Yeah let's wax nostalgic with Jeff Fisher and convince ourselves his defense was better. And hey why not start doubting our first ballot Hall of Fame DC too while we're at it.
You people!
You people!
C Littleton Write up (Long and Detailed)
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Yeah let's wax nostalgic with Jeff Fisher and convince ourselves his defense was better. And hey why not start doubting our first ballot Hall of Fame DC too while we're at it.
You people!
Well I get peoples concern. He does have a lot of tools and a lot guys who should be able to at least have a top 15 defense. Right now we look like the 2001 Rams. We'll put up 35 to 40 on you but you can too! I don't like playing like that especially with the talent we have on D.
Maybe the answer is simplifying the Defense. I know Wade likes to give a lot different looks but it seems like plays are not set or in the wrong spots on some plays. Christianson and Peters are two of our Biggest offenders. Joyner is the next. These guys are constantly out of position, and you can see it pre-snap. Pay attention to these players you'll see what im talking about.
When you have a Hall of Fame DC and your defense is underperforming you look at the personnel.
Agree 100% - it's pretty obvious that Barwin and Quinn are missed.
Losing Fox and Easly, and Obo getting hurt didn't help either. Not to mention Talib.
We're not exactly dodging the injury bug this year.
This is a point people don't factor into their memories.
Not hard to say at all. Every time the offense put up some points against good teams the Williams d leaked like a sieve.
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They also don't factor that Fisher's defenses rarely finished in that elite points per game range. Fish had his games where that 46 clicked, but many others it didn't. Up and down, zero consistency, as evidenced by their ppg over those seasons.
But next we'll hear how it was the offense's fault keeping them on the field. So my take here is if you're starting to think our old defensive leadership was better... Stop thinking.
I don't know that actually. I presume he vetted all the moves of course but who knows. I feel pretty comfortable saying he was high on Talib coming in, who produced before he was hurt. Not sure about Peters, and I think they just didn't have a strong option for edge out there and it didn't work out.
Key here is Wade knows what he's doing. Lot of fans running around on Rams sites right now acting like he is using his personnel wrong.
Well proof is they arent playing as well as we all thought they would be. It's an issue that magnify as we close in on the playoffs
That was my thinking last year as to why the D did not perform up to the usual of a Wade Phillips defense.
This year, I don't know. Either way you slice it they don't seem to be performing anything close to what we expected. I loved the Wade hire, who wouldn't. That said he shares some blame. Even with Talib out, which is a huge loss, the guy is arguably a future HOFer. This unit should be a top 5 D or really close to it.
How we play against KC could be telling if this D is getting back on track or not.
BonifayRam
Legend
I do not have the ability to check the amount of snaps that Ethan is getting but I do see him on the field in regularly. EW just has not been making a lot of plays from that NT post. IMO he performs better in the Brockers/Donald posts in the rotations. Not sure why JFM's performance has dropped off so much the last 3 games...
.I agree with you Rams65 those knee injuries to Fox & Easley was costly to this Rams defense more than we will ever know. For now we will have to hope that both Dante Folwer Jr. & Og Okoronkwo can help us retrieve what we lost from those IR's.
As far as the future DL concerns the UFA free agent status in 4 months of our two NT's (Suh/ Westbrook) will have to be addressed with some priority early next year. When a very average well travelled OG D.J.Fluker who has been on 3 teams the last 3 seasons can easily move our $14 million priced NT Suh anywhere he wants with consistantly in the run game then we know we have not found a long term answer @ the NT post.
It appears at the moment for the future planning ... that Michael Brockers might be forced to return to NT post this letting John Franklin-Myers fill the 5 tech post of Brockers in 2019. Leaving the 6th rd'er NT Sebastian Joseph-Day as the only back up with Tanzel Smart on the DT posts.
alm:This Sunday afternoon I will be paying close attention to the run defense of the Rams front seven. Lucky for Suh Fluker has a calf injury that he has been working through. Might want to recall what Fluker said after the game against the Rams " that the Rams' star-studded defensive line wasn't worth all the hype".
http://www.espn.com/blog/nflnation/...-will-let-play-provide-response-to-d-j-fluker
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Going into the New Orleans game our defense--in spite of some bad games--was ranked quite high in points allowed. This was in the face of a press-centric scheme not having their top CB and their CB2 playing poorly for multiple games.
We know what Wade is. He is an elite DC. I am just not interested in exploring whether or not he's up to snuff, or whether he needs to be nudged to run his defense differently. Doing that is how you end up having an elite teacher leave your program, which is never good. That's the type of thing John Shaw would have done, gotten his fingers all in it and try to fix something that doesn't need fixing.
What needs fixing is the players need to do a better job of discipline in the scheme. On the front and back end. And on the back end in particular Peters needs to improve greatly in that. Lastly the best thing about our defense and its issues is that Peters has the talent to improve, and we also will be getting Talib back. So IMO keep doing what I know the Rams do, which is invest in the process and get the players to do a better job.
When Talib comes back the D does get tremendously better. Talib was our best DB the second we signed him. Generating more pass rush will go along way as well.
Don't get me wrong, there is reason for optimism. Wade is also everything you say he is. That said the guy has been around a long time. I just don't think it's out of the realm of possibilities that Wade is having a off year.
Wade is like any coordinator Hell. He can have an off year if players can't execute consistently. And he has had off years and been blamed and fired for it too only to resurface and prove yet again that he's an elite DC.
For a lot of teams when they have that situation, they're not sure where the line is, whether the players or the coordinator or the coaching/prep are the problem. The nice thing about having offensive and defensive leads like McVay and Phillips is for the most part the problems that arise on the field will be players needing to do a better job. Because while they're not perfect both are among the very best at what they do.
And both will take accountability, too. Neither will throw players under the bus. But don't think in that film room things aren't called what they are. Right now we have a lot of discipline issues in terms of consistency on defense. And there's some guys who currently are being asked to do a little more than they should have to. But they still have to improve for this defense to get right. It's not gonna be "Oh Wade made this adjustment and now look how amazing this defense is." Because the problem right now is the players.
I get all that. But we'll have to agree to disagree.
Let's say it is mostly the players faults as you say. Who's idea was it to aquire these players for this defense then？ Those who know football know Peters play style before they traded for him. That said he has been horrific and most of that is on him, he doesn't deserve a pass. I just don't think the talent is matching productuon.
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https://www.dailynews.com/2018/11/2...ent-from-undrafted-to-top-tackler-in-2-years/
Rams linebacker Cory Littleton went from undrafted to top tackler in two years
By RICH HAMMOND
AP Photo/Kelvin Kuo
THOUSAND OAKS – It’s called an experiment because results aren’t certain. When the Rams handed one of their most important positions to Cory Littleton, they pulled down goggles and hoped for the best.
The Rams at least had a hypothesis. They’d seen Littleton’s aggressiveness and intelligence on special teams, and in spot duty as an outside linebacker, and they thought it would project to success at middle linebacker. It easily could have been a misread, but it turned into one of their best decisions of the year.
Quietly – fitting, because of his unassuming nature – Littleton is one of the NFL’s top tacklers. Entering the Rams’ game Sunday at Detroit, Littleton is tied for seventh with 91 total tackles. Among inside linebackers, he is second only to Carolina’s Luke Kuechly, a four-time All-Pro selection.
Littleton even has become the subject of a Pro Bowl voting campaign among Rams fans.
“It means a lot,” Littleton said after Thursday’s practice at Cal Lutheran. “There are a lot of people out there, even people you don’t personally know, going out of their way to get you in the Pro Bowl because they think highly of you as a player.”
That’s not bad for a player who went undrafted two years ago out of Washington and who, as recently as training camp, perhaps was thought to be too small (6-foot-3, 228 pounds) to thrive at middle linebacker.
The game has changed, though, and Littleton’s ability to pursue and cover running backs, from sideline to sideline, more than makes up for a lack of heft. He is growing into the role as a vocal leader and has retained his role on special teams, with two blocked punts this season.
Littleton, who had only five starts entering this year, is the only player in the NFL this season to have recorded at least one sack (he has three this season), an interception and a tackle for a safety.
“It’s just been a progression throughout the season,” Littleton said. “Everything is pretty much down for me. You do different individual things, week by week, because every team shows us little different things, but I feel pretty good with where I am right now.”
In all, Littleton completely has justified the Rams’ decision to trade his predecessor, Alec Ogletree, to the New York Giants in March for two mid-round draft picks. Ogletree, albeit playing in a completely different defense, has totaled 44 solo tackles, 68 total tackles and one sack in 10 games with the Giants.
Littleton is on pace for 132 total tackles and 96 solo tackles, which essentially would equal Ogletree’s massive 2016 season with the Rams, when he had 136 total tackles and 98 solo tackles. A few months later, the Rams gave Ogletree a four-year, $42-million contract extension.
It soon became clear that perhaps that wasn’t the wisest decision. Ogletree earned rightful praise for his big-splash plays, but consistency often was an issue, particularly with pursuit and tackling.
The Rams stared down the idea of an $11-million annual salary-cap hit for Ogletree through 2021, then looked at Littleton, who increasingly had impressed since signing as an undrafted free agent in 2016. Defensive coordinator Wade Phillips took over in 2017 and wondered why Littleton hadn’t played more. Special-teams coach John Fassel adores his motor and effectiveness. Littleton has come a long way in only three seasons.
“I won’t lie,” Littleton said. “I don’t really think about it much, but when I do, it is pretty crazy to think about it. It’s a little hard to believe.”
An interesting decision is on the horizon. Littleton makes only $635,000 this season and is set to become a restricted free agent next March. The Rams can keep him, in the short term, but they also need to formulate a long-term plan for a defense that has few starters locked up beyond 2019.
The first big decision could rest with Littleton’s interior mate. Mark Barron is under contract through 2020, with a cap hit of almost $9.7 million each year, but the Rams could cut Barron and save more than $6.3 million next season. That might not be necessary, but if it helps to lock up Littleton, it could be an answer.
Rams linebacker Cory Littleton went from undrafted to top tackler in two years
By RICH HAMMOND
AP Photo/Kelvin Kuo
THOUSAND OAKS – It’s called an experiment because results aren’t certain. When the Rams handed one of their most important positions to Cory Littleton, they pulled down goggles and hoped for the best.
The Rams at least had a hypothesis. They’d seen Littleton’s aggressiveness and intelligence on special teams, and in spot duty as an outside linebacker, and they thought it would project to success at middle linebacker. It easily could have been a misread, but it turned into one of their best decisions of the year.
Quietly – fitting, because of his unassuming nature – Littleton is one of the NFL’s top tacklers. Entering the Rams’ game Sunday at Detroit, Littleton is tied for seventh with 91 total tackles. Among inside linebackers, he is second only to Carolina’s Luke Kuechly, a four-time All-Pro selection.
Littleton even has become the subject of a Pro Bowl voting campaign among Rams fans.
“It means a lot,” Littleton said after Thursday’s practice at Cal Lutheran. “There are a lot of people out there, even people you don’t personally know, going out of their way to get you in the Pro Bowl because they think highly of you as a player.”
That’s not bad for a player who went undrafted two years ago out of Washington and who, as recently as training camp, perhaps was thought to be too small (6-foot-3, 228 pounds) to thrive at middle linebacker.
The game has changed, though, and Littleton’s ability to pursue and cover running backs, from sideline to sideline, more than makes up for a lack of heft. He is growing into the role as a vocal leader and has retained his role on special teams, with two blocked punts this season.
Littleton, who had only five starts entering this year, is the only player in the NFL this season to have recorded at least one sack (he has three this season), an interception and a tackle for a safety.
“It’s just been a progression throughout the season,” Littleton said. “Everything is pretty much down for me. You do different individual things, week by week, because every team shows us little different things, but I feel pretty good with where I am right now.”
In all, Littleton completely has justified the Rams’ decision to trade his predecessor, Alec Ogletree, to the New York Giants in March for two mid-round draft picks. Ogletree, albeit playing in a completely different defense, has totaled 44 solo tackles, 68 total tackles and one sack in 10 games with the Giants.
Littleton is on pace for 132 total tackles and 96 solo tackles, which essentially would equal Ogletree’s massive 2016 season with the Rams, when he had 136 total tackles and 98 solo tackles. A few months later, the Rams gave Ogletree a four-year, $42-million contract extension.
It soon became clear that perhaps that wasn’t the wisest decision. Ogletree earned rightful praise for his big-splash plays, but consistency often was an issue, particularly with pursuit and tackling.
The Rams stared down the idea of an $11-million annual salary-cap hit for Ogletree through 2021, then looked at Littleton, who increasingly had impressed since signing as an undrafted free agent in 2016. Defensive coordinator Wade Phillips took over in 2017 and wondered why Littleton hadn’t played more. Special-teams coach John Fassel adores his motor and effectiveness. Littleton has come a long way in only three seasons.
“I won’t lie,” Littleton said. “I don’t really think about it much, but when I do, it is pretty crazy to think about it. It’s a little hard to believe.”
An interesting decision is on the horizon. Littleton makes only $635,000 this season and is set to become a restricted free agent next March. The Rams can keep him, in the short term, but they also need to formulate a long-term plan for a defense that has few starters locked up beyond 2019.
The first big decision could rest with Littleton’s interior mate. Mark Barron is under contract through 2020, with a cap hit of almost $9.7 million each year, but the Rams could cut Barron and save more than $6.3 million next season. That might not be necessary, but if it helps to lock up Littleton, it could be an answer.
Whether it's the injuries or something else it's obvious to all that Barron just isn't the same player he has been this season. Maybe a full offseason would get him back in shape but he's not worth the cap hit anymore. Cutting him is obvious in the offseason. If we relieve the cap space from Barron and Suh we'll have a good chunk to shore up the defense in the offseason. If they can find a stud run stopping linebacker to pair with Littleton our defense will improve vastly. Maybe they are already on the team in Kiser? Hard to say but we need someone who can take on blockers while Littleton plays the sideline to sideline role.
