Well, I would say that you can't build exclusively through the draft, but a team must draft successfully or it has no chance. Look at last year's Cleveland Browns.
Rams Being Shortsighted?
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Huh? I thought Rams nailed it last year in trades, FA and the draft! I'd say perfect 20/20 vision; not shortsighted!
And, already killing it again this year!
And, already killing it again this year!
What FA's have we signed this year? NRC was already on our roster. Talib and Peters were trades (meaning we didnt have to pay for them at FA prices). A lot of the core talent (AD, Gurley, Goff, Saffold, Joyner, Brockers, etc. ) was drafted by Rams.
bluecoconuts
Legend
Like others have said, you need to do a combination. Young guys, plus older vets who can teach them. Look at our positions, we have Peters, young guy who's very talented for our corners, and then Shields and Talib are older guys who can teach young talent (and any potential rookies) some old vet secrets.
Our WR group has someone like Woods.
Our OL has Whitworth to teach the young guys. etc.
When you fill your team with old FA on one or two year deals (like we were doing with Spags and all them) that's when you never really get better, because you're always replacing. But we have young talent at each position. QB, RB, WR, CB, S, OL, DL, we mostly need to get depth at OT, and fill out our LB.
Our WR group has someone like Woods.
Our OL has Whitworth to teach the young guys. etc.
When you fill your team with old FA on one or two year deals (like we were doing with Spags and all them) that's when you never really get better, because you're always replacing. But we have young talent at each position. QB, RB, WR, CB, S, OL, DL, we mostly need to get depth at OT, and fill out our LB.
Some Rams recent Trades of Picks for Players:
In 2014 Traded a 2015 4th and 6th round picks for Mark Baron to get him early mid-season in the third year of his contract with the ability to exercise his fifth year option. This was a win because of the modest value of the draft picks they traded to get 1.5 seasons out of him (one of which was very very productive) on his rookie contract and also because they were able to extend him.
In 2016 the Rams traded two 2nd round picks in 2016 so they could get Goff. At this point in Goff's career this looks like a win in my book and worth the price to get a Franchise QB. Note: Until Goff's career plays out more we still will not really know if the Rams benefitted from this trade.
In 2017 traded a 2018 2nd round pick for Sammy Watkins. This one was a miss. Rams only got one year of moderate production from him and then lost him in Free agency. If this deal had been done five months earlier it would look better because then they could have exercised his fifth year option and integrated him more into the offense.
In 2018 traded a 2019 2nd round pick plus a 2018 4th round pick for Marcus Peters. I will go on record now saying I like the trade for the most part but a part of me is uneasy after the Watkins trade failure. On the plus side Peters is one of the best young CB's in the league, the Rams can keep him for a minimum of 2 years if they exercise the fifth year option, and he should produce at high end level from the outset. The downside is the potential for injury is always there and at worst they could only get one year of his services (without fifth year option) after giving up the draft picks.
For comparison listed are the recent 2nd round picks by our Rams:
2017 - Gerald Everett - Young ascending TE with a lot of upside (Promising Pick)
2015 - Rob Havenstein - 3 year starter at right tackle with continued growth (Solid Value Pick)
2014 - Lamarcus Joyner - 4 years of good production with continued growth. Starting free safety that just received the teams Franchise tag (Very Good Value Pick)
2012 - Brian Quick - 5 years with the Rams but way over drafted. Maybe with better coaching he could have been more productive (Moderate draft bust)
2012 - Janoris Jenkins - 4 yeas with the Rams top end CB (Very Good Value Pick)
2012 - Isaiah Pead (Significant Draft Bust)
2011 -Lance Kendricks - 5 years with the Rams (Solid Value Pick)
2010 - Rodger Saffold - 8 years with Rams (Very Good Value Pick)
2009 - James Laurinaitis - 7 years as Rams staring Middle linebacker (Very Good Value Pick)
In 2014 Traded a 2015 4th and 6th round picks for Mark Baron to get him early mid-season in the third year of his contract with the ability to exercise his fifth year option. This was a win because of the modest value of the draft picks they traded to get 1.5 seasons out of him (one of which was very very productive) on his rookie contract and also because they were able to extend him.
In 2016 the Rams traded two 2nd round picks in 2016 so they could get Goff. At this point in Goff's career this looks like a win in my book and worth the price to get a Franchise QB. Note: Until Goff's career plays out more we still will not really know if the Rams benefitted from this trade.
In 2017 traded a 2018 2nd round pick for Sammy Watkins. This one was a miss. Rams only got one year of moderate production from him and then lost him in Free agency. If this deal had been done five months earlier it would look better because then they could have exercised his fifth year option and integrated him more into the offense.
In 2018 traded a 2019 2nd round pick plus a 2018 4th round pick for Marcus Peters. I will go on record now saying I like the trade for the most part but a part of me is uneasy after the Watkins trade failure. On the plus side Peters is one of the best young CB's in the league, the Rams can keep him for a minimum of 2 years if they exercise the fifth year option, and he should produce at high end level from the outset. The downside is the potential for injury is always there and at worst they could only get one year of his services (without fifth year option) after giving up the draft picks.
For comparison listed are the recent 2nd round picks by our Rams:
2017 - Gerald Everett - Young ascending TE with a lot of upside (Promising Pick)
2015 - Rob Havenstein - 3 year starter at right tackle with continued growth (Solid Value Pick)
2014 - Lamarcus Joyner - 4 years of good production with continued growth. Starting free safety that just received the teams Franchise tag (Very Good Value Pick)
2012 - Brian Quick - 5 years with the Rams but way over drafted. Maybe with better coaching he could have been more productive (Moderate draft bust)
2012 - Janoris Jenkins - 4 yeas with the Rams top end CB (Very Good Value Pick)
2012 - Isaiah Pead (Significant Draft Bust)
2011 -Lance Kendricks - 5 years with the Rams (Solid Value Pick)
2010 - Rodger Saffold - 8 years with Rams (Very Good Value Pick)
2009 - James Laurinaitis - 7 years as Rams staring Middle linebacker (Very Good Value Pick)
We will build through the draft. The key is the ability to identify players in rounds 3 through 7 that are talented enough to make the team and contribute when called upon. Remember E.J. Gaines? He was drafted in 2014, in round 6 by the Rams.
How many sixes do we have this year – 3 or 4? The ones we keep, we need to hit on. It seems the media and fan focus are on the first day picks, and not so much 4 through 7. IMO the latter are crucial to a team’s success in “building through the draft.”
Good free agents can tide a team over for a year or two or more, until draft choices are ready. Teams that hit on later round draft picks (not to exclude the earlier selections) can work the cap efficiently over time. I believe Snead, McVay & Demoff can and will deliver ..
So tired of hearing this rhetoric. One idiot sports commentator made the dream team comparison and now every body and their brother is all over it. We are not Philly and we did not bring in players like Vince I can't qb young and call ourselves a dream team
Building through the draft hasn't worked out. Brockers is the only player remaining from the RGIII trade. That was the old regime and Les. If we start over from last year McSnead has done well. They have recovered from not getting Jenkins and Johnson resigned two years ago. They recovered at a fraction of the cost while that money can go elsewhere (Donald). Let's get off the past and look at what's happening now. The Woods contract (I really liked last year) looks even better today with the current free agent wide receivers. Signing NRC was a good move but, maybe they could have given him a longer deal which would have saved money. The Watkins deal was short sided but, we don't know if they were trying to get a deal done during the season last year. One year deal for Barwin was right on. Whitford and Sullivan were great signing. They had a very good draft with no first round pick. A complete turnaround using the draft, free agency and a trade.
Starting off this off season with a bang getting the 1-2 punch of Peters and Talib while saving cash capital was brilliant. Sure they spent some draft capital but all in all they are ahead of the game. It seems like the NFL has almost become a yearly reshaping of teams. The secondary is set for at least two years and can be longer by getting Peters and new deal sooner rather than later. The secondary is crazy good now with Peters, Talib Shade, NRC, Hill, Joyner and Johnson. Still work to be done but, it's still early in free agency with the draft and more cuts coming.
The Rams have managed to get more cash capital and draft capital by trading Quinn and Ogletree who didn't fit the new system. They have to be replaced of course but, now the younger drafted and undrafted players get a chance to step up. The Rams managed to add more draft picks this year. Looks like they will have added some comp picks next year. The Rams scouting department is coming into their own with Snead's continued makeover since he arrive.. They should start to be considered one of the better groups in the NFL. The Rams will still be getting great returns from the draft. They obviously have a new vision and direction for the defense that's taking shape. We just have to wait a little while longer to see it completed.
Starting off this off season with a bang getting the 1-2 punch of Peters and Talib while saving cash capital was brilliant. Sure they spent some draft capital but all in all they are ahead of the game. It seems like the NFL has almost become a yearly reshaping of teams. The secondary is set for at least two years and can be longer by getting Peters and new deal sooner rather than later. The secondary is crazy good now with Peters, Talib Shade, NRC, Hill, Joyner and Johnson. Still work to be done but, it's still early in free agency with the draft and more cuts coming.
The Rams have managed to get more cash capital and draft capital by trading Quinn and Ogletree who didn't fit the new system. They have to be replaced of course but, now the younger drafted and undrafted players get a chance to step up. The Rams managed to add more draft picks this year. Looks like they will have added some comp picks next year. The Rams scouting department is coming into their own with Snead's continued makeover since he arrive.. They should start to be considered one of the better groups in the NFL. The Rams will still be getting great returns from the draft. They obviously have a new vision and direction for the defense that's taking shape. We just have to wait a little while longer to see it completed.
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Frankly, I think that the Rams have played this young offseason brilliantly, so far.
Especially when viewed through a SB window of opportunity.
Consider how few holes as starters still remain with all of FA and the draft to go.
OLB. Maybe 2, but Vinny hinted that they love Ebu as one starter.
NT.
ILB.
C. I think extending Sully is virtually certain.
WR. A FA signing is likely, but I suspect that they’re also high on Reynolds and Thomas.
Starter wise, that’s about it. Child’s play compared to last year challenges at this time.
When finished, this D should be in Wade’s own image. That’s a very good thing, huh?
Like I said. Brilliant, so far.
Especially when viewed through a SB window of opportunity.
Consider how few holes as starters still remain with all of FA and the draft to go.
OLB. Maybe 2, but Vinny hinted that they love Ebu as one starter.
NT.
ILB.
C. I think extending Sully is virtually certain.
WR. A FA signing is likely, but I suspect that they’re also high on Reynolds and Thomas.
Starter wise, that’s about it. Child’s play compared to last year challenges at this time.
When finished, this D should be in Wade’s own image. That’s a very good thing, huh?
Like I said. Brilliant, so far.
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Sorry I made you click on the thread....btw I never said that we we’re DreamTeam2.0..I was using them as the example of what could happen...
I think you build through the draft....
With our draft position, we haven't done that as well as necessary the last 5 years...
hence the rash of trades and released players....
I still contend, in this age of media, to miss on the number of 1st, 2nd and 3rd round picks should be embarrassing to Snead....
Check out the Jags....Titans...and the ultimate draft, stay the fuck away from FA's team, Green Bay.
With our draft position, we haven't done that as well as necessary the last 5 years...
hence the rash of trades and released players....
I still contend, in this age of media, to miss on the number of 1st, 2nd and 3rd round picks should be embarrassing to Snead....
Why?
Check out the Jags....Titans...and the ultimate draft, stay the fuck away from FA's team, Green Bay.
Hell yeah it does....it doesn't work if the majority of the players you draft can't play.
Yep....First McVay guys...now, Son of Bum guys...
It seems that every year the Rams biggest needs going in to the draft just happen to be position groups that are strong in the upcoming draft. Is this by design or is Les just lucky?
Or am I just crazy and think I remember something?
Or am I just crazy and think I remember something?
I think it was said best by Coach .
The Rams are build this the same way as last season , if not better ?
1. Quinn & Ogletree we’re both players that got restructured for BIG $$$ . The Rams drafted them by the old regime.The Rams are going to address those players probably through the draft , & or from within there Roster already.
—They got draft picks !!
2. Whitworth,Woods were 2 huge FA signings.
3. **Tru Johnson held The Rams hostage.
The Rams only had a few draft picks last season.Now The Rams can’t afford to pay him who also was a Rams draft pick(who they will get a comp pick from). So what do The Rams do ? Trade a couple pick to bring in 2 all/Pro CB’s in for less then what Tru Johnson made.
& adding Sam Shields.
4.NRC - was basically there own. An SC guy who played better than his cost of contract by far.
5. Joyner was tagged like Tru Johnson last season. His replacement is going to be built through 53 next season.(comp ?)
6.Sammy Watkins was traded for a 2nd rd pick & is gone.(top5 comp pick) , but leaves The Rams without a 2nd rd pick. How is that building through the draft ?
7. Answering all of the above is The Rams traded for a couple DB’s & great contracts for All/Pros & end up with more draft picks than they have as well as a lot of cap space.
8. Tavon was signed through the draft. He is still a Ram. With these moves it might add cap room to keep a bad contract for draft picks at some point.
This post kind of reminds me of when you go get some items you need for the recipe to make a cake. You acquire eggs, oil, water, sugar, flour but when you crack the second egg you freak out questioning why you don't have all name brand products to make your cake. The answer is you don't need all top dollar name brand products to make a tasty cake and sometimes you can't get all the items for the cake at one time.
There is a method to the madness that not one of us knows on ROD what their plan they cooked up to transition this team from last year to deep in the playoffs is. I'm not going to say anything criticizing until after the draft and all cards are played. Even then Snead might do another Sammy trade.
There is a method to the madness that not one of us knows on ROD what their plan they cooked up to transition this team from last year to deep in the playoffs is. I'm not going to say anything criticizing until after the draft and all cards are played. Even then Snead might do another Sammy trade.
I do think the big contracts are going to happen, that the Rams are going to start showing the required ability to get the right guys locked up. Because it is a requirement for winning teams.
I just want to see it. They cannot expect Les to continue pullin rabbits out his @$$ the way he has thus far this offseason. So for this offseason at a minimum they need a solution or two along the OL otherwise next offseason is gonna be rough. Gettin AD locked up is big too.
They need to demonstrate they can ink the right guys otherwise this window is gonna be filled with up and down end results vice the sustained winning we are all starved to see.
I just want to see it. They cannot expect Les to continue pullin rabbits out his @$$ the way he has thus far this offseason. So for this offseason at a minimum they need a solution or two along the OL otherwise next offseason is gonna be rough. Gettin AD locked up is big too.
They need to demonstrate they can ink the right guys otherwise this window is gonna be filled with up and down end results vice the sustained winning we are all starved to see.
shaunpinney
Hall of Fame
I think some fans, me included, forget this. It isn't a limitless pot of money.
Last year's O is a prime example of this, an excellent FA haul and an impressive draft with only one are not quite right IMO and that was at TE...