No changes to Rams' O-line, but team optimistic about better results

[JRobinson]

@JRobinson

Whitworth is not a stud?
(He is)

Havenstein was not a stud prior to his injury?
(He was)

I can already see right now that Edwards has stud potential.

And an offensive line does not have to have studs at every position.

All they really have to do is be above-average at their position and know how to work together as a unit.

Big Whit took a step back last season (age or whatever reason, insert here).

It’s been two seasons since Hav has been an above average starter.

The interior is extremely questionable and suspect. Don’t get it twisted, I love Noteboom, and feel he could be a serious contributor. But, he’s the closest thing to a starter other than the previously mentioned names.

I can also see why folks like Edwards as well, but that’s still a hard sell at this point of his career and experience.

you don’t needs studs at every position, no. But you do need a couple if not three very solid players. Example: Whit, Hav, and Saffold. Blythe also played well two seasons ago.

Again, if you don’t fortify the foundation, it’s plunder.

 

[Loyal]

homer

 

[So Ram]

I thought Blythe looked pretty good in 2018 between Havenstein and Sullivan.

But he looked like hell last year at guard between Allen and an injured Havenstein, which is to be expected.

I'm sticking with my projection that the line we finished the season with and looked good except for two games and those same 5 will start the season, (if we have one).
Whitworth
Corbett
Blythe
Edwards
Havenstein/Evans

That offensive line, playing together, early in the season, could really gel out into an excellent offensive line.

Totally disagree about Austin Blythe at RG during the end of 2018. He held up but showed he was to small to be a Every Day Guard. He did & has always shown promise at Center,going to to when he played for a banged up John Sullivan 2017.
I do think Evans gets beat out by Big Rob Havenstien, because of Evans being more of an ascending player who it would be easier to cross-train.My reasoning is Best 5 in case of injury.
Noteboom I believe sits out at least the first half of the season if not just the whole season. Is there a NEW PUP rule in place ? Having just one player a season is a joke.

 

[So Ram]

When I think stud I think of Saffold. Sad to say....

For how much of his Career?? As a LA Ram ?? I laugh at some who were negative & then join the Band Wagon.

I just remembering going to Oxnard & watching talk to LA Ram Fans, saying he was going to be Alright will sitting out training camp. Having to play next to the Big Tub Robinson .
He said he would out work his contract. He did in the end.I’ll add though I wasn’t always a Saffold Fan all the Time & still think The Rams made a solid decision. I think letting John Sullivan & giving both Noteboom & Brian Allen starting jobs with no experience. Sitting them out in preseason was a Freaking Joke.
Edwards,Evans, & Brewer all will be better from the experience from last season.
The Big question Mark is Todd Gurley !! That was the BUST.

 

[JRobinson]

He's right. It's time to cut Edwards, Evans, Corbett, Noteboom, Shelton, and Allen. I don't know why the team didn't draft a few all-pros this year to replace these bums. Where's the blue font?

Listen... I'm a homer, and I understand why some of you folks are pessimistic. But for the 100th time... who would you have drafted this year that would be better than our current guys? And why don't you think that the rookies and first-year linemen will not improve? And don't forget to subtract Cam Akers and Van Jefferson from the team, because we wouldn't have them either if we drafted more o-linemen.

If we still had all-pro Gurley and pro-bowler Cooks, we might have been able to sign a veteran O-linemen or two. Unfortunately, it didn't work out, and the D-line needed more help than the O-line anyway. I'm just hoping for another competitive season. It would be nice to be in the super bowl every year, but then football would suck for 31 other teams. I'm just hoping for the playoffs. Go Rams!

The point is not to ask why we didn’t draft one this year particularly. The point is that there has been a sense of neglect other than Noteboom for the past three seasons. Every team needs bodies at positions. Every team has players that are better at certain positions than others.

and yes, blue font was obviously warranted; and I get it.

But if you’re seriously %100 comfortable going into this season with who we currently have, then that’s where the line is drawn between our opinions.

 

[Soul Surfer]

When I think stud I think of Saffold. Sad to say....

He was definitely a stud once he had his shoulders repaired.

 

[BC Ramfan]

One thing about the 2020 O-Line that I feel better about is DEPTH.
The 2019 line got caught in the injuries trap with insufficient trained backups.
Gambled and lost and it really hurt. Lesson learned methinks.
That shouldn't happen again as the OL depth (though the same guys) is a LOT more prepared to fill in.
Hard to see them being bottom 5 again just from that POV, so improvement is very likely.
IF there's a season . . .

BC

 

[JRobinson]

One thing about the 2020 O-Line that I feel better about is DEPTH.
The 2019 line got caught in the injuries trap with insufficient trained backups.
Gambled and lost and it really hurt. Lesson learned methinks.
That shouldn't happen again as the OL depth (though the same guys) is a LOT more prepared to fill in.
Hard to see them being bottom 5 again just from that POV, so improvement is very likely.
IF there's a season . . .

BC

Filling in is one thing, but starting multiple games? Jeez let’s hope not.

Allowing Saffold to leave was the biggest mistake this regime has made so far IMO... yes, bigger than the Gurley contract.

 

[Rams43]

Filling in is one thing, but starting multiple games? Jeez let’s hope not.

Allowing Saffold to leave was the biggest mistake this regime has made so far IMO... yes, bigger than the Gurley contract.

I was hoping to keep Saffold, too, but I can understand the decision given the cap constraints. So, it’s hardly fair to call this the biggest regime mistake, IMO.

We need to get used to losing quality players each offseason ‘cause it’s inevitable on a talented roster in the cap era. It just is.

JJ and Everett walking next year are quite likely and such a list will only be getting longer and longer. Sigh...

 

[BonifayRam]

I was hoping to keep Saffold, too, but I can understand the decision given the cap constraints. So, it’s hardly fair to call this the biggest regime mistake, IMO.

We need to get used to losing quality players each offseason ‘cause it’s inevitable on a talented roster in the cap era. It just is.

JJ and Everett walking next year are quite likely and such a list will only be getting longer and longer. Sigh...

After signing Ramsey the list of Rams starting 2021 UFA's stands to be extra long when its all done IMO.

Leonard Floyd
Austin Blythe
Cooper Kupp
Troy Hill
John Johnson
Josh Reynolds

Plus non starters....

Gerald Everett
Malcolm Brown
Donte Deayon

 

[JRobinson]

I was hoping to keep Saffold, too, but I can understand the decision given the cap constraints. So, it’s hardly fair to call this the biggest regime mistake, IMO.

We need to get used to losing quality players each offseason ‘cause it’s inevitable on a talented roster in the cap era. It just is.

JJ and Everett walking next year are quite likely and such a list will only be getting longer and longer. Sigh...

I’m saying for me that is the biggest letdown so far. I’ve been extremely pleased with how this FO has done things and it pains me to even say that about the Saffold situation.

Development is the kicker in all this obviously. The Rams have found solid contributors later in draft picks. It’s just been tough to see that thus far for the OLine draftees due to multiple reasons that we all know.

In the end, I’d bet that not many on this forum would come out and say that they are comfortable with this unitgoing into the season; whoever ends up starting.

 

[CGI_Ram]

In the end, I’d bet that not many on this forum would come out and say that they are comfortable with this unitgoing into the season; whoever ends up starting.

I don’t know... but isn’t it more important the coaches seem to be?

 

[FarNorth]

I was hoping to keep Saffold, too, but I can understand the decision given the cap constraints. So, it’s hardly fair to call this the biggest regime mistake, IMO.

We need to get used to losing quality players each offseason ‘cause it’s inevitable on a talented roster in the cap era. It just is.

JJ and Everett walking next year are quite likely and such a list will only be getting longer and longer. Sigh...

It was a big mistake, but not just an inevitable result of cap constraints. Money is always an issue, but imo the Rams weighted the D over the O and spent the available money on Fowler, Matthews, and Weddle. This was a management error-- McVay and Snead decided to give Phillips' needs priority over the o-line.

Fowler alone cost as much or more more than Saffold would have for 2019, plus could not likely be resigned. It would have been better to keep Saffold and let Fowler walk, or squeeze together enough money for Saffold in some other fashion. That would likely have given us another three years of relative stability on the o-line. In particular, this would have avoided the need to replace two key starters at once with Sullivan not being signed either.

Fowler, with a big assist from AD's presence, did contribute sacks and big plays, but it wasn't enough to establish a consistent defense. It is also doubtful to me that he will be as successful in the future without AD.

The result was both an unraveling of the Rams' offense, especially the running game, and an inconsistent defense. Wade Phillips couldn't deliver the expected results on D and lost his job. Notably, Aaron Kromer didn't. My speculation is that Kromer advocated resigning Saffold but lost out to Phillips and the D in the cap space battle.

Oh, and we helped make Tennessee a championship contender with one of the best running games seen in recent years.

 

[CGI_Ram]

Fowler alone cost as much or more more than Saffold would have for 2019, plus could not likely be resigned. It would have been better to keep Saffold and let Fowler walk

One thing I will say... while Saffold might have fit equally in 2019... Fowler’s one year deal fit the contract window better?

Maybe?

I am just speculating but Demoff seems to really understand his overlaps as part of his spending model when you step back and look. We are rarely cap tight, and decisions seem mindful of future contracts... ensure expiring contracts and renewals align pretty good. I give KD credit for that.

 

[FarNorth]

One thing I will say... while Saffold might have fit equally in 2019... Fowler’s one year deal fit the contract window better?

Maybe?

I am just speculating but Demoff seems to really understand his overlaps as part of his spending model when you step back and look. We are rarely cap tight, and decisions seem mindful of future contracts... ensure expiring contracts and renewals align pretty good. I give KD credit for that.

Correct, but imo not a reason to let him walk. Rams have tied up more money in contracts for less results on many occasions.

 

[Kevin]

We are enamored with picking up comp picks after losing high priced free agents. If we re-sign Saffold instead of Fowler, we don’t get the pick we used to get Terrell Burgess and we can be fretting about how long Rodger will hold up after getting his big contract.

 

[Ram65]

It was a big mistake, but not just an inevitable result of cap constraints. Money is always an issue, but imo the Rams weighted the D over the O and spent the available money on Fowler, Matthews, and Weddle. This was a management error-- McVay and Snead decided to give Phillips' needs priority over the o-line.

Fowler alone cost as much or more more than Saffold would have for 2019, plus could not likely be resigned. It would have been better to keep Saffold and let Fowler walk, or squeeze together enough money for Saffold in some other fashion. That would likely have given us another three years of relative stability on the o-line. In particular, this would have avoided the need to replace two key starters at once with Sullivan not being signed either.

Fowler, with a big assist from AD's presence, did contribute sacks and big plays, but it wasn't enough to establish a consistent defense. It is also doubtful to me that he will be as successful in the future without AD.

The result was both an unraveling of the Rams' offense, especially the running game, and an inconsistent defense. Wade Phillips couldn't deliver the expected results on D and lost his job. Notably, Aaron Kromer didn't. My speculation is that Kromer advocated resigning Saffold but lost out to Phillips and the D in the cap space battle.

Oh, and we helped make Tennessee a championship contender with one of the best running games seen in recent years.

I'm not sure it was Folwer over Saffold. It's not a one-year thought process. We don't know what the Rams were thinking. We can make educated guesses. My guess is the Rams' big mistake was overestimating Noteboom's and Allen's abilities. While Saffold's contract was friendly in 2019 at $6.375M it goes up from $12.375M to almost $13M for the next three years. Matthews and Weddle did help early in the year but, tapered off after injuries. Fowler was very important to the defense with only a one-year commitment. Right now the Rams only have a small dead cap space remaining on these contracts and will get a comp pick for Fowler and got one for Saffold.

The Rams did invest cap space in both younger players in Havenstein and Higbee in 2019. The Rams could easily have seen the younger Havenstein as a more important asset to keep over an aging Saffold. While Havenstein regressed Higbee blossomed to becoming a top-level dual-threat TE. The Rams kept two younger blockers. I wanted the Rams to resign Saffold the year before last. I was thinking they could get a better deal resigning him then. I don't know maybe Saffold wanted to wait to become a free agent or the Rams didn't make an offer or it was too low. One thing for sure is the Rams have to make undesirable player decisions based on cap space.

 

[FarNorth]

I'm not sure it was Folwer over Saffold. It's not a one-year thought process. We don't know what the Rams were thinking. We can make educated guesses. My guess is the Rams' big mistake was overestimating Noteboom's and Allen's abilities. While Saffold's contract was friendly in 2019 at $6.375M it goes up from $12.375M to almost $13M for the next three years. Matthews and Weddle did help early in the year but, tapered off after injuries. Fowler was very important to the defense with only a one-year commitment. Right now the Rams only have a small dead cap space remaining on these contracts and will get a comp pick for Fowler and got one for Saffold.

The Rams did invest cap space in both younger players in Havenstein and Higbee in 2019. The Rams could easily have seen the younger Havenstein as a more important asset to keep over an aging Saffold. While Havenstein regressed Higbee blossomed to becoming a top-level dual-threat TE. The Rams kept two younger blockers. I wanted the Rams to resign Saffold the year before last. I was thinking they could get a better deal resigning him then. I don't know maybe Saffold wanted to wait to become a free agent or the Rams didn't make an offer or it was too low. One thing for sure is the Rams have to make undesirable player decisions based on cap space.

Agree that we don't know what the Rams were thinking, too bad we couldn't be flies on the wall recording cell phone videos when they debated personnel decisions. And I agree that these are tough choices about money and players with lots of stuff factoring in and many competing priorities. And no one has a crystal ball. And apparently the Rams did overestimate Noteboom and Allen (though they likely would have improved if they hadn't been lost to injuries.)

But to me (and I said so at the time) Saffold should have been a top priority.