Filmmaker denies claim that he unfairly released damning...

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Re: Filmmaker denies claim that he unfairly released damning

PS. Ever think that this filmmaker could be acting on behalf of a large class action law firm?

Not really. Again, all the tapes show is that the NFL was right. This "evidence" doesn't make the NFL more liable. Plus, nothing came of that game other than the Saints getting waxed by the 49ers.

 

[Stranger]

Re: Filmmaker denies claim that he unfairly released damning

PS. Ever think that this filmmaker could be acting on behalf of a large class action law firm?

Not really. Again, all the tapes show is that the NFL was right. This "evidence" doesn't make the NFL more liable. Plus, nothing came of that game other than the Saints getting waxed by the 49ers.

The "audio" created a PR storm which most certainly could benefit a class action effort, by garnering support for such an effort via public opinion. The "audio" will also help politiicans seeking to get public support for televised hearings, and/or game-changing legislation. The audio can also be employed as a general attack on American culture, by targeting American Football as a major icon of our culture.

At this time, I'm not arguing that it is anyone of the above, I'm just saying that we should be looking beneath and beyond the various PR machines' grasp on public opinion, and that we should be legitimately concerned about the future of this game (ie. Williams is a pawn).

 

[-X-]

Re: Filmmaker denies claim that he unfairly released damning

PS. Ever think that this filmmaker could be acting on behalf of a large class action law firm?

Not really. Again, all the tapes show is that the NFL was right. This "evidence" doesn't make the NFL more liable. Plus, nothing came of that game other than the Saints getting waxed by the 49ers.

The "audio" created a PR storm which most certainly could benefit a class action effort, by garnering support for such an effort via public opinion. The "audio" will also help politiicans seeking to get public support for televised hearings, and/or game-changing legislation. The audio can also be employed as a general attack on American culture, by targeting American Football as a major icon of our culture.

At this time, I'm not arguing that it is anyone of the above, I'm just saying that we should be looking beneath and beyond the various PR machines' grasp on public opinion, and that we should be legitimately concerned about the future of this game (ie. Williams is a pawn).

Yeah, but, you know what else creates a PR storm?

Everything.

And like everything that preceded it, this too will take a back seat to the next big "thing."

 

[Anonymous]

Re: Filmmaker denies claim that he unfairly released damning

PS. Ever think that this filmmaker could be acting on behalf of a large class action law firm?

Not really. Again, all the tapes show is that the NFL was right. This "evidence" doesn't make the NFL more liable. Plus, nothing came of that game other than the Saints getting waxed by the 49ers.

The "audio" created a PR storm which most certainly could benefit a class action effort, by garnering support for such an effort via public opinion. The "audio" will also help politiicans seeking to get public support for televised hearings, and/or game-changing legislation. The audio can also be employed as a general attack on American culture, by targeting American Football as a major icon of our culture.

At this time, I'm not arguing that it is anyone of the above, I'm just saying that we should be looking beneath and beyond the various PR machines' grasp on public opinion, and that we should be legitimately concerned about the future of this game (ie. Williams is a pawn).

Yeah, but, you know what else creates a PR storm?

Everything.

And like everything that preceded it, this too will take a back seat to the next big "thing."

My whole thing is this.

I'm glad he released it. The NFL would have kept all this in house.

Getting it out there for open debate is healthy.

And why would anyone want this HIDDEN.

So since I am glad he released it, why would I spend any time mindreading and second guessing his motives?

Not only is any guess about sinister motives going to sound implausible immediately, but, the issue is Williams, not the messanger.

 

[Ram Quixote]

Re: Filmmaker denies claim that he unfairly released damning

My whole thing is this.

I'm glad he released it. The NFL would have kept all this in house.

Getting it out there for open debate is healthy.

And why would anyone want this HIDDEN.

So since I am glad he released it, why would I spend any time mindreading and second guessing his motives?

Not only is any guess about sinister motives going to sound implausible immediately, but, the issue is Williams, not the messanger.

Conspiracy Theory concept #2 (related to #1): Perhaps the NFL did. That is, the filmmaker did quietly give his audio to the NFL and because they did not release it to the public, he decided to release it himself. I can imagine him complaining to the NFL and them telling him it's better this way. In this scenario, the NFL wouldn't really be pleased about it, since the publicized audio makes reinstatement of Williams that much more difficult. Re: Goodell and the destroyed Spygate tapes. Only this time, they didn't get their hands on the original material.

The reasons for the NFL not admitting they'd heard this before could simply be because they didn't want to be involved in the legal issues between Gleason and the filmmaker.

And it still makes more sense that the audio was the smoking gun, rather than a player.

 

[Anonymous]

Re: Filmmaker denies claim that he unfairly released damning

My whole thing is this.

I'm glad he released it. The NFL would have kept all this in house.

Getting it out there for open debate is healthy.

And why would anyone want this HIDDEN.

So since I am glad he released it, why would I spend any time mindreading and second guessing his motives?

Not only is any guess about sinister motives going to sound implausible immediately, but, the issue is Williams, not the messanger.

Conspiracy Theory concept #2 (related to #1): Perhaps the NFL did. That is, the filmmaker did quietly give his audio to the NFL and because they did not release it to the public, he decided to release it himself. I can imagine him complaining to the NFL and them telling him it's better this way. In this scenario, the NFL wouldn't really be pleased about it, since the publicized audio makes reinstatement of Williams that much more difficult. Re: Goodell and the destroyed Spygate tapes. Only this time, they didn't get their hands on the original material.

The reasons for the NFL not admitting they'd heard this before could simply be because they didn't want to be involved in the legal issues between Gleason and the filmmaker.

And it still makes more sense that the audio was the smoking gun, rather than a player.

I liked the one better that involved Elmer Fudd and Dudley Do-right.

:bign:

 

[Stranger]

PS. Ever think that this filmmaker could be acting on behalf of a large class action law firm?

Not really. Again, all the tapes show is that the NFL was right. This "evidence" doesn't make the NFL more liable. Plus, nothing came of that game other than the Saints getting waxed by the 49ers.

The "audio" created a PR storm which most certainly could benefit a class action effort, by garnering support for such an effort via public opinion. The "audio" will also help politiicans seeking to get public support for televised hearings, and/or game-changing legislation. The audio can also be employed as a general attack on American culture, by targeting American Football as a major icon of our culture.

At this time, I'm not arguing that it is anyone of the above, I'm just saying that we should be looking beneath and beyond the various PR machines' grasp on public opinion, and that we should be legitimately concerned about the future of this game (ie. Williams is a pawn).

Yeah, but, you know what else creates a PR storm?

Everything.

And like everything that preceded it, this too will take a back seat to the next big "thing."

This PR storm was successful, was it not? The public has now been prepared for a class action lawsuit and big changes, perhaps even legislative ones. And that audio played a big role in achieving this change in attitude.

 

[Anonymous]

Re:

PS. Ever think that this filmmaker could be acting on behalf of a large class action law firm?

Not really. Again, all the tapes show is that the NFL was right. This "evidence" doesn't make the NFL more liable. Plus, nothing came of that game other than the Saints getting waxed by the 49ers.

The "audio" created a PR storm which most certainly could benefit a class action effort, by garnering support for such an effort via public opinion. The "audio" will also help politiicans seeking to get public support for televised hearings, and/or game-changing legislation. The audio can also be employed as a general attack on American culture, by targeting American Football as a major icon of our culture.

At this time, I'm not arguing that it is anyone of the above, I'm just saying that we should be looking beneath and beyond the various PR machines' grasp on public opinion, and that we should be legitimately concerned about the future of this game (ie. Williams is a pawn).

Yeah, but, you know what else creates a PR storm?

Everything.

And like everything that preceded it, this too will take a back seat to the next big "thing."

This PR storm was successful, was it not? The public has now been prepared for a class action lawsuit and big changes, perhaps even legislative ones. And that audio played a big role in achieving this change in attitude.

They punished the coach in question and can prove that the things he did were rare.

Where is there a lawsuit in that.

And from whom.

Players?

All they have to do is put them on the stand and say "did your coach advocate you injure players and did he pay bounties" and when they say "no" (as most will) the league lawyers just say "next." And repeat.

So what would they be sued for.

The "public change in attitude" you refer to is only toward Greg Williams anyway.

AND PR does not win lawsuits.

So you have no one to sue, nothing to sue for, no case, and PR is irrelevant.

Meanwhile. Again--the filmmaker's motives are completely beside the point. This is about Williams, and trying to change the subject doesn't alter that.

 

[Stranger]

Re: Re:

PS. Ever think that this filmmaker could be acting on behalf of a large class action law firm?

Not really. Again, all the tapes show is that the NFL was right. This "evidence" doesn't make the NFL more liable. Plus, nothing came of that game other than the Saints getting waxed by the 49ers.

The "audio" created a PR storm which most certainly could benefit a class action effort, by garnering support for such an effort via public opinion. The "audio" will also help politiicans seeking to get public support for televised hearings, and/or game-changing legislation. The audio can also be employed as a general attack on American culture, by targeting American Football as a major icon of our culture.

At this time, I'm not arguing that it is anyone of the above, I'm just saying that we should be looking beneath and beyond the various PR machines' grasp on public opinion, and that we should be legitimately concerned about the future of this game (ie. Williams is a pawn).

Yeah, but, you know what else creates a PR storm?

Everything.

And like everything that preceded it, this too will take a back seat to the next big "thing."

This PR storm was successful, was it not? The public has now been prepared for a class action lawsuit and big changes, perhaps even legislative ones. And that audio played a big role in achieving this change in attitude.

They punished the coach in question and can prove that the things he did were rare.

Where is there a lawsuit in that.

And from whom.

Players?

All they have to do is put them on the stand and say "did your coach advocate you injure players and did he pay bounties" and when they say "no" (as most will) the league lawyers just say "next." And repeat.

So what would they be sued for.

The "public change in attitude" you refer to is only toward Greg Williams anyway.

AND PR does not win lawsuits.

So you have no one to sue, nothing to sue for, no case, and PR is irrelevant.

Meanwhile. Again--the filmmaker's motives are completely beside the point. This is about Williams, and trying to change the subject doesn't alter that.

Okay, let's leave this at agree-to-disagree.

In short, IMO adoption of this media-view-of-events indicates to me an opinion that does not take into consideration how BIG legal, BIG corporate, or BIG PR operates in today's world.

But I'll leave it alone. You know where I stand.

 

[Ram Quixote]

Re: Filmmaker denies claim that he unfairly released damning

My whole thing is this.

I'm glad he released it. The NFL would have kept all this in house.

Getting it out there for open debate is healthy.

And why would anyone want this HIDDEN.

So since I am glad he released it, why would I spend any time mindreading and second guessing his motives?

Not only is any guess about sinister motives going to sound implausible immediately, but, the issue is Williams, not the messanger.

Conspiracy Theory concept #2 (related to #1): Perhaps the NFL did. That is, the filmmaker did quietly give his audio to the NFL and because they did not release it to the public, he decided to release it himself. I can imagine him complaining to the NFL and them telling him it's better this way. In this scenario, the NFL wouldn't really be pleased about it, since the publicized audio makes reinstatement of Williams that much more difficult. Re: Goodell and the destroyed Spygate tapes. Only this time, they didn't get their hands on the original material.

The reasons for the NFL not admitting they'd heard this before could simply be because they didn't want to be involved in the legal issues between Gleason and the filmmaker.

And it still makes more sense that the audio was the smoking gun, rather than a player.

I liked the one better that involved Elmer Fudd and Dudley Do-right.

:bign:

What world do you live in??? Fudd and Do-Right aren't even drawn by the same studio!!!

:thbbt:

 

[Anonymous]

Re: Filmmaker denies claim that he unfairly released damning

My whole thing is this.

I'm glad he released it. The NFL would have kept all this in house.

Getting it out there for open debate is healthy.

And why would anyone want this HIDDEN.

So since I am glad he released it, why would I spend any time mindreading and second guessing his motives?

Not only is any guess about sinister motives going to sound implausible immediately, but, the issue is Williams, not the messanger.

Conspiracy Theory concept #2 (related to #1): Perhaps the NFL did. That is, the filmmaker did quietly give his audio to the NFL and because they did not release it to the public, he decided to release it himself. I can imagine him complaining to the NFL and them telling him it's better this way. In this scenario, the NFL wouldn't really be pleased about it, since the publicized audio makes reinstatement of Williams that much more difficult. Re: Goodell and the destroyed Spygate tapes. Only this time, they didn't get their hands on the original material.

The reasons for the NFL not admitting they'd heard this before could simply be because they didn't want to be involved in the legal issues between Gleason and the filmmaker.

And it still makes more sense that the audio was the smoking gun, rather than a player.

I liked the one better that involved Elmer Fudd and Dudley Do-right.

:bign:

What world do you live in??? Fudd and Do-Right aren't even drawn by the same studio!!!

:thbbt:

Unh-hunh.

Yeah that's the mainstream view isn't it.

The received wisdom.

Some day all of that is going to blow up and something closer to the truth will come out.

When that happens, remember who said what here today.

 

[-X-]

Re: Filmmaker denies claim that he unfairly released damning

ESPN NFL Insider Adam Schefter weighs in on the circumstances of the Gregg Williams tape being released. Plus, Schefter says Broncos WR Eric Decker is already working out with QB Peyton Manning.

[mp3]http://cdn16.castfire.com/audio/303/2117/7829/933271/herdaudio_2012-04-09-121311-3953-0-0-0.32.mp3?cdn_id=33&uuid=9850d97dda51e4c1127ab284ef3c9ba9[/mp3]

Not a lot there. Colin brings up the 'theory' that the timing of the tape is suspicious, and suggests that 'maybe' the NFL had something to do with it - or something like that. Schefter says it's not an uncommon belief, but he doesn't buy into it. And then the rest is on Peyton Manning and the idea that someone is going to jump up the board to take Tannehill (which, according to Schefter, would be a mistake).

 

[Stranger]

Re: Filmmaker denies claim that he unfairly released damning

Union reportedly had Williams audio, strategizing for players
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000...y-had-williams-audio-strategizing-for-players

NFL.com
Published: April 16, 2012 at 03:07 a.m.


Prior to audio of former New Orleans Saints defensive coordinator Gregg Williams going public April 4, the NFL Players Association already had detailed knowledge of Williams' speech a day before January's playoff game against the San Francisco 49ers, ESPN.com reported Monday, citing sources.

Former Saints linebacker Scott Fujita, who's now with the Cleveland Browns and is a member of the union's executive committee, provided the NFLPA with the details of Williams' speech and the tape that independent film-maker Sean Pamphilon made accessible to him, according to sources.

Citing a union source, ESPN.com also reported that NFLPA executive director DeMaurice Smith and union lawyers have broached the possibility of using Williams' speech as a strategy to dissuade NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell from coming down hard on Saints' players for their role in the team's "bounty" scandal.

The union's case for Saints players would be, in essence, that game film would reveal they ignored Williams' directive to target 49ers quarterback Alex Smith, wide receivers Michael Crabtree and Kyle Williams, and tight end Vernon Davis for specific injuries.

Punishment for more than 20 players could be announced this week. Williams is suspended indefinitely, and Goodell has already denied the appeals of coach Asshole Face (2012 season), general manager Mickey Loomis (eight games) and assistant head coach Joe Vitt (six games).

The NFL is reportedly trying to obtain a copy of Pamphilon's footage.

 

[Thordaddy]

Re: Filmmaker denies claim that he unfairly released damning

Finally we are hearing from the player rep ,I've always wondered WHY he was absent from the mix since it was a coach exhorting one union member to target another.

What was it Sapp called Shockey?

NOW IF the union had knowledge at the time it is reported, what does it mean about their "duty of care" ?

 

[Stranger]

NOW IF the union had knowledge at the time it is reported, what does it mean about their "duty of care" ?

This entire episode really begins to show the unreported ugly side of the various big interests involved in pro football.

 

[Stranger]

Re: Filmmaker denies claim that he unfairly released damning

Drew Brees, Scott Fujita, DeMaurice Smith meet NFL officials
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8 ... -officials

.....But with New Orleans Saints icon Drew Brees and ex-Saints linebacker Scott Fujita in the room, the discussion was clearly going to hit the high-profile "bounty" program case that has dominated NFL headlines this offseason. And it did -- without much progress made.

Brees told NFL.com after the meeting that when discussion turned to the "bounty" system, near the end of the league/union meeting, "We didn’t get any meaningful evidence, or any meaningful truth or facts." Asked if there was progress made towards a resolution in the one unresolved area of the case -- player penalties, Brees simply responded, "No.".....