Hollywood films suck-Quality movies are on Netflix

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Dieter the Brock

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The Lobster sucked. Original yes. Sucked balls yes.

BTW China owns more of Hollywood with each passing year.

See what happens when you actually make a well crafted “original” movie based on relationships instead of superheroes?
people think it sucks :LOL:

Which is totally fine - there should be 15-20 of these a year, but now we only get 1 ever 4 years
 

coconut

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See what happens when you actually make a well crafted “original” movie based on relationships instead of superheroes?
people think it sucks :LOL:

Which is totally fine - there should be 15-20 of these a year, but now we only get 1 ever 4 years
I'm all in for GOOD movies about relationships and The Lobster is not one. TL is well crafted? Didn't look it to me. Completely fucked up premise, oh excuse me.....completely fucked up relationships premise. Completely unbelievable as it is untenable. Therefore just as ridiculous as your everyday superhero movie. Oh and I think superhero movies are STUPID. (With the exception of DeadPool!)
 

Dieter the Brock

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I'm all in for GOOD movies about relationships and The Lobster is not one. TL is well crafted? Didn't look it to me. Completely freaked up premise, oh excuse me.....completely freaked up relationships premise. Completely unbelievable as it is untenable. Therefore just as ridiculous as your everyday superhero movie. Oh and I think superhero movies are STUPID. (With the exception of DeadPool!)

The Lobster is just a good example of a movie that has recently been released that one would consider “original.” And part of that sense of originality comes from the surreal premise. And I can see how you could stretch the idea out that the surreal nature makes it fantastical like I superhero movie - but i say that’s a stretch.

But again I think hating The Lobster is just fine cause that just goes to my previous points - but you can’t say that the Lobster wasn’t well made or “original.” That’s just silly.
 

Angry Ram

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Well they certainly have a rich field to pull characters from.
As someone who was never into comics as a kid it all gets a bit one note.
It is interesting how the story lines cross, intersect and blend. I don't know if it follows the original story lines or if they are taking liberties.

It adopts bits and pieces from the comics and makes it into it's own story. A lot of times it's "nods" to a comic reference, for example, when Ultron is covered in the red shawl when meeting Wanda and Pieter.

Nothing like the MCU has been done before. Each of the characters have evolved since their first movie...THAT'S why we care so much over them.

Take Iron Man for example. That character was a B-level, border line C-level hero until RDJ and Jon Favreau made him into a phenom. That character changed so much over the 10 years:

IM - Douchebag, egoist, borderline scumbag. Realized his weapons did more harm than good and tried (failed?) to change his ways. Failed, meaning his ego was so high he had to proclaim to the world he was Iron Man.

IM 2 - Revealed more about his past, mostly about how his father's past played a part in his current chaos. Plus they revealed that he and his father didn't have the best relationship, but ultimately was not the case.

Avengers - Get's called out by Cap on his doucheness, never make the sacrifice play, only to save NYC from being nuked by almost sacrificing himself.

IM 3 - Suffers PTSD from what he saw in Avengers. Gets panic attacks and is paranoid about his role in the world. We never see him more vulnerable than he is in this movie.

Avengers AoU - Reveals Ultron, a program to put a cold suit of armor around the world, and doesn't bother to tell anyone but Bruce Banner. All based from his still current PTSD and current paranoia from what's out in space (Thanos and company).

Civil War - Gets guilted into what happened in AoU. Found out his actions caused the deaths of countless civilians. So much to let the government of all people, control his actions. Led to fighting his teammates. Then actually WATCHES his parents get killed by a brain washed Winter Solider and loses his mind (and who can blame him?). Avengers broke up.

Spider-Man - feels he is responsible and is the de-facto father figure for Peter. For a guy that had father issues through his childhood.

Infinity War - trying to make right with his girl until the Black Order arrives and gets roped back into the Avenging world. Realizes his horrors in AoU are coming to light. Loses everyone in the process.

Endgame - PTSD to the max, couldn't stop Thanos. Lost everyone. Becomes a father, has different priorities. Can't escape the fact they have an opportunity to bring all the snapped back. Had to make amends with Cap. Gets an opportunity to make right with his father. Makes the ultimate sacrifice.

That doesn't even include ALL the details, but it shows that is the complete opposite of this notion that these movies are made soley for certain audiences. That much effort and time wouldn't have been taken to make these.

For the most part it has been good movie making.
There are obviously millions and millions of fans in the US, which is to say nothing of the international fan base. I bet millions more have been inspired to go back and check out old source stories. That's cool.
But, its like being a fan of metal music. I grew up on it (and jazz) learned to play music because of it. I can listen to Black Sabbath and Deep Purple, to Motörhead, Judas Priest and Iron Maiden, to Metallica and Pantera to Dragon Force and Dillinger Escape Plan and hear it like an evolution. Someone else is just waiting to hear a song they know.
And to them, it all sounds a bit one note.

And there's nothing wrong with having a global audience. Like I said before, many fans were literal kids when IM came out and now entering adulthood. Marvel's popularity has grown immensely since the 90s and 2000s.

Oh and I think superhero movies are STUPID. (With the exception of DeadPool!)

Deadpool, a character the mainstream world didn't know until Ryan Reynolds came along. What makes those two movies better? Because Ryan Reynolds says fuck and shit a lot and you see brains being exploded? They are fun to watch on a weekend at home, but they ain't better than what the MCU has done.
 

IowaRam

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I suppose all those 1,000's of spaghetti westerns of the 50's and 60's were all garbage as well .along with the 100's of those cold war spy thrillers of the 60's and 70's
 

IowaRam

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they make 100's of movies every year

all kinds

like maybe 10 of them are big budget superhero movies ,

so I don't really see what the argument is about
 

12intheBox

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They make what sells. We are a bubblegum culture and they are feeding us what we want.

Music, books, even the news - same stuff. Don’t blame them, they are just playing to their market.
 

Dieter the Brock

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I suppose all those 1,000's of spaghetti westerns of the 50's and 60's were all garbage as well .along with the 100's of those cold war spy thrillers of the 60's and 70's

Nobody is saying Spaghetti Westerns or Cold War Spy thrillers are garbage

Just superhero movies
 

Dieter the Brock

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they make 100's of movies every year

all kinds

like maybe 10 of them are big budget superhero movies ,

so I don't really see what the argument is about

It’s just a discussion on the level of banality in film and music today
 

Dieter the Brock

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They make what sells. We are a bubblegum culture and they are feeding us what we want.

Music, books, even the news - same stuff. Don’t blame them, they are just playing to their market.

You can totally blame them for it if they make shit
 

Akrasian

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I don’t demand that crap so to me the answer is obvious

"I don't like them, so eff them"

Every era in film history has had a number of successful films that to some extent were formulaic, even if within that formula there were great plots, performances, writing, etc. For decades westerns gave people what they wanted - but within the genre there were great performances, great scripts, brilliant directing, etc - while people who just hated westerns refused to see the value. Ditto for musicals, sci-fi, and many other genres. Movies are entertainment, and while there has been and continues to be room for art-house dramas, there is nothing wrong with well-made genre films of whatever is popular at the time. Many John Wayne films are crap by our modern sensibilities (though popular at the time) but the Wayne Cavalry Trilogy is legendary for being great films, and viewed as such still. Heck, John Wayne made three films with the same basic plot (but many differences of course) with Howard Hawks as the director, and all three (especially the first two) were classics - Rio Bravo, El Dorado, and Rio Lobo. I'm fond of the last one, though it's not on the same level as the first two.

Not all the Marvel movies are good - many are already recognized as being lesser films - but that doesn't mean that the series as a whole (especially the best films) won't be remembered as classics even if some grumpy people don't like them.

I do know that I'll be subscribing to Disney+ for a few months, so I can stream the whole Marvel series, as well as a few of the traditional Disney movies I don't own. Which says a lot, since I don't actually watch very much tv.
 

Dieter the Brock

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"I don't like them, so eff them"

Every era in film history has had a number of successful films that to some extent were formulaic, even if within that formula there were great plots, performances, writing, etc. For decades westerns gave people what they wanted - but within the genre there were great performances, great scripts, brilliant directing, etc - while people who just hated westerns refused to see the value. Ditto for musicals, sci-fi, and many other genres. Movies are entertainment, and while there has been and continues to be room for art-house dramas, there is nothing wrong with well-made genre films of whatever is popular at the time. Many John Wayne films are crap by our modern sensibilities (though popular at the time) but the Wayne Cavalry Trilogy is legendary for being great films, and viewed as such still. Heck, John Wayne made three films with the same basic plot (but many differences of course) with Howard Hawks as the director, and all three (especially the first two) were classics - Rio Bravo, El Dorado, and Rio Lobo. I'm fond of the last one, though it's not on the same level as the first two.

Not all the Marvel movies are good - many are already recognized as being lesser films - but that doesn't mean that the series as a whole (especially the best films) won't be remembered as classics even if some grumpy people don't like them.

I do know that I'll be subscribing to Disney+ for a few months, so I can stream the whole Marvel series, as well as a few of the traditional Disney movies I don't own. Which says a lot, since I don't actually watch very much tv.

I’m not being sophomoric

I have been commenting consistently on how the Chinese market is shaping how Hollywood produces movies - and that since Chinese are strict censors of what their people watch, Hollywood produces it’s movies with these censors in mind, thus what is coming out of Hollywood is made for a Chinese audience and not an American one like tradition has long held. And since the movies being produced by Hollywood are Superhero sequels or Star Wars sequels, or Pixar sequels, that means those types of films are commie fodder. Thats why I don’t like Superhero movies.

It’s not about Westerns or any other genre cause none of those genres in the past have ever been made for a Chinese audience first and an American audience second. This is something that is unique to the films Hollywood is making today which are primarily Marvel and Lucasfilm — and this in turn limits any “original” ideas from seeing the light of day — I hope you see my point more thoroughly

And to be clear I am not knocking comics or super heroes in comics — just in film for the reasons above
 

Akrasian

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The thing is - most films are not affected by the Chinese market. They limit the number of foreign films they allow.

The vast majority of films are still being made for the US market. And frankly, since the Chinese market limits how long films play, it's not as big an influencer as many seem to believe. It's not zero, but it's not the controlling interest in films that some seem to think. The blockbuster market is still controlled by the US. Success in China is a plus, but it's not mandatory, especially since their ticket prices are tiny compared to the US. What really matters is US success, so making substantive changes to favor the Chinese market more often than not hurts profits.
 

IowaRam

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As Bob Dylan once said

The times...........They are a changin

Welcome to the 21 Century boys

We're not a planet of nations anymore , we're a planet of corporations

if you don't believe that , then you truly don't understand how the internet , and Google work , or Twitter , or Facebook , or Youtube , or Netflix

and of course Hollywood is cashing in on it , I mean duh !!!

but China , yea , thats a large part , but it's only one part

take India , Avengers Endgame sold out every screen in the entire country for opening weekend , weeks in advance

try getting a ticket to the Brazil comic con in South America , you can get tickets to the Super Bowl easier then you can get tickets to San Diego comic con

Take our beloved Los Angeles Rams , Kroenke and Demoff are trying to do the exact same thing , they are trying to turn the Rams into a Global brand , games in London , Mexico City , Hawaii , and even next year in , yes , China !!!!

The Los Angeles Rams aren't just about Los Angeles anymore

and as far as Marvel movies , I love them ,

well , most of them anyways

I go to a comic book movie , for the same reason I go to a rock concert

I want to be entertained for two hours

It's like going to a 80's hair band concert , I want it loud , I want simple catchy lyrics , I want lasers , I want fireworks , I want explosions , I want to leave temporarily partially deaf

I like to think I'm capable of enjoying all kinds of media without having to drag one form down

I love the classics ,

But when I go to a Marvel Movie.................

 
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