McCoy, Suh, Bradford

[CGI_Ram]

Yeah, I remember your take on Jeffery, jrry.

Damn shame, so far.

Ramzee is here, but just a little.

 

[jrry32]

Yeah, I remember your take on Jeffery, jrry.

Damn shame, so far.

Ramzee is here, but just a little.

I don't give up that QUICKly. Lets hope next year is his breakout year. :wink:

 

[jap]

I don't give up that QUICKly. Lets hope next year is his breakout year. :wink:

I thought if Brian Quick showed any real progress this season it would come towards the latter part of the season. It is more likely he would break out next year. Last season was virtual a red shirt year for him. However, the man child is growing before our very eyes.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Lighten up Rammer and don't ruin our fun. We all had opinions about that draft and are just rehashing them.

I was in the camp that thought Bradford looked like a franchise QB in college and in his workouts prior to the draft. I also felt that if you don't have a good QB that you have to pick him, even if you don't think he is the next Peyton Manning because he is the best QB the Rams had a shot at acquiring in years, and most likely he is better than most other QBs that they could draft in the near future.

Unless the Rams were to be picking first in the draft the following few years, they would not have a shot at the best QB in the draft for a few years. And there usually is only one 'best' QB in each draft. Even if they liked Suh more, Bradford was the right choice because of the value of the position and how scarce top notch QBs usually are.

He followed up with ORY to endorse that he was the right choice.

 

[Rambitious1]

That's a good point. Unless they had the #1 overall pick and chose Cam Newton, they weren't getting a QB who was going to come in and play well enough. They probably would have taken Gabbert, Locker, or Ponder, who were the other 3 first round QBs. Not a good solution. And even worse than that, they would have missed out on Robert Quinn.

So a cute hypothetical question is....

Who would you rather have Suh and Ponder or Bradford and Quinn.

Anyone?

Cam Newton.....no thank you.

 

[RamFan503]

I recall that they said they would have considered a trade if someone blew their socks off. If not - they were going with Sam. Personally, I think it's a little telling. They didn't hit on all that many picks but I really think they and most of the NFL knew that Sam had all the tools. If you think about what the Skins gave us for the rights of RG, I think it would have taken pretty close to that before the Rams would have given up Sam. And give Sam ONE real good receiver and a decent O-line in his first couple seasons. For me it's still a tough call between him and Luck. RG is out of the picture for me. Yeah - I think I still take Sam. And I was a Suh guy FWIW.

 

[Thordaddy]

I recall that they said they would have considered a trade if someone blew their socks off. If not - they were going with Sam. Personally, I think it's a little telling. They didn't hit on all that many picks but I really think they and most of the NFL knew that Sam had all the tools. If you think about what the Skins gave us for the rights of RG, I think it would have taken pretty close to that before the Rams would have given up Sam. And give Sam ONE real good receiver and a decent O-line in his first couple seasons. For me it's still a tough call between him and Luck. RG is out of the picture for me. Yeah - I think I still take Sam. And I was a Suh guy FWIW.

Yeah, I'm OK with it NOW,cuz I now know Sam has............... IT,I SAW ................IT in those three games before he got hurt,before that,I liked his potential , tools, but wasn't sure he inspired his team to believe ,for me he lacked that intangible ,maybe I imagined something ,but I still say I saw .............IT.

 

[RamFan503]

Yeah, I'm OK with it NOW,cuz I now know Sam has............... IT,I SAW ................IT in those three games before he got hurt,before that,I liked his potential , tools, but wasn't sure he inspired his team to believe ,for me he lacked that intangible ,maybe I imagined something ,but I still say I saw .............IT.

Nah Thor. I saw IT too. I do however have to wonder if the coaches would have game planned as well with Sam in the game. Part of me thinks that his abilities change the dynamics so that you don't rely on the rest of the team quite as much. He can make all the throws so you just let him - y'know?

 

[RamFan503]

I guess what I'm trying to say is that with Clemens, you really work at designing plays to take advantage of others because you know KC's limitations. With Sam in, you design more plays around him than around the full offense. I dunno. Just a thought.

 

[jrry32]

I recall that they said they would have considered a trade if someone blew their socks off. If not - they were going with Sam. Personally, I think it's a little telling. They didn't hit on all that many picks but I really think they and most of the NFL knew that Sam had all the tools. If you think about what the Skins gave us for the rights of RG, I think it would have taken pretty close to that before the Rams would have given up Sam. And give Sam ONE real good receiver and a decent O-line in his first couple seasons. For me it's still a tough call between him and Luck. RG is out of the picture for me. Yeah - I think I still take Sam. And I was a Suh guy FWIW.

Yea, people always undervalue the supporting cast. I don't care how good the QB is, he needs help. Look at Andrew Luck since Reggie Wayne got hurt:
Prior to Wayne's Injury:
136/224
60.7%
1574 yards
7.0 YPA
10 TDs
3 Ints
91.3 QB Rating
5-2 record(beat SF, SEA, Denver)

After Wayne's Injury:
90/162
55.6%
1019 yards
6.3 YPA
5 TDs
4 Ints
74.6 QB Rating
2-2 Record

 

[jap]

Yea, people always undervalue the supporting cast. I don't care how good the QB is, he needs help. Look at Andrew Luck since Reggie Wayne got hurt:

Yeah, thanks Jerry for highlighting is the difference between the young so-called NFL ready QB's (Luck, Wilson, Kaepernick, even Matt Ryan and Stafford) and Sam: they came into the NFL with much better teams than Sam did. It was amazing to me what Sam accomplished his rookie year with no real receiving talent. Even this season, he has been mentoring young, immature talent that is being forced to grow up quickly now that he is down.

You have to figure Sam and Schotty are seeing how Tavon can be used as a flanker and as the ultimate decoy, what Sted is doing in his limited opportunities, Quick's slow, steady growth, how Cory is coming on as a blocker and part-time receiver, what Jared's awesome potential can be. You have to figure Sam and Schotty are seeing what passing opportunities open up with a legitimate running game.

Sam had to play it safe early on with mostly conservative throws because the running game had not emerged yet. With Sam's accuracy and Zac/Benny's running, can we really imagine how frightening this team can be when DC's have to pick their poison and choose to defend the run or defend the pass or (often inadequately) try to defend both?

 

[Thordaddy]

I guess what I'm trying to say is that with Clemens, you really work at designing plays to take advantage of others because you know KC's limitations. With Sam in, you design more plays around him than around the full offense. I dunno. Just a thought.

Nah Thor. I saw IT too. I do however have to wonder if the coaches would have game planned as well with Sam in the game. Part of me thinks that his abilities change the dynamics so that you don't rely on the rest of the team quite as much. He can make all the throws so you just let him - y'know?

The people who rank QB's saw "IT" too,I get what yer sayin BTW,that maybe the best way to utilize Sam is to give him the game plans they are giving KC and watch him make 120 rankings a routine

 

[CGI_Ram]

The only valid critique of Sam in my book is his ability to stay healthy. He owns proving that.

Otherwise, he's here the next 10 years.

 

[The Rammer]

That's not exactly true. There have been a number of circumstances where fans got it right. Difference is that fans rarely remember the ones they got wrong.

For example, I don't work for a NFL team but in the 2012 Draft, I was adamant that we should have picked Alshon Jeffery over Brian Quick and Lavonte David over Isaiah Pead.

Jeffery is developing into a very good NFL WR and is on pace for 1000+ receiving yards this year. Lavonte David is very arguably the best young 4-3 LB in the NFL today. We'll see about Quick, his book isn't written yet. I think Pead's is. Regardless, as it stands now, it appears I got it right...even though Snead has done a good job drafting thus far.

However, I also got it wrong in the 1st round when I wanted David DeCastro over Michael Brockers.

So yea, we tend to remember our triumphs but forget our short-comings. I have a decent success rate overall(an amazing success rate with WRs) but I still don't think I know more about the game or scouting or am better than Les Snead. That all said, it's still a game of guesswork and sometimes, you end up getting it right when the NFL guys don't.

As far as Max's post, I don't think he was using hindsight. Only saying those that thump their chest about Suh in hindsight actually made the wrong pick. I know Ramzee(I'm not sure if he posts here) was one of the few that preferred Gerald McCoy to Suh.

It sure helps Alshon Jeffery he has other nice teammates such as Brandon Marshall that takes away multiple coverages and roll backs his way doesn't it? It always helps the offensive coordinator didn't have head stuck in butt roughly half the season or his teams offensive philosophy isn't run first like it is the Rams. Brian Quick is doing just fine in his progression IMO and no one will obviously ever know how Alshon or anybody else would do in our offense.

It bugs me when a mere fan thinks he knows more than most Team personnel after researching players with a few hours of youtube tape. However, I do see where you are coming from and think I have similar tastes you have with our pick as I wanted DeCastro and liked David as well. However with our personal, play calling, coaches, and philosophy who knows if they would have panned out negatively or positively with us.

 

[mr.stlouis]

NO doubt in my mind Bradford was the right pick. I'd briskly walk to the podium and stiff arm any suggestors that try to sway my opinion if we had a do over.

 

[jrry32]

It sure helps Alshon Jeffery he has other nice teammates such as Brandon Marshall that takes away multiple coverages and roll backs his way doesn't it? It always helps the offensive coordinator didn't have head stuck in butt roughly half the season or his teams offensive philosophy isn't run first like it is the Rams. Brian Quick is doing just fine in his progression IMO and no one will obviously ever know how Alshon or anybody else would do in our offense.

It bugs me when a mere fan thinks he knows more than most Team personnel after researching players with a few hours of youtube tape. However, I do see where you are coming from and think I have similar tastes you have with our pick as I wanted DeCastro and liked David as well. However with our personal, play calling, coaches, and philosophy who knows if they would have panned out negatively or positively with us.

On the topic of Jeffery, it was more like a couple years of watching him play in person.

Marshall helps but Jeffery is still on the field beating his man. Quick may end up being fine but he's not at the same point as Jeffery in his progression...whether or not he has Marshall lined up opposite him. I hope Quick ends up better than Jeffery but at the present time, Jeffery is the better player.

 

[Yamahopper]

The scheme a player steps into is just as important as the players talent in his success. Suh might have been a much better player for the Rams than McCoy in Tampa. McCoy could have been so so for the Lions and Bradford could have really sucked for the Browns considering all the turmoil in The Factory of Sadness. In other words It's a speculation.

 

[The Rammer]

On the topic of Jeffery, it was more like a couple years of watching him play in person.

Marshall helps but Jeffery is still on the field beating his man. Quick may end up being fine but he's not at the same point as Jeffery in his progression...whether or not he has Marshall lined up opposite him. I hope Quick ends up better than Jeffery but at the present time, Jeffery is the better player.

Yeah I liken it to being something like how when everybody a few years back was on Sanchez, Freeman, and Locker and the guy from Miami nuts but how are they doing now? Do they have half the potential that Sam did and does? No. That's How I feel about Brian Quick.... He's going to have a breakout season next year I feel IMO.

 

[RamFan503]

Yeah I liken it to being something like how when everybody a few years back was on Sanchez, Freeman, and Locker and the guy from Miami nuts but how are they doing now? Do they have half the potential that Sam did and does? No. That's How I feel about Brian Quick.... He's going to have a breakout season next year I feel IMO.

Works for me. I think Quick is doing all the other things and paying his dues. His next tour of duty? Increased targets.