Offensive line in shambles already. But ... it's early.
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Angry Ram
Captain RAmerica Original Rammer
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Saffold- You don't allow 2.5-3 sacks in a rookie season on fluke....I'm not worried. He needs to be more aggressive.
LG- Yeah that's a weak link, but no OL is made up entirely of high priced guys, except the Rams the last few years and look how that turned out.
Wells- I'm not worried about anything as long as he comes back sooner, maybe by 2nd preseason game at the latest.
Dahl- That's not fuckin holdin!
Smith- Like Saffold, he's been decent enough when he's been healthy. His rookie year was fine until concussion, was healthy all of 2010, and was decent last year until his major concussion.
The 2010 OL proved that they have talent. Now even tho 3 of the 5 guys are all new, it just shows it can be done.
LG- Yeah that's a weak link, but no OL is made up entirely of high priced guys, except the Rams the last few years and look how that turned out.
Wells- I'm not worried about anything as long as he comes back sooner, maybe by 2nd preseason game at the latest.
Dahl- That's not fuckin holdin!
Smith- Like Saffold, he's been decent enough when he's been healthy. His rookie year was fine until concussion, was healthy all of 2010, and was decent last year until his major concussion.
The 2010 OL proved that they have talent. Now even tho 3 of the 5 guys are all new, it just shows it can be done.
Angry Ram said:
Plus a "been there and done it" OL coach, and a head coach and coordinator who know how to scheme protection.
If there is one season where going over each and every players limitations on the OL will NOT add up, it's this one.
Yeah just IMO but it seems to me the most significant things that will lead to OL improvement don't get mentioned sometimes. One is health. If it's healthy it's fine--just will be. Same as 2010 but more developed and experienced plus with a running game. The other is coaching. Maybe the running game fails, maybe the 6th lineman (ie. pass-blocking TE) is a disaster, maybe Boudreau finally went a bridge too far. But that's a LOT to go wrong.
zn said:
I know you may not be addressing me, but I do mention coaching and health. I really still don't think there's a lot that has to go wrong in order for this line to be in deep trouble though man.
Username said:
I'm not addressing anyone in particular. Just a view that's everywhere, actually.
The only thing that could go wrong to put this OL in trouble is injuries.
Otherwise, the way it looks anyway, it's fine.
People complain about individual players. But they have never seen those players execute these schemes and protections under these coaches with the running game going.
It was fine in 2010 and that was without a running game, WITH a 2 young(er) OTs, no WRs, a hobbled SJ, and a rookie qb.
This will be an updated and more experienced OL presumably with a running game, with better WRs then they had then anyway, and a more experienced qb.
Injuries could rerail that but the combination of players, OL coaching, general scheme and approach, and so on, will be fine.
Maybe in the end we'll go "that was fine but let's improve it."
But the only thing that can bring disaster is massive injuries.
Again, if there is one time when just going down a checklist of individual OL players will not add up to a useful view, it's now.
X said:
Don't take offense. None was intended.
What I said was that Right now, at this point, doubt or skepticism are as much a waste of time as any other response.
That has to do with the fact that we haven't really seen them yet.
We don't know much about this OL yet because it is simply not the kind of offense where you can sit back and rate each lineman and draw a useful overall conclusion.
These guys, the coaches, are system guys. The OL works as something that is greater than a sum of its parts. The offensive attack reinforces that. Even the general ATTITUDE a Fisher player is supposed to internalize will reinforce that. And none of these coaches are very keen on exposing players by running plays they're not good at. That's the head coach, coordinator, and OL coach all working together in a way we have not seen as Rams fans for a long time.
IF there are no major injuries it will be FINE.
At the same time, injuries COULD derail things--I mean they did in all but one of the last 5 years--so optimism can't promise anything.
All I can say is that given what we know, it really is reasonable to be optimistic as anything else.
In fact I think the situation FAVORS optimism.
It seems to be the negative view comes from 2 places. 1, people worry about injuries. Okay, but, none of the guys injured now are "down." They're just one the sidelines of a very cautious coach. So the injuries that COULD matter haven't happened yet, IF they're going to. 2. people try and rate the individual players and deduce things from that. But, more than most teams and more than most years of watching the Rams, this is one situation where trying to rate individual players is not going to get anyone very far or give a very clear picture.
Those are my main points.
Good points. 2010 was a pretty weak schedule though. I'm not completely sold that the line didn't weaken our potential as an offense in 10 too.
I agree 110% on the injuries. It's not as if it's not a valid reason for concern though. Look at the history and even current shape of our line. I know we can't fix everything all at once, but still. It's a weak point.
Why?
If the point is "the entire line staying healthy all of 2012 will give us a decent unit" then I get it, and I agree.
K. I agree with that too.
Username said:
I;ve said why, though. Anyway.
It;s not easy to explain cause it's things we're used to from other regimes but adding up to a new combo with a new emphasis.
These are system coaches. The coordinator, head coach, and OL coach don't look for protection or ground yardage just by one-on-one match ups. This is an entire scheme working toward those things. It includes an OL coach about whom one thing is always said: his lines are always greater than the sum of their parts. He actually knows how to foster overall unit coherence. He doesn't just depend on it--more than most he knows how to CAUSE it to exist. It includes a head coach who regularly uses a 6th lineman in the form of a proficient blocking TE, and that includes pass blocking. It's an offense that works the passing game and running game closely together. It's a whole bunch of factors, and the history of Fisher and Boudreau especially bear that out. If you read what people were saying before the 2008 season, Atlanta was supposed to have one of the worst lines in the league. Some even said that it was a mistake to draft Ryan and sign Turner because they were going to be wasted--there was no OL to block for them. 2008 the Falcons had a very good OL. And up until it showed it did, you could find hardly anyone who believed guys like Dahl and Clabo should be starting.
We do agree if this OL stays healthy, it ought to be fine.
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X said:
Nah man... you never heard of grippin'?
And next you're going to tell me you haven't ever been known as Spanky. RIGHT!!! :7up:
Love the Tommy Boy reference though. A very under appreciated movie if you ask me. But then again, I've never reached up a butcher's ass, so what do I know.
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Tommy Boy is in my top 10 all time fave movies. Maybe top 5. Can't believe there's no wind out here.....other than zn......I KEED, I KEED!!! :mrgreen:
I actually agree with all parties in this thread, which is no easy task. I think those that are concerned with the OL thus far are justified if for no other reason because of the trauma and drama we saw with that unit last year. Hell, you would have to be on some serious Kool-Aid to NOT be thinking about it. I do agree with zn though, that it is early, and that the new scheme will actually require less of them than last years. I see a lot of TE blocking help coming this year. Maybe even a lot of 22 personnel.
I still think this offense will struggle to score points, but our defense will hopefully keep opposing offenses in check to help. Just like 2010. WE were able to move the ball well up and down the field and convert 3rd downs. I expect more of that this season, and if Quick/DX/Salas can give us some red zone love, maybe we score 20+ PPG. I think we are a year away from that though....
I actually agree with all parties in this thread, which is no easy task. I think those that are concerned with the OL thus far are justified if for no other reason because of the trauma and drama we saw with that unit last year. Hell, you would have to be on some serious Kool-Aid to NOT be thinking about it. I do agree with zn though, that it is early, and that the new scheme will actually require less of them than last years. I see a lot of TE blocking help coming this year. Maybe even a lot of 22 personnel.
I still think this offense will struggle to score points, but our defense will hopefully keep opposing offenses in check to help. Just like 2010. WE were able to move the ball well up and down the field and convert 3rd downs. I expect more of that this season, and if Quick/DX/Salas can give us some red zone love, maybe we score 20+ PPG. I think we are a year away from that though....