despite the perceived position value. It's BPA, something you usually value.

Regarding Gil. You can't teach an old dog new tricks.

 

[Memphis Ram]

Two things:

Regarding you comment about being clearly elite. That goes with what I was saying about having a better grade than what is left on the board, in a way. I'd rather take a Guard with a 93 rating than a DE with a 86 rating, despite the perceived position value. It's BPA, something you usually value.

I would too. If the DE and all the other position players had a 86 rating.

 

[rams56]

I don't think anyone questions the value of the position at all. The debate is the value of the selection of which they are selected as opposed to other positions.

I was listening to Gil Brandt on Sirius NFL Radio just last night talk about how finding quality pass rushers are much harder to find than OLinemen who can be had later. He even went on naming former college defensive lineman who were converted into quality NFL OLinemen with the most recent being the Seahawks former 7th rounder J.R. Sweezy.

BTW, while the Rams tried to trade back into round one to select Martin, let's also not forget that they could have simply selected him instead of Donald in the first place. Wonder why they didn't with Brocker and Langford set at DT and a hole on the OLine? Value.

Also, regarding Iupati, Long, and Martin. Not one of them were top ten selections. Not even top 15 selections. And each had a comparable talent selected after them.

In fact, the last interior OLinemen selected in the top 10 were Jonathan Cooper and Chance Warmack in 2013. I don't recall there being higher rated OGs in years. Today one is approaching bust status (Cooper) and the other took 1 1/2 seasons to shake his potential bust status. And prior to them, the last interior lineman selected that high was Chris Naeole way back in 1997.....and he disappointed in just being an average to above average player and not elite.

Sorry guys....I was at work. Well back to it....OK I understand your points Memphis. ...but it seems you are dead set against drafting a guard.....What if the Rams feel these guys are elite?

As far as guard you mention busts.....so how many busts have there been when teams have drafted Wrs, Defensive linemen. ...pass rushers in the top ten in that same period of time?.... I think you may find there are a large number....

You mention all of successful lower round guards....... but isn't it true that the further you drop out of the first round the greater chance of busts happening no matter which position ...because they have more perceived holes in they're game? Including less athletic, less versatility, and possibly lower level competition.

Go Rams.........

 

[rams56]

As far as Cooper goes....that's a specific case.....Coopers Rookie year he had already won the starting left guard spot for the cards ..... then broke his leg.....it was serious. .but he was expected to return. but as to why he is struggling now.... I honestly cannot comment because I don't have enough info.

Go Rams........

 

[rams56]

Oh and by the way I am open to drafting any number of players at any number of positions with the 10th pick...... I just like hearing you guys theories and ideas. ......and your train of thought that leads you to these...... it may open my eyes to something that I haven't considered. ..... thanks.

Go Rams...........

 

[Memphis Ram]

Sorry guys....I was at work. Well back to it....OK I understand your points Memphis. ...but it seems you are dead set against drafting a guard.....What if the Rams feel these guys are elite?

As far as guard you mention busts.....so how many busts have there been when teams have drafted Wrs, Defensive linemen. ...pass rushers in the top ten in that same period of time?.... I think you may find there are a large number....

You mention all of successful lower round guards....... but isn't it true that the further you drop out of the first round the greater chance of busts happening no matter which position ...because they have more perceived holes in they're game? Including less athletic, less versatility, and possibly lower level competition.

Go Rams.........

As someone who championed the selection of Chance Warmack for the Rams a few years back, I'm not anti the position at all. But, even as much as I liked him, I wouldn't have used a top 10 pick on him either.

Anyway, I've stated many times in the past, if the Rams believe that an OG is the clearly best player available, I think that they should take him. But, I don't believe that there are any OLinemen worthy of a top 10 selection hence my opinions.

And sure, there are so-called bust at other positions. But, I've seen more examples of successful lower round interior lineman than almost any other position. And it's probably because they don't have to be as athletic or versatile for a team to have success on the OLine. AND that you just need 5 average to above average guys working together on the same page to form a good OLine. That's it, with the possible exception of the blindside protector, not one of them has to be a superstar or so-called premium player.