Late to the party receiver scouting

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leoram

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Coaching, Coaching, Coaching

Since we were picking so late and at the behest of my family, I waited this year to study our picks after they were made. I tried to forget what I read and simply watched each player based on film study to determine the impact each could make in a McVay offense. In short, each have skills that will require a ton of refinement to translate to NFL success.

I will start with Kupp. He's not a tremendous athlete but he's a natural hands catcher, has top notch receiver instincts, sets up his routes well, and competes his ass off. It will take time to develop the necessary chemistry with Goff because precision is the name of his game.
I suppose you could line him outside occasionally if he were to draw a third level db, but I wouldn't do it regularly. He ain't no Jordy Nelson. No, Cooper is a dangerous slot man and by his second year can become a go to guy especially in high leverage situations when you need a first down.

Gerald Everett is a project in every way. He's a good athlete and a talented prospect, but he has a ton to learn and doesn't have an imposing frame. I suppose if anyone can get rookie success out of him, it's McVay...but only when he gets schemed into a great playcall that allows him to use his athleticism in space. While he's a willing blocker, he has so much to learn about technique and needs a couple years in an NFL weight room to truly be effective. I predict he will have glorious moments as a rook, but he needs a lot of development before he should be mentioned in the same sentence as Jordan Reed. With that said, he does have the necessary talent to get there one day.

On to Reynolds, the wiry long strider. I will say this, he makes terrific adjustments to the ball on long patterns. This is a natural instinct that can't be taught and why so many speedsters never make it in the NFL. However, if I were a defensive coordinator, I'd press his ass all day long. He knows how to stem his routes but won't fool many good corners in the NFL. He competes well with the ball in the air, but needs to add a dozen techniques to his arsenal for me to trust him outside more often than a couple unexpected bombs a game. Give him a couple years and you may be looking and Brandin Cooks.

As I said, each have good role player traits that should someday make them players who excel in the McVay offense. With that said, those who are lauding rookie impact are setting themselves up for disappointment. This draft was about a long ranged overhaul. The game is too complex to count on these youngsters to compete with seasoned, NFL conditioned vets. While I like each pick, pump the breaks on the high early returns I keep reading.
 

leoram

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Nice @leoram

I'd like to see you go to the 5th...have you looked at the OLB from EWU?

Thank you. As for Samson Ebukan, I can see why his length is attractive, but to me he plays too high. Perhaps they can get him to play with a lower pad level and his effectiveness will increase. I'd like to see him improve his hand fighting, play recognition, and power to set the edge. As long as they keep it simple for him, he can make some quality plays. He will exploit bad technique with his tenacity and athleticism so I guess I see him in some situational packages his first year but doubt he sees the field more than 30% of the defensive snaps unless there are some significant injuries among the vets. Once again, how he takes to Ram coaching will be the key. In Phillips I trust.
 

Zodi

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Maybe I'm missing something, but how is Reynolds comparable to Brandin Cooks, at all?
 

Rambitious1

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Gerald Everett is a project in every way. He's a good athlete and a talented prospect, but he has a ton to learn and doesn't have an imposing frame. I suppose if anyone can get rookie success out of him, it's McVay...but only when he gets schemed into a great playcall that allows him to use his athleticism in space. While he's a willing blocker, he has so much to learn about technique and needs a couple years in an NFL weight room to truly be effective. I predict he will have glorious moments as a rook, but he needs a lot of development before he should be mentioned in the same sentence as Jordan Reed. With that said, he does have the necessary talent to get there one day.

Oh wonderful....another 'project' with 'upside'.......
Just what a young team searching for it's first winning record in years needs......:confused:
 

rdw

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Oh wonderful....another 'project' with 'upside'.......
Just what a young team searching for it's first winning record in years needs......:confused:
We're in year one of the McVay regime. The counter has been reset so there haven't been previous projects..
 

leoram

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Maybe I'm missing something, but how is Reynolds comparable to Brandin Cooks, at all?

He's an outside, downfield threat. He doesn't have Cooks' speed but in time, can learn to fill the same role the Patriots intend for Cooks.
 

Zodi

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He's an outside, downfield threat. He doesn't have Cooks' speed but in time, can learn to fill the same role the Patriots intend for Cooks.

So Reynolds doesn't have the thing that makes Brandin Cooks, Brandin Cooks. And Reynolds is five inches taller.

Ok.
 

So Ram

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Reynolds is going to be our Mike Evans in a couple years, book it!

Yeah - I think he will get bigger & stronger as well. You can tell that by his bloodlines . He goes up & catches the ball. Think he was a steal . Sleeper type.
 

TexasRam

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Quite a funny comparison: Cooks and Reynolds. :LOL:

I like to compare Tavon Austin to Randy Moss personally :D

Whenever i see Tavon score TD's i shout out at the sports bar "That was so Moss right there!!". :yay:
 

jrry32

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As I said, each have good role player traits that should someday make them players who excel in the McVay offense. With that said, those who are lauding rookie impact are setting themselves up for disappointment. This draft was about a long ranged overhaul. The game is too complex to count on these youngsters to compete with seasoned, NFL conditioned vets. While I like each pick, pump the breaks on the high early returns I keep reading.

I disagree. Kupp is ready to play. His releases and routes are already NFL caliber. He sees the field pre-snap like a QB and has a QB's understanding of the game. I remember how incredible it was having Marshall Faulk because he was a HB with a QB's mind. Kupp is similar in that regard. He's incredibly technically and mentally advanced for his age.(and that's taking into account the fact that he's an older rookie) I feel very confident that he'll be ready to step onto the field as a starter early in the year.

As for Everett, he's very raw. I agree. But McVay will scheme him onto the field like he did with Jordan Reed. Everett is a little more raw than Reed, but McVay can still find ways to get him touches.
 

Elmgrovegnome

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@Leo, I agree with you, that Everett is raw. He was drafted based on potential. But, I read more than one eval saying he compares favorably to Reed.

I disagree with you on Kupp. He could have as much impact as Nelson. He is not just a slot receiver either. He could line up anywhere and get open.

Reynolds was drafted on upside. Consider which round he was picked in. How many finished products come from any round but the first? I think they did great getting Kupp in round 3, because he is damn close to a finished product. What do fourth fifth and sixth round picks look like? They look like Reynolds and Ebukam. Upside picks. Projections. Thing is I like the potential of the players that Snead picked, after round one. He has a decent track record with late round picks.

I will admit, not having a first round pick lowered my expectations for this draft, but I am very happy with the haul. I see lots of potential in every pick.
 

Rambitious1

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We're in year one of the McVay regime. The counter has been reset so there haven't been previous projects..

Ummm nope. Disagree.
Just because we have a new coach does not automatically erase the B.S. 'upside' and 'potential' picks this team has selected in the last few years.
My post is 100% factual. Now, you may not wish to count this year's picks against this coach etc., (and that's fine) but this organization has done this ad infinitum for years.

The point being - regarding the Rams Organization as a whole......
And that given the state we are in, with the roster as it is, the last thing we need is another 'project' pick high in the draft.
That's all I was stating......
 

jrry32

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Ummm nope. Disagree.
Just because we have a new coach does not automatically erase the B.S. 'upside' and 'potential' picks this team has selected in the last few years.
My post is 100% factual. Now, you may not wish to count this year's picks against this coach etc., (and that's fine) but this organization has done this ad infinitum for years.

The point being - regarding the Rams Organization as a whole......
And that given the state we are in, with the roster as it is, the last thing we need is another 'project' pick high in the draft.
That's all I was stating......

Other than Everett, who are the upside picks? Ebukam? We took a lot of high character, experienced players this year. The vast majority of our draft picks played in the Senior Bowl. Also, your post wasn't 100% factual. It was an opinion.

What's wrong with a "project?" As I've demonstrated before, Jeff Fisher had a ton of success drafting projects on defense, especially at safety (which happened to be the position he came up coaching). McVay is an offensive-minded coach who came up coaching TEs; it makes a lot of sense to trust him with that position.
 

Faceplant

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Appreciate the write up Leo, but may I ask what your background with football is? This is not a call out in ANY way, as you sound knowledgeable about the game, I am just curious if you have experience coaching/scouting at any level. My opinion differs from yours somewhat with regards to this years draft picks, but I am no coach/scout. While I do not have any allusions of the young TE/WRs tearing up the league in year one, I DO think they will contribute....and possibly more than most think. I also think Kupp can be used outside of the slot just due to his quick feet and route precision. I could be completely wrong however. I only played the game through high school and can only base my opinion off of what I see on tape and a "feeling" I get. That sounded dirty....
 

rdw

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Ummm nope. Disagree.
Just because we have a new coach does not automatically erase the B.S. 'upside' and 'potential' picks this team has selected in the last few years.
My post is 100% factual. Now, you may not wish to count this year's picks against this coach etc., (and that's fine) but this organization has done this ad infinitum for years.

The point being - regarding the Rams Organization as a whole......
And that given the state we are in, with the roster as it is, the last thing we need is another 'project' pick high in the draft.
That's all I was stating......
So what is this coaching staff not allowed to do that previous ones could? Draft a qb number one? Trade up for a WR? Run a 4-3? Can we have a list that meets your approval?
 

Memphis Ram

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I agree with leoram on Kupp.

Even in the post day two draft interview, while McVay said that they move WRs around, he even stated that Kupp is more in the mold of a slot WR. And Snead talked about how his agility work at the combine matched up to the elite slot WRs in the league.

IMO, the Rams would be nuts to move Kupp outside too much when he has the potential to be so huge of a match up problem for defenses from the slot.

Look at it this way. Kupp vs. someone like Lamarcus Joyner in the slot vs. Kupp vs. Trumaine Johnson or another team's top CB outside. If these guys were on opposing teams and you were the defensive coordinator, which match up would keep you up at nights? I hope they don't try to stick Az Hakim (match up problem slot WR) outside like the Lions tried to do years ago.

As far as Reynolds, after watching a few Redskins games, I came away really encouraged with how much McVay really likes to use bunch WR sets to back off defenders and give his players a better chance. Never understood why the Rams didn't do it more.:palm:
 

leoram

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@jrry32 , @Elmgrovegnome , @Faceplant , my post more agrees with you than disagrees. You will see that I lauded the rook's many gifts and see effective futures for them. I also believe their development, as with all rookies is contingent not only on their talent, but on the coaching they receive and their ability to adjust to the NFL game. I believe this staff has what it takes to make that happen...IN TIME.

Kupp is nowhere near ready to be compared to Nelson, Reynolds to Cooks, nor Everett to Reed. My point is that there is no way even talented rookies should carry the expectations of seasoned NFL Pro Bowlers who have years of experience operating in top 10 offenses with Pro Bowl level QB's and develop the chemistry necessary to attain THAT much success. This is why we should slow that roll.

Consider this, Tom Brady and the Patriots receivers were largely ineffective in the first half of the Super Bowl. It required ALL of their experience and talent to pull off the comeback. Are we really ready to say that Goff, Kupp, Reynolds, and Everett would have any chance of being anywhere in the same stratosphere as Brady, Edelman, Amendola, and Bennett in that venue? Of course not. Yet as I read much of the offseason hype on these guys...well, let's just say I've spiked that Kool-Aid myself for over 50 years of watching football and I now do so with caution. I remember Carriker "rag dolling" offensive linemen in camp, Tavon "breaking ankles", and Jim Everett as "General Blade."

Recap: Kupp is is a savvy route runner with excellent hands and has potential to be excellent in the slot. Reynolds has the single most uncoachable and necessary skill to win on deep balls, the natural instinct to adjust when the ball is in the air that far and that long. Everett is athletic and can be schemed to some success under McVay. They just won't reach their potential THIS YEAR. Ladies and gentlemen, to expect that of any of them THIS YEAR is truly unrealistic. But go ahead if you must. I just don't want to do it to myself again this year.
 

jrry32

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@jrry32 , @Elmgrovegnome , @Faceplant , my post more agrees with you than disagrees. You will see that I lauded the rook's many gifts and see effective futures for them. I also believe their development, as with all rookies is contingent not only on their talent, but on the coaching they receive and their ability to adjust to the NFL game. I believe this staff has what it takes to make that happen...IN TIME.

Kupp is nowhere near ready to be compared to Nelson, Reynolds to Cooks, nor Everett to Reed. My point is that there is no way even talented rookies should carry the expectations of seasoned NFL Pro Bowlers who have years of experience operating in top 10 offenses with Pro Bowl level QB's and develop the chemistry necessary to attain THAT much success. This is why we should slow that roll.

I don't care about comparisons. The point I'm making is that Cooper Kupp is ready to play. Like any other player, he will get better with experience, but he is ready to contribute this year. We can count on him to step into the slot for us this year and make plays. His mental acuity and technical skill are more than NFL caliber.

Consider this, Tom Brady and the Patriots receivers were largely ineffective in the first half of the Super Bowl. It required ALL of their experience and talent to pull off the comeback. Are we really ready to say that Goff, Kupp, Reynolds, and Everett would have any chance of being anywhere in the same stratosphere as Brady, Edelman, Amendola, and Bennett in that venue? Of course not. Yet as I read much of the offseason hype on these guys...well, let's just say I've spiked that Kool-Aid myself for over 50 years of watching football and I now do so with caution. I remember Carriker "rag dolling" offensive linemen in camp, Tavon "breaking ankles", and Jim Everett as "General Blade."

I don't think I've seen any person here talking about the Rams being in the Super Bowl, so I don't really see the relevance of this point.

Recap: Kupp is is a savvy route runner with excellent hands and has potential to be excellent in the slot. Reynolds has the single most uncoachable and necessary skill to win on deep balls, the natural instinct to adjust when the ball is in the air that far and that long. Everett is athletic and can be schemed to some success under McVay. They just won't reach their potential THIS YEAR. Ladies and gentlemen, to expect that of any of them THIS YEAR is truly unrealistic. But go ahead if you must. I just don't want to do it to myself again this year.

I get it. There are very few guys in the history of the NFL who peaked as rookies. However, the way your post was worded gave the impression that you don't think they're going to make an impact this year. The point I'm making is that Kupp will make an impact this year. There is no someday with him. He's not going to peak this year, but he's going to make an impact for us.