Deep Thoughts From Mike Martz

[Selassie I]

I just wanted to bump this Masterpiece.


:snicker:

 

[LesBaker]

I just wanted to bump this Masterpiece.


:snicker:

Next time I see you I'm punching you in the dick for this.

 

[Selassie I]

Next time I see you I'm punching you in the dick for this.

LOLOLOLOLOLOL

 

[LesBaker]

LOLOLOLOLOLOL

If you Photoshop the Ravens logo on the cap I'll forgive you.

 

[fearsomefour]

Speculation based on the events that led to him starting. He was a 6th round, "never gonna be" for the Saints and a practice squad guy the Martz made a project out of. No one was going to be knocking on his door and he wasn't going to get an opportunity and is very lucky to have gotten the chance that he did with the GSOT. Anywhere else and he probably never starts a game.

This is the magic when a coach know what HIS offense (or D) needs. The same thing can be said for Trent Green (a 6th round pick) and Warner (undrafted). None of the "Martz" quarterbacks were high round, highly thought of studs. He could see the talent in guys and how it matched what he wanted to do.

 

[fearsomefour]

What a joke. Martz built his reputation on incredible talent. No team will ever put together a roster like that again ever! As head coach he couldn't even parlay it into 1 Super Bowl win. Martz is a fallacy. There is no Martz!

No offense. That is crazy.

 

[fearsomefour]

Vermeil didn't know how to handle Bruce, didn't let him follow his own workout/warm up routine the way Martz did. I strongly doubt Bruce's two off years were merely coincidence.

Rams offense was dreadful from the end of the Robinson era until Martz took it over in '99. Linehan's first year was the last good year for the Rams offense when he was using Martz's players and a lot of Martz's playbook. The offense has been dreadful ever since, including under Linehan.

All I remember from the pre-Martz Vermeil era is Gerald Moore running the ball. Run, run, third and long so we have to pass, check down....punt. Vermeils offense was dreadful. A lot of things came together when Martz showed up. Talent was there but never would have blossomed if Martz had not shown up. Bringing in Green was a condition of of Martz signing. The ability to implement his offense (with Green) during training camp cannot be understated in its importance.

 

[fearsomefour]

But other than Warner each of them really blossomed under another HC.

And IMO Warner is just an outlier like no other we've seen at QB. Lighting in a bottle.

Green was a 6th round pick by the Charges, they gave up on him and he worked with Martz (going from 3rd string to starting in Washington), he developed in St. Louis and had years in KC with Vermeil running a watered down Martz scheme. Bulger and Warner only had success in St. Louis. Bulger was let go from New Orleans and Warner was camp fodder in Green Bay. When you do it once it is luck, when you do it multiple times it is skill. Even if Warner was an outlier it still takes someone to develop the skill that was there. Vermeil has said he had no idea but saw a few things he liked. The fact that Martz's offense was a perfect match for Kurt was the luck part....but Martz developed Warner make no mistake.

 

[Selassie I]

If you Photoshop the Ravens logo on the cap I'll forgive you.

Put your glasses on Les... that is a ravens hat.

 

[LesBaker]

Green was a 6th round pick by the Charges, they gave up on him and he worked with Martz (going from 3rd string to starting in Washington), he developed in St. Louis and had years in KC with Vermeil running a watered down Martz scheme. Bulger and Warner only had success in St. Louis. Bulger was let go from New Orleans and Warner was camp fodder in Green Bay. When you do it once it is luck, when you do it multiple times it is skill. Even if Warner was an outlier it still takes someone to develop the skill that was there. Vermeil has said he had no idea but saw a few things he liked. The fact that Martz's offense was a perfect match for Kurt was the luck part....but Martz developed Warner make no mistake.

You have forgotten Warner in AZ?

 

[fearsomefour]

You have forgotten Warner in AZ?

My Warner AZ jersey would argue with that. He played some of his best ball in Arizona.
Typo. I was referencing Bulger in St. Louis only.

 

[LesBaker]

My Warner AZ jersey would argue with that. He played some of his best ball in Arizona.
Typo. I was referencing Bulger in St. Louis only.

That playoff run was the best in the history of the sport wasn't it. It even made Bradshaw pick the Cardinals in the SB against the Steelers.

 

[fearsomefour]

That playoff run was the best in the history of the sport wasn't it. It even made Bradshaw pick the Cardinals in the SB against the Steelers.

Yeah, amazing. I have the GB vs Arizona game on the ol DVR and it is one of the best QB performances I have ever seen.
When he was locked in there was no one better....ever.
One of his most impressive years to me was the year before they started winning....bad D, terrible O line and no running game. His stats were not great but watching every game that year he was already back to his old level then. Great and unique player.

 

[LesBaker]

Yeah, amazing. I have the GB vs Arizona game on the ol DVR and it is one of the best QB performances I have ever seen.
When he was locked in there was no one better....ever.
One of his most impressive years to me was the year before they started winning....bad D, terrible O line and no running game. His stats were not great but watching every game that year he was already back to his old level then. Great and unique player.

I agree. He got the shit knocked out of him over and over. I saw a lot of the games, I was a huge fan of his and there were many times I thought he wouldn't be able to finish the game. I've never seen a QB as brave in the pocket as he was. Ever.

When I think of Warner I think of a few different games. The Green Bay game is one of them.

 

[-X-]

Green was a 6th round pick by the Charges, they gave up on him and he worked with Martz (going from 3rd string to starting in Washington), he developed in St. Louis and had years in KC with Vermeil running a watered down Martz scheme. Bulger and Warner only had success in St. Louis. Bulger was let go from New Orleans and Warner was camp fodder in Green Bay. When you do it once it is luck, when you do it multiple times it is skill. Even if Warner was an outlier it still takes someone to develop the skill that was there. Vermeil has said he had no idea but saw a few things he liked. The fact that Martz's offense was a perfect match for Kurt was the luck part....but Martz developed Warner make no mistake.

You have forgotten the Bulger poster on @LesBaker's ceiling?

 

[LesBaker]

You have forgotten the Bulger poster on @LesBaker's ceiling?

I look at it while wearing my 49ers panties.

 

[-X-]

I look at it while wearing my 49ers panties.

you dirty girl...

 

[fearsomefour]

I agree. He got the crap knocked out of him over and over. I saw a lot of the games, I was a huge fan of his and there were many times I thought he wouldn't be able to finish the game. I've never seen a QB as brave in the pocket as he was. Ever.

When I think of Warner I think of a few different games. The Green Bay game is one of them.

For sure.
The game vs. Carolina (I think) were he hyperextended his elbow. Then handing off backward while wearing an arm brace.
He did not have athletic ability that was rare he was not a great runner and had just enough arm. But he certainly made up for it with smarts and toughness.
Thats why it blows me away when you read about guys like RGKnee with many more athletic gifts than someone like Warner or Brady but who (reportedly) isn't willing to do the work. Sad.

 

[Rmfnlt]

Nice read.

Martz is certainly a very intelligent man... some might use the word eccentric.

Kind of like Mike Leach.

Their "systems" require various parts of the machine to be in pace. If not, the whole thing can bog down.

Kind of a moot point anyway, IMO.

Like many have said, a marriage of Jeff Fisher and Mike Martz probably could never work.

I would be very surprised if Mike Martz ever works in the NFL again (don't mean that in a negative way).

 

[MrMotes]

All I remember from the pre-Martz Vermeil era is Gerald Moore running the ball. Run, run, third and long so we have to pass, check down....punt. Vermeils offense was dreadful. A lot of things came together when Martz showed up. Talent was there but never would have blossomed if Martz had not shown up. Bringing in Green was a condition of of Martz signing. The ability to implement his offense (with Green) during training camp cannot be understated in its importance.

Yep, Vermeil's offense was terrible his first two years here, but he learned. Here's how he explained it, in KC:

"Times have changed. My thinking has been influenced by being around coaches who've been successful, by working with Mike Martz and Al Saunders," Vermeil says, referring to the men who ran his Rams offense. "You see the really good offensive teams, with the exception of the Ravens [in 2000], winning Super Bowls.

"There was a time in my coaching career when the No. 1 thing I tried to do was prevent us from losing. But it's just hard to play perfect football in the playoffs when one play gets you beat. My thoughts have become, `Yeah, you're going to make some mistakes. But when you create enough good plays that put you ahead, the one bad play doesn't get you beat.'"

Martz certainly changed Dick Vermeil.