Isn’t it suspicious that Rams now have a string of failed drafted secondary players?

[ScotsRam]

You have a gift for abrasive sarcasm. THAT’s what makes me bristle.

And I’m not the only one who has noticed, trust me.

Yep, back to ignore you go.

 

[fanotodd]

In the championship season, if you look at snap counts, 6 of the top 10 players on offense and 5 of the top 10 on defense were draft picks.

And yes, a term like “failed abysmally” (See original post) is a condemnation.

I hate this pattern, which is all too common on message boards (The Herd is particularly bad). Worried fans post over-the-top pessimistic thoughts (their own, or by reposting Click Bait Blogs), others say "wait a second... be patient... etc." and the reply is "what, we can't criticize?"

Constructive criticism - great.
This kind of stuff - tedious and pointless.

No, the team has not "failed abysmally" in drafting DBs.

Okay.

Happy?

Next question.

This is the part I’m not getting—late round picks/UDFAs in the secondary. There is a solid argument to be made that this is the one area where the FO has excelled.

My issue with past drafting is everywhere EXCEPT the secondary.
They just don’t want to make the trenches a priority.
And despite the premium picks on weapons, who has stuck, other than Kupp?

 

[PARAM]

This is the part I’m not getting—late round picks/UDFAs in the secondary. There is a solid argument to be made that this is the one area where the FO has excelled.

My issue with past drafting is everywhere EXCEPT the secondary.
They just don’t want to make the trenches a priority.
And despite the premium picks on weapons, who has stuck, other than Kupp?

First of all we have to define "premium picks". I'd assume 1st through 3rd? But in the Rams case, 2nd through 4th because they have not had the ultra premium pick in any year. Priority? In 2018 and 2022 their first selection was OL. IN 2018 their first two were OL.

OL/DL "premium picks"

>>>Weapons drafted

2017 (None) because they had just signed Whitworth and Sullivan, acquired Blythe

>>>Weapon drafted? (3) Everett, Kupp and Reynolds

2018 (3)
Noteboom in the 3rd, Allen in the 4th. First three picks were spent on the trenches. Now we can argue how they worked out but one of them started and played well in a Superbowl. The other started a playoff game in a pinch and did extremely well. DE John Franklin-Myers was their third pick that year (4th rd) and though he didn't work out for the Rams, he's been in the league ever since, starting 33 games the last 2 years for the Jets. So they must have seen something when they drafted him.

>>>Weapons drafted? None

2019 (2) Evans, a failure and Gaines in the 4th.

>>>Weapons drafted? (1) Henderson, a marginal failure though he did make some plays in the Superbowl.

2020 (none)

>>>Weapons drafted? (3) Akers, Jefferson and Hopkins. Still with the team. Apparently, still part of the plan.

2021 (1) Bobby Brown in the 4th. We'll see this year if he's a hit or miss.

>>>Weapons drafted? (1) Tutu. We know how most of Ramsnation feels about him.

2022 (1) Bruss with the first pick

>>>Weapons drafted? None.

Seems to me with their premium picks, they've taken trench guys 7 times out of 23 picks. That's 30%. How much should they invest in the trenches? 50%? More? Less? So they've spent 8 picks on weapons, 35%. The other 8 picks? S Johnson, OLB Ebukam (could be considered "trenches"), S Rapp, CB Long, OLB Lewis (could also be considered trenches), S Burgess, ILB Jones, CB Durant. 35%

When you look at the "premium picks" they've spread it around fairly evenly. How many guys stick....well that's important but not the entire point. It's identifying, selecting and hopefully developing. That's never a 100% proposition.

They have faired about as well as any team with the non-premium picks, perhaps better than most. Better the last 4 years than the first two.

 

[Rams43]

And you have a gift for fishing for clicks with the bait of Negative Nancy thread titles.

I'm quite certain I'm not the only one (here and elsewhere) who has noticed that.

To each their own, I guess.

Of course, I've given several reasoned and data-supported responses to your premise. Interesting that you don't respond to any of that. Guess its easier to just whine that I'm being too snarky for your taste.

If you'd actually like to discuss the Rams' track record of drafting DBs relative to other teams, I'd love to know how you'd respond to my previous posts (and those of others, who have likewise put the Rams' track record into perspective).

Your move.

Have a nice day. I’m done.

 

[FrantikRam]

So we're saying a guy who played a lot and barely gave up a catch to help us win the Super Bowl is a failure?

Ooooof

 

[Allen2McVay]

Burgess
Long
Rochell (apparently)

These were all 3rd/4th round picks and all had very high expectations.
...

When you ask ... 'Isn't it suspicious?' ... are you thinking what I am thinking? ... The Government!?!

 

[Malibu]

"only relying on drafting rookies and using UDFA's" for what?

We have an OL
We have a great QB
We have experienced WR
We have TEs
We have RBs

We have AD
We have E.Jones
We have Fuller
We have a bunch of 2nd year defensive backs
We have a bunch of 3rd and 4th year DL

We need some more pieces. Do they all have to come from free agency?
"So far" we haven't signed 1 free agent, other than Shelton.
Are we waiting for the market to slow down?
Are we waiting for the draft, to see what needs are still remaining.

Does every other team in the NFL have their 53 man roster for 2023 set right now?

Patience, grasshopper. We're not tanking.

Look your patience angle is correct in one sense we haven't finished the FAs or the draft so there are still a lot of unknowns.

But I believe you are wrong when you try and equate the level of play of all those late rounders, UDFAs and inexperienced 2nd year players to fielding a competitive team because that ludicris on it's face. Our OL in any combo was terrible. Our CBs that are on the roster were terrible minus Durant and he didn't play in many games , - we will get smoked by our secondary and zero pass rush from our OLBs Donald can't do it all. We don't have a stout run d because Gaines, AShaen Wagner and Floyd are gone. 8 of 11 starters on defense will be gone if Rapp and AShawn sign elsewhere.

Offense will not be as bad as the defense but I keep saying no matter how many points we put up on Offense the Defense will give up more. Think Detroit and the difference from them to this year's Rams is they have 3 probowlers on their OL we will not have one and that won't even be close.

 

[PARAM]

Look your patience angle is correct in one sense we haven't finished the FAs or the draft so there are still a lot of unknowns.

But I believe you are wrong when you try and equate the level of play of all those late rounders, UDFAs and inexperienced 2nd year players to fielding a competitive team because that ludicris on it's face. Our OL in any combo was terrible. Our CBs that are on the roster were terrible minus Durant and he didn't play in many games , - we will get smoked by our secondary and zero pass rush from our OLBs Donald can't do it all. We don't have a stout run d because Gaines, AShaen Wagner and Floyd are gone. 8 of 11 starters on defense will be gone if Rapp and AShawn sign elsewhere.

Offense will not be as bad as the defense but I keep saying no matter how many points we put up on Offense the Defense will give up more. Think Detroit and the difference from them to this year's Rams is they have 3 probowlers on their OL we will not have one and that won't even be close.

That's your opinion and it's a valid one.

But fielding a competitive team with some late round picks, UDFAs and inexperienced 2nd year players is ludicrous? First let's address "all those" late round picks, UDFA's and draft picks we'll be relying on.

QB 1st RD
RB 2nd Rd
TE 4th
WR 2nd, 2nd, 3rd
LT 3rd
LG UDFA
C 4th or UDFA
RG 3rd or 7th
RT 2nd

DL 1st, 4th, 5th
ILB 3rd + ?
OLB ? + ?
CB 4th, 4th, 6th
S 6th, 6th

So out of 11 positions we could have 1 UDFA starting (LG Jackson), possibly 2 (C Shelton) and possibly 1 7th round pick (Anchrum) on offense. Or we could have 1 UDFA and the rest 4th round or higher.
On defense, we could have a 5th (DL- Murchison or E. Brown), a 6th (CB - Kendrick), two 6ths a S (Fuller, Lake) so that's really daunting? Hell Fuller is a bonified 6th round find!!!
And that's before the draft and the rest of free agency

Show me a team that has all 4th round picks or higher in their starting lineup.

"Our OL was terrible in any combo"? We had 12 different combos the first 12 weeks so that would be accurate. I love to hear the statements "our starting 5 were terrible before the injuries!!!". Okay 1 game!!! The first week. So we knew, from that performance, we were gonna suck all year if those 5 remained healthy? That's BS!! And yet you tell me it's ludicrous to expect decent play from guys in their 2nd year with experience (not inexperienced like you noted), UDFA's or rookies before we even know who the starters are or who the draft picks are? That's a legit argument?

On our CBs, you are wrong about Kendrick. But how bad he played has been repeated so many times it's accepted fact. I rewatched all the games he started and I call BS! He gets beat constantly! Wrong. He can't cover! Wrong. He's ran a 4.79 40, he's too slow! Wrong.

Zero pass rush from our OLBs? Who are they this year? You don't think if we get one at #36, he might be able to provide some pressure?
We don't have a stout run D because Gaines, A'Shawn, Wagner and Floyd are gone? We didn't have a stout run defense with them. Decent yes. Stout? No. I don't think you can call the #13 team vs the rush and #12 in ypc, "stout". Can you? That's closer to mediocre than stout. And since we're going to replace those guys, you know that their replacements can't stop the run? Again, BS.

Look it's this simple. We lost a lot of guys on defense. Our OL was injured all year. We don't know what's going to happen but to write it off because of perceptions is BS.

 

[brucebruce]

And you have a gift for fishing for clicks with the bait of Negative Nancy thread titles.

I'm quite certain I'm not the only one (here and elsewhere) who has noticed that.

To each their own, I guess.

Of course, I've given several reasoned and data-supported responses to your premise. Interesting that you don't respond to any of that. Guess its easier to just whine that I'm being too snarky for your taste.

If you'd actually like to discuss the Rams' track record of drafting DBs relative to other teams, I'd love to know how you'd respond to my previous posts (and those of others, who have likewise put the Rams' track record into perspective).

Your move.

some people aren't happy unless they're miserable

 

[iamme33]

Have a nice day. I’m done.

hang in there 43 because this sight should not require eternal optimism. i mean if we can't have a discussion without being called a negative Nancy this is going to become pretty boring. anyway i for one appreciate. your post so keep them coming.

 

[AvengerRam]

“Isn’t it suspicious that Rams now have a string of failed drafted secondary players?”

Let’s analyze this…

First, the question presumes a predicate (that the secondary players drafted by the Rams have “failed”).

Second, it’s a leading question, as it suggests a response (that it is “suspicious.”)

It’s the functional equivalent of starting a conversation by asking “It was 2021 when you stopped beating your wife, wasn’t it?”

So, yeah…many responses disagreed with the predicate and the suggested answer, and questioned the framing of the issue.

Sounds like a healthy discussion where vitriol is replaced with a thoughtful analysis.

Nothing wrong with that.

 

[jrry32]

You're going to miss on some dudes. But losing Aubrey Pleasant (who thankfully returned) and Ejiro Evero didn't help.

 

[Merlin]

hang in there 43 because this sight should not require eternal optimism. i mean if we can't have a discussion without being called a negative Nancy this is going to become pretty boring. anyway i for one appreciate. your post so keep them coming.

Yeah I've been talking ball with @Rams43 long enough to know he's as standup a Rams fan as there is.

 

[Rams43]

Yeah I've been talking ball with @Rams43 long enough to know he's as standup a Rams fan as there is.

Yep, 12 years and counting, Merlin. On two boards now.

 

[So Ram]

Burgess
Long
Rochell (apparently)

These were all 3rd/4th round picks and all had very high expectations.

There are probably others but these really stand out because of where they were drafted and consequent expectations.

Question. Has Snead and his scouting staff forgotten how to evaluate secondary players after so many successes earlier?

OR…

Has our secondary coaching staff recently failed abysmally to develop players considered at least above average?

We are currently 0 for 3 on these promising kids. Three blown premium draft picks in a row in the secondary and guess what? We still have 2 holes to fill back there somehow this bare bones offseason.

If you think I’m frustrated, you’re right.

David Long isn’t a real failure & RR31 has 1 more season to compete. Nick Scott & Fuller don’t count for successful draft picks?
Troy Hill & D.Williams were cheap pick ups The Rams got COmP picks for.
—Burgees had an injury & was never the same.So IMO you’re exaggerating the situation.
I also think Durant & Kendrick will be very good draft picks at CB. Yeast & Lake both got valuable playing time in 2022.
—I’m sure now that Pleasant is back & RAMsey is gone the True Test will come this 2023 season.

Taylor Rapp was the biggest disappointment only because he is the Highest draft pick The Rams had in awhile.Still he was a starter,but Staley sitting him & Weedle replacing him was probably the reason The Rams won the Superbowl last season.
We’re talking Superbowl though.

 

[PARAM]

All these failure make it so much more remarkable we're 60-38 and have gone to 2 Superbowls, winning 1. Imagine what we could have done!!!

 

[So Ram]

Yep, 12 years and counting, Merlin. On two boards now.

Didn’t get into all the other stuff.
I think everyone doesn’t like Raheem Morris & Kendrick. I gave a different view & think everyone else is WRONG!
I know it’s easy to doubt my opinion,but I’ve seen enough football & sports to come away with a solid reasoning.

1. Last season was shut down early. I know the Tampa game really could have cost The Rams.
- still think Rapp & Evans were more of the reason for that loss.
2.Kendrick is young & other draft picks as well,but for the Secondary I wanted Colby Bryant instead of Durant.
3.Kendrick is battle tested Clemson,Georgia,Rams. He will be improved with NEW coaching & a Full Offseason.
4. Both will be motivated & ready to roll.They have a lot to prove & I don’t doubt that challenge will be upheld with success.

Les Snead needs to add support & depth. Special Teams is very important & something The Rams got away from imo.