How does the baton pass from Keenum to Goff?

[DaveFan'51]

Serious question. I don't know of a scenario I like.

I mean... It appears Keenum is set to start preseason game 3. In my opinion, that all but makes it official he's starting week 1.

So...

Now Goff loses the practice reps with the 1's. Not all of them... But certainly enough. If Keenum is starting, he needs the lion's share. There are only so many to go around if the goal is to win games.

Does Keenum have to struggle for Goff to start? That's not a good scenario. Likely means we are losing some early games.

Keenum has to get hurt? That's not a good scenario. Goff has to play without the reps, or Mannion gets the nod because Goff hasn't had the reps.

Keenum plays well enough, but Fisher thinks it's time for Goff to start? That scenario doesn't make me comfortable either. It would seem to put considerable pressure on Goff. What happens if Goff struggles? Do you go back to Keenum? That would not be a good scenario - at all.

I dunno. I am not real comfortable going with Keenum. Don't we already know what he brings to the table? I mean, we drafted his replacement for a reason. Isn't that what Fisher and Snead determined?

I'd rather go all in on Goff and live or die by his development. If he struggles, at least it's productive development. If he sits... Most every scenario seems like potentially a bad hand off to Goff and 2016 is at risk to become a lost season. I am tired of those.

To quote Coach Lombardi " Winning isn't everything, it's the ONLY THING!"
You put the QB in that gives you the Best chance to WIN! I fine with Keenum starting right now. IF he starts to struggle in a couple of games and we loose, then make a change! I say don't put Goff in until you are as sure as possible he's ready! JMHO

 

[OldSchool]

The baton will pass when Fisher tells Case to hand it over to Jared and to grab the clip board and be another coach on the sidelines to support our #1 pick.

 

[Shoman01]

What's wrong with Case doing well but Jared going in as an upgrade WHEN he's truly comfortable with the offense? The ONLY thing Goff lacks is time in the system, and his ability to quickly process information can improve in practice and on the sideline. Sure, in many ways it's better on the field in games...but in some ways it's worse (confidence, habits, health).

If Weinke thinks he's ready, THAT'S when Goff starts. Did anyone else notice on Hard Knocks that Fisher looks to Weinke to judge Jared's development? It seems a better method than watching Ram message boards for sound football advice. Just sayin...

Watching hard knocks, it looks like the staff has resigned it's self to the fact that Goff isn't ready. notice how they tell him, "now thats a NFL throw!" You should not have to compliment a overall #1 draft pick on the basics of his position to keep him engaged.

 

[fancents86]

I'm just gonna go with the flow. I don't see Goff being better than keenum atm so it's not like one is going to win more games than the other.

 

[Mikey Ram]

What's wrong with Case doing well but Jared going in as an upgrade WHEN he's truly comfortable with the offense? The ONLY thing Goff lacks is time in the system, and his ability to quickly process information can improve in practice and on the sideline. Sure, in many ways it's better on the field in games...but in some ways it's worse (confidence, habits, health).

If Weinke thinks he's ready, THAT'S when Goff starts. Did anyone else notice on Hard Knocks that Fisher looks to Weinke to judge Jared's development? It seems a better method than watching Ram message boards for sound football advice. Just sayin...

True, but looking around over several years, it appears that the message board coaches are the ones they should have been listening to...Foles comes to mind...

 

[Mikey Ram]

I'm just gonna go with the flow. I don't see Goff being better than keenum atm so it's not like one is going to win more games than the other.

I would disagree just a bit...I'm pretty sure that Keenum would win more games than Goff right now..That doesn't mean it might not change at any time, but if Goff doesn't show that he's ready to jump in and give the Rams a better chance to win, then I think Keenum is the guy Fisher will roll with...

 

[OldSchool]

I would disagree just a bit...I'm pretty sure that Keenum would win more games than Goff right now..That doesn't mean it might not change at any time, but if Goff doesn't show that he's ready to jump in and give the Rams a better chance to win, then I think Keenum is the guy Fisher will roll with...

I see this a lot and I'm confused maybe it's my interpretation of the meaning "win more games". To me a QB wins a game if he takes it over and dominates in the passing game. To me Keenum doesn't have the arm to do that, IMO he's not capable of winning games. Goff has the arm talent to win games by himself but being a rookie he has as much of an opportunity to lose a game with a rookie mistake. Keenum can be a QB manager that will let Gurley and the Defense win games but not win them himself. Just my opinion on saying a QB can win games.

 

[jap]

What's wrong with Case doing well but Jared going in as an upgrade WHEN he's truly comfortable with the offense? The ONLY thing Goff lacks is time in the system, and his ability to quickly process information can improve in practice and on the sideline. Sure, in many ways it's better on the field in games...but in some ways it's worse (confidence, habits, health).

If Weinke thinks he's ready, THAT'S when Goff starts. Did anyone else notice on Hard Knocks that Fisher looks to Weinke to judge Jared's development? It seems a better method than watching Ram message boards for sound football advice. Just sayin...

I want Jerad to start . . . when he's ready! We have seen Case struggle or even completely neglect to throw the rock downfield. That's not good with either of our two explosive established weapons. If you can fling the rock downfield effectively, you can force the defense to relax the focus on the Gurley Express! If they still insist on keying on Todd, then our QB can use play action to allow Tavon or someone else can get behind the secondary and make the D pay dearly. The QB best suited for that is the Golden Arm from Cal. Case lacks the big arm, Mannion doesn't seem to consistently get the ball out early, and I don't know how accurate he is downtown---especially under duress.

However, transitioning to a different QB necessarily involves some adjustments. The center exchange to the QB changes; the rapport with the receivers changes, even the OL blocking may have to change to accommodate the new QB. If these can be adjusted smoothly, life is great! If not, some very screwed up plays are likely to ensue. What's a Fish gonna do? It's good to know Chris Weinke is actually trying to earn his pay.

 

[Riverumbbq]

It happens game 5, early in the 1'st quarter against the Bills at the Coliseum. Fisher will show Keenum a large bag filled with dozens and dozens of wrapped & bundled $100.00 bills. Fish will tell him to take a dive on first down, and along with the bag, Keenum gets a higher bonus and extra year added to his contract.

 

[leoram]

True, but looking around over several years, it appears that the message board coaches are the ones they should have been listening to...Foles comes to mind...

Foles beat the Seahawks and Cards to start the season. It wasn't until all the OLine injuries occurred that he became Bulgerized and lost his confidence. UNTIL THE OLINE PROVES WORTHY, the new offense galvanizes, and Goff becomes comfortable reading defenses in THIS system, Goff SHOULD NOT start.

 

[Riverumbbq]

Foles beat the Seahawks and Cards to start the season. It wasn't until all the OLine injuries occurred that he became Bulgerized and lost his confidence. UNTIL THE OLINE PROVES WORTHY, the new offense galvanizes, and Goff becomes comfortable reading defenses in THIS system, Goff SHOULD NOT start.

Agree with all but the Bulgarized part, I don't believe Keenum suffered that fate, ... with the loss of OL AND a lack of receiving weapons the Rams became one-dimensional with Gurley carrying the team.

 

[Athos]

Easiest solution is to start Goff and have Keenum ready in case. I don't believe in sitting and learning as far as the NFL goes. Learn by doing.

If it's going badly and I mean putting himself in danger of injury, switch him out.

Transition will just be that much harder though if he's not getting time with the 1s.

 

[Mikey Ram]

I see this a lot and I'm confused maybe it's my interpretation of the meaning "win more games". To me a QB wins a game if he takes it over and dominates in the passing game. To me Keenum doesn't have the arm to do that, IMO he's not capable of winning games. Goff has the arm talent to win games by himself but being a rookie he has as much of an opportunity to lose a game with a rookie mistake. Keenum can be a QB manager that will let Gurley and the Defense win games but not win them himself. Just my opinion on saying a QB can win games.

I think it might be a matter of semantics...I believe the Rams have a better chance to win games right now with Keenum under center...

 

[Bruce2980]

I could be wrong. Lord knows I'm always wrong at home.

But Keenum just might make the decision on when Goff starts a little harder for Fisher. This is the first time he's had stability entering a season. The first time he got extensive work with the 1's during camp. He's getting more comfortable in the offense. And he's actually looking pretty good.

I know Goff has the upside and is the long term future. But what if Keenum plays well all year? You gotta run with that. If Keenum leads them to a playoff spot you gotta keep playing him. There are worse things than having a playoff quarterback with a future franchise guy waiting in the wings for a year or two.

My two cents is that "IF" Keenum takes the Rams to the playoffs, then the coaching staff gets an F for trading and getting Goff. They picked Goff as #1 because they "can't win with the QBs they have now." That is my understanding as they made their pitch to Kroenke. So the coaching staff is not going to "prove themselves wrong" by sitting Goff and playing Keenum all year long, especially if he gets them to the playoffs! Goff starts when he can read and pick up the blitz. He'll be able to do that week four or sooner. Once he proves that he can defend "himself," he's in. He'll have Gurley to hand the ball of to and he'll have TEs and RBs to throw the ball to. Maybe some deep balls to the WRs. If he does anything other than that it is a bonus. No point in throwing to WRs on third downs, that usually leads to punts. Sarcasm fully intended until proven otherwise. If a QB can't hand the ball off to Gurley, who is going to break Eric Dickerson's single season rushing record this year, then the coaching staff gets an F, because there are probably 60 QB's in this league, right now, that could do that.

 

[Loyal]

Not sure what the answer is. I would think either if Keenum struggles and we lose games we should win, or of course if he gets injured. Coaches obviously think more definitivly and measure many tangibles. Case in point, If I remember correctly, wasn't Warner 5-4 when he was replaced by Eli in NY? He went 5-2, lost 2, and got benched.

Well, there was pressure in NYC for Eli, the wunderkind to start...immense pressure since all thought Eli was the future and Warner was a retread at that point (they thought).

As for when Goff starts...I only think he gets a chance if Keenum gets injured or he plays two or more games badly, resulting in Rams losses. I have no clue as to how Goff would get better if he's sitting on the bench uring the season. Mental reps are a very poor substitute for actual reps/experience, imo. Once Goff starts, you have to live and die with the kid for this year and next at least.

 

[Memphis Ram]

That works.

But, has Keenum suddenly become a different player?

Mind you, I like him as a backup. Just... As a 28yr old player we've seen what he can do?

Might be mistaken, but weren't Trent Green, Brad Johnson, and even Kurt Warner around 28 yrs old or so when they finally did something. And Rich Gannon didn't do much until he hit his 30s.

 

[fancents86]

I would disagree just a bit...I'm pretty sure that Keenum would win more games than Goff right now..That doesn't mean it might not change at any time, but if Goff doesn't show that he's ready to jump in and give the Rams a better chance to win, then I think Keenum is the guy Fisher will roll with...

Yea I was going to edit what I said bc keenum I believe has the experience to limit mistakes, but I was too lazy to edit.

 

[Florida_Ram]

The sooner Goff rips the baton from Keenum's hand the better. In all truth, I'm not happy with Weinke or Boras' handling of Goff resulting in his slow development.

Boras & Weinke are the 2 coaches I held in the highest regard for preparing him to be ready to compete for the starting position on opening day.

They not Fisher, are the most accountable for learning and observing Goff's deficiencies and college habits as well as teaching him how to be an NFL quarterback. Both coaches are barely sophomores at their respected coaching titles.

Boras and Weinke have no experience with a young college quarterback highly drafted with the expectations Goff had coming out of college. At least not as hired working coaches of an NFL team if you get what I mean.

Boras whom I like so far has only been the Rams OC since December of 2015 so he has no quarterback Offensive Coordinator relationship history on a developmental level.

When he was promoted to OC Dec 2015, he had Keenum who was a veteran and Boras was simply learning much of his craft on the job. Remember him throwing up his guts after his first experience calling plays as an NFL OC.

If Boras was in his 4th year do you believe he would better know how to handle a rookie quarterback of Goff's expectations and cater the offense to his strength while still being able to keep the scheme Gurley first?

Weinke is only in the 2nd year of his NFL coaching career so you can see where I'm coming from. I blame 25% on Fisher for being so laid back and never making this a QB competition from the day Goff was drafted. "Keenum is our starting quarterback and we will play Jared when he's ready" etc....................

I blame Goff for his part because you have to take the bull by the horns and protect the football better especially when you had the same issue early in your California college career.

(several fumbles in his first 2 seasons at California for those that forgot)

This was never going to be a smooth transition for Goff but my single opinion in believing these are some significant factors why he's not further along has some validation.

One last thing.... Marcus "Shotgun Oregon Spread Offense" Mariota was coached up well enough to have a pretty decent rookie season .

I'm guessing the OC and QB coach put a lot of extra time in with him breaking his college habits and formatting the offense to best fit his skill set while he learned on the job. Again... my final blame is 50% Weinke/Boras... 25% Fisher and 25% Goff on why the baton hasn't been passed already.

Tonight I have Boras on my radar.... Because I want to see his opening script of play calls for Goff and if he's learned anything different about his rookie franchise quarterback and how to cater the offense to make him look the part.

Goff better not turn the damn ball over in his first series at the Broncos and the 2 coaches I have mentioned, better make sure it is drilled in his head as well as a smart scripted set of plays to get him in a comfortable rhythm.


Here is to passing the baton sooner than later coach Boras and Weinke :X3:

 

[shaunpinney]

Hi guys. I'm back (mostly) I still worry that the Rams coaching team can't get the best out of their QBs. It just doesn't seem to be the position that we excel in. We're damn good on the d-line and on special teams, when it comes to out QBs and WRs, I feel like we're lacking in player development.

 

[HitStick]

My two cents is that "IF" Keenum takes the Rams to the playoffs, then the coaching staff gets an F for trading and getting Goff. They picked Goff as #1 because they "can't win with the QBs they have now." That is my understanding as they made their pitch to Kroenke. So the coaching staff is not going to "prove themselves wrong" by sitting Goff and playing Keenum all year long, especially if he gets them to the playoffs! Goff starts when he can read and pick up the blitz. He'll be able to do that week four or sooner. Once he proves that he can defend "himself," he's in. He'll have Gurley to hand the ball of to and he'll have TEs and RBs to throw the ball to. Maybe some deep balls to the WRs. If he does anything other than that it is a bonus. No point in throwing to WRs on third downs, that usually leads to punts. Sarcasm fully intended until proven otherwise. If a QB can't hand the ball off to Gurley, who is going to break Eric Dickerson's single season rushing record this year, then the coaching staff gets an F, because there are probably 60 QB's in this league, right now, that could do that.

I disagree. While I didn't like the trade up, (Treadwell guy) I understand that Goff was drafted for the future of this team. I want him starting, but I don't mind waiting if it means 10+ years of playoff berths.