How well Jimmy Garoppolo must perform to live up to his enormous contract with 49ers

[tempests]

OMG, get over the Randy Moss argument already. Do you know how many times Moss led the league in Receptions? Zero. Do you know how many times he leads the league in receiving yards? Zero.

Yeah but he led the league in TD receptions like five times. And he caught almost half of Culpepper's TD throws while they played together.

Funny, no one ever says "Well Brady had Gronk to throw too."

Yes we do.

Brady's first year. Do you know who had more receptions than Moss? Troy Brown in NE. And the following year. Troy Brown. But Culpepper had Moss.

Well, if you would take Troy Brown over Randy Moss. Can't imagine there are many that would agree with you.

 

[1maGoh]

@Raptorman it's almost like you're saying that teams have to be good at stuff to win, which is... Well, blasphemy would be one way to put it. Unscientific would be another.

Honestly, if you think teams need to field a defense in order to compete, I wonder just how much football you watch. I mean it's only about 45% of the game and directly affects whether or not the opposing outscores you. It couldn't possibly have a significant effect on winning.

It's not like anyone has ever heard the saying "Defense wins championships, unless you're the Vikings (and then nothing wins championships)."

 

[Raptorman]

@Raptorman it's almost like you're saying that teams have to be good at stuff to win, which is... Well, blasphemy would be one way to put it. Unscientific would be another.

Honestly, if you think teams need to field a defense in order to compete, I wonder just how much football you watch. I mean it's only about 45% of the game and directly affects whether or not the opposing outscores you. It couldn't possibly have a significant effect on winning.

It's not like anyone has ever heard the saying "Defense wins championships, unless you're the Vikings (and then nothing wins championships)."

Nope, from what I gather by most people these days is all you need is a good QB and hot offense.

 

[Ram65]

Nope, from what I gather by most people these days is all you need is a good QB and hot offense.

Here is where this thread went awry. You'er here enough to know that we feel the Rams defense will be much improved even better than the playoff run.

Here's the thing. It doesn't matter how well he plays. Unless his defense starts stopping the other team from scoring, they won't win. Yeah, a QB can do it for a year. But after that, you need a defense to win consistently in the NFL.

Goff and the Rams are in the same boat. The Rams defense needs to step up or the Rams will be on the outside looking in come playoff time.

This is year three in the Wade Phillips defense. In the first year Wade had to work with mostly what was here from the Fisher defense while drafting John Johnson III with a few others later. It was a big change from 4-3 to 3-4 defense. Last year, the Rams started moving toward Wade type players trading Ogletree and getting Talib and Peters. The Rams happen to be in position to get Suh a good player but, not a perfect fit. They also drafted defensive lineman that are expected to pay dividends this year. This off season the Rams got veterans Weddle and Mathews. They also went heavy defense in the draft earlier with players expected to contribute this year.

Look for the Rams to be a top ten defense or better this year.

 

[dieterbrock]

So the Colts won the SB with 23rd ranked D,
The Giants won the SB with the 17th and 25th ranked D,
The Saints won the SB with 20th ranked D &
The Ravens won the SB with 12th ranked D

So that’s 5 of the last 13 Super Bowl winners without a “Top 10 defense”

I guess what would you expect from a fan who’s team knows what it takes to win a super bowl as much as a Cleveland Browns fan does.

Although Cleveland may have a better shot this year

 

[Akrasian]

I guess what would you expect from a fan who’s team knows what it takes to win a super bowl as much as a Cleveland Browns fan does.

No Super Bowls, but they have won four NFL Championships, and four AAFC Championships. So it's long ago, but Cleveland has known championship glory.

Oh, Cleveland has one of the best tourism videos around.

 

[FrantikRam]

This dude has been saying this for a while. Don't worry about the Rams defense - they were fine last year. And if they just repeated their performance (numerous clutch stops and elite defense in the playoffs) we would be fine with that.

Held Breed and Payton, in NO, to under 300 yards of offense. Held Brady to his lowest scoring output in any Super Bowl.

Who is the best player in the NFL again? Ah that's right he plays defense for the Rams. Statistically they may have been underwhelming, but our D is as talented as any in the league and I wouldn't trade them for any other defense.

 

[RamBall]

It's a matter of historical perspective. Top scoring offenses don't make it back the big game without a top defense.

Take the Packers. For the past 25 years, they have had a top 10 offense in scoring for 18 of those years. 3 Super Bowl appearances. When their defense was 1, 5, and 2 in scoring. Outside those 3 years, the Packers defense averages 15th in PPG.

Saints: Top 10 offense 11 of 13 years since Brees has been there. Average Defense rank. 20. Granted they won a Super Bowl, But they haven't done much since then.

Broncos' Elway's last 5 years. Top 10 offense. It wasn't until they had a top 10 defense that they won the Super Bowl.

Broncos. Manning. 4 years. The offense went 2, 1, 2, 19. The defense went 4, 16, 22, 4. It was that 19 and 4 years they won.

Patriots. Brady era. Top 10 offense 16 of 18 years. Top 10 defense 15 of 18 years. Super Bowl wins when the defense was 6, 1, 2, 8 and 7 in ppg.

Now, is it possible to win the Super Bowl without a top 10 defense? Yes. The Giants and Saint have done it in the recent past. But if you want your team to continue to go back and become a dynasty, then it needs to consistent year in and year out.

So please, go on thinking that the offense can do it by themselves. BTW, When the Rams won the Super Bowl, their offense was number 1, but their defense was number 4.

And none of those teams had McVay as a HC and Snead as a GM. So none of that garbage means anything. The Rams D doesnt have to be top 10 to return to the SB but probably will be with the additions they made. I get that it sucks that the vikings took a turn for the worst, but it doesnt mean the Rams will do the same. The Rams are building for the future and have some very good pieces in place starting from the top and working on down through the roster. Injuries could derail the Rams but they have better depth today than they have had in a long time.

 

[Raptorman]

So the Colts won the SB with 23rd ranked D,
The Giants won the SB with the 17th and 25th ranked D,
The Saints won the SB with 20th ranked D &
The Ravens won the SB with 12th ranked D

So that’s 5 of the last 13 Super Bowl winners without a “Top 10 defense”

I guess what would you expect from a fan who’s team knows what it takes to win a super bowl as much as a Cleveland Browns fan does.

Although Cleveland may have a better shot this year

Yeah. You got me there. 5 of the last 13. Beats the hell out of 45 of the last 53. But what do I know? I'm just dumb Vikings fan, right?

 

[Raptorman]

And none of those teams had McVay as a HC and Snead as a GM. So none of that garbage means anything. The Rams D doesnt have to be top 10 to return to the SB but probably will be with the additions they made. I get that it sucks that the vikings took a turn for the worst, but it doesnt mean the Rams will do the same. The Rams are building for the future and have some very good pieces in place starting from the top and working on down through the roster. Injuries could derail the Rams but they have better depth today than they have had in a long time.

Ah yes. The great wonder kid is going to do it. He is after all the coach that can win without a top 10 defense year in and year out. That's what I gather from your post. So the wonder kid is smarter than Holmgren, McCarthy, Dungy, Sherman, and Payton. 36 years of coaching with top 8 offenses and what, 4 Super Bowls between them. Meanwhile in New England...........Belicheat is just clocking away Super Bowl victories with top 8 offenses and top 10 defenses.

But the Rams have Mcvay and Snead....... Good to know.

BTW, McCarthy and Holmgren, well they had the number 2 and 1 defense when they won the Super Bowl with the Packers. But Yeah, I know nothing. It's just garbage.

Rams have McVay!

I have never said the Rams can't have a top defense. I am just saying if they want to continue to win......they need a defense that doesn't give up 24 points per game. Most teams that give up that many points per game are .500 teams.

 

[nighttrain]

Rams also have Wade
train

 

[LARams_1963]

Goff and the Rams are in the same boat. The Rams defense needs to step up or the Rams will be on the outside looking in come playoff time.

It was the reverse in the SB.. Sad state of affairs when your Defense holds Brady to 13 points, and you lose

 

[dieterbrock]

Yeah. You got me there. 5 of the last 13. Beats the hell out of 45 of the last 53. But what do I know? I'm just dumb Vikings fan, right?

In all seriousness, if you don't think 5 of last 13 is more relevant than 45 of last 53 you are answering that question for yourself....

 

[Raptorman]

In all seriousness, if you don't think 5 of last 13 is more relevant than 45 of last 53 you are answering that question for yourself....

And yet historically, since 1960, if a team A holds team B to 19 points or less they have an 85% chance of winning. That hasn't changed. Oh, it goes up and down about 2-3% over the years. But it pretty much holds true year in and year out. But that isn't relevant apparently.

You want to talk about what's relevant. Tell me, how is it that New England has been in 9 of the last 18 Super Bowls?

 

[nighttrain]

And yet historically, since 1960, if a team A holds team B to 19 points or less they have an 85% chance of winning. That hasn't changed. Oh, it goes up and down about 2-3% over the years. But it pretty much holds true year in and year out. But that isn't relevant apparently.

You want to talk about what's relevant. Tell me, how is it that New England has been in 9 of the last 18 Super Bowls?

Bellicheat and Brady, two all-time greats at both football and cheating, their motto, if ya cant beatem, cheatem!
As for our run D, look at what Wade/Snead have added over last season, yeah they saw the problem, it was 5 yards a carry other teams ran straight up the middle, hence adding Gaines, Kaiser, Mathews and Weddle, all stout agin the run. This Ram D will our strongest ever...
train

 

[OldSchool]

So the Colts won the SB with 23rd ranked D,
The Giants won the SB with the 17th and 25th ranked D,
The Saints won the SB with 20th ranked D &
The Ravens won the SB with 12th ranked D

So that’s 5 of the last 13 Super Bowl winners without a “Top 10 defense”

I guess what would you expect from a fan who’s team knows what it takes to win a super bowl as much as a Cleveland Browns fan does.

Although Cleveland may have a better shot this year

While I’m not going to dispute the numbers I will ask a question though. How hot were those defenses at the end of the season and in the playoffs? Were they like they Rams D and played their best ball when it mattered most? I know those Giants defenses had some of the best pass rushes but they couldn’t stop a run game. Imo the regular season numbers mean less than how they’re playing in the playoffs.

 

[Raptorman]

While I’m not going to dispute the numbers I will ask a question though. How hot were those defenses at the end of the season and in the playoffs? Were they like they Rams D and played their best ball when it mattered most? I know those Giants defenses had some of the best pass rushes but they couldn’t stop a run game. Imo the regular season numbers mean less than how they’re playing in the playoffs.

Actually, the Giants defense did step up. Big time. The Colts defense did for the first two games, laid an egg with the Pats and came back against Chicago. The Saint held against the Cardinals, not so much the Vikings and of course did well against the Colts. But the point is, what happened to all those teams after they won? Ravens offense went down to crap. The defense stayed up. Like I keep saying. Yes, as a team you can do it for one year. Maybe two, but if you want to keep winning................


I find it funny that so many want to discount my historical numbers on one hand and then turn around and say, "well they did it last year so I'm not worried about it." Citing their own one year of history.

 

[shovelpass]

As for our run D, look at what Wade/Snead have added over last season, yeah they saw the problem, it was 5 yards a carry other teams ran straight up the middle, hence adding Gaines, Kaiser, Mathews and Weddle, all stout agin the run. This Ram D will our strongest ever...

That and, as of right now, the overall depth and experience is better this season than last season.

Before Fowler the OLB depth was lousy, even after him it wasn't that good. Injuries plagued that position, Longacre was recovering from back surgery, they tried to add depth by Fox who tore his acl, then Easley who also tore his acl, so that left Ebukam with 2 rookies in Lawler and Young and another rookie DL in JFM as the only healthy players. Now there is Fowler, Matthews, a healthy Obo, and Ebukam who had knee surgery in the offseason, but Lawler, Young, or JFM could fill in if necessary.

At ILB you had Barron recovering from injury, Littleton in his first year as a full time starter, with Wilson and Hager as depth. Now there's Littleton, Kiser, Hager, and Matthews. You also most likely have Rapp replacing Christian in sub sets.

The DL also suffered from a lack of depth, the big 3 pretty much manned it themselves. Donald played 90% of the total defensive snaps, Suh played 87%, and Brockers played 67% with Westbrooks and JFM as the primary backups, and Smart played a whopping 6 snaps. Now you have Donald, Brockers, Gaines, SJD, JFM and a healthy Fox. They should be able to rotate better and keep the starters fresh.

Of course the final 53 is nowhere near close to being decided and injuries do happen so some of these names might not be here, but if they lost their spot to someone else that can only be a positive for the team.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/ram/2018-snap-counts.htm

 

[Akrasian]

I find it funny that so many want to discount my historical numbers on one hand and then turn around and say, "well they did it last year so I'm not worried about it." Citing their own one year of history.

Actually, what's hilarious is that you keep saying that the Rams need to address the defense, posters in this thread have pointed out that in fact they have done a lot of addressing of defensive issues, and you ignore that and functionally keep saying "Yes, but the Rams need to address their defense."

Keep in mind that the Rams' defense played a lot better once they integrated Fowler in and they got their starting cornerbacks healthy. But beyond that, their big team resigning was Fowler, and their big free agents were Weddle (to upgrade the safeties) and Matthews (provide more pressure on QBs and at times slide over to help with the run defense). Three of their first four draft picks were on the defensive side, all expected to play significant time. Fact is, anybody who has actually paid attention to the Rams' offseason knows that the Rams have put a large portion of their resources into upgrading the defense. So repeatedly arguing that if the Rams don't upgrade their defense they won't succeed long term is laughable. Everybody here - but you - knows they upgraded their defense.

 

[Kevin]

And yet historically, since 1960, if a team A holds team B to 19 points or less they have an 85% chance of winning. That hasn't changed. Oh, it goes up and down about 2-3% over the years. But it pretty much holds true year in and year out. But that isn't relevant apparently.

You want to talk about what's relevant. Tell me, how is it that New England has been in 9 of the last 18 Super Bowls?

You are mixing statistical probability with observed statistics. Kind of like saying if team A rushes for over 150 yards they have a 85% chance of winning, when team A rolled up a big lead by passing and just ran the ball in the second half.

If you are saying that having a good defense helps a team win games, then, yeah.