FEATURE Atwell Extended

[kurtfaulk]

I’m not so certain with the ‘intentional about how they spend money’ part. They have actually been pretty bad with spending money in many cases. You could start with the absurd Gurley contract. that was way way above market value. Then you could look at some of the free agent acquisitions that ended up not being worth it.

Gurley was worth every cent. You can't plan for injury.

And you know why the contract was way above market value? Because he was way above every other rb in the league.

Did you see how the offense ground to a halt, almost, when Gurley left? He was the engine of the offense and he couldn't be replaced by any of the other rbs the Rams brought in to the team.

.

 

[fanotodd]

You just reasoned it out yourself with the same conclusion. They want Ferguson on the field. He’s not displacing Higbee. That’s the plan. If that is the plan, then people are making way too much of a deal over a 1 year 10 million dollar contract.

Tutu is security if it doesn’t happen as fast as they hope. Signing Tutu to a one year deal doesn’t guarantee he’s starting over Ferguson if all goes well

Actually, I was just addressing the annual 12P vs 11P discussion and how it relates to the rookie TE Ferguson.
As for the Atwell vs Ferguson discussion, I ignore terms like “starter”. I would look at snaps and probably targets (to a certain extent). Of course that criteria sets the stage for this topic to endure the season.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Actually, I was just addressing the annual 12P vs 11P discussion and how it relates to the rookie TE Ferguson.
As for the Atwell vs Ferguson discussion, I ignore terms like “starter”. I would look at snaps and probably targets (to a certain extent). Of course that criteria sets the stage for this topic to endure the season.

Yet, it’s the same exact logic I used.

McVay had 4 years to use what a few here (not you)think is an amazing weapon who is always open, but he didn’t. I don’t buy that some how this light bulb just went on for McVay and he saw the light. Atwell is who he is. This won’t be some new role that thrusts him into stardom. It’s likely just more of the same, especially if Ferguson (most likely), Allen, or Parkinson gets a grasp of the offense and plays well.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Gurley was worth every cent. You can't plan for injury.

And you know why the contract was way above market value? Because he was way above every other rb in the league.

Did you see how the offense ground to a halt, almost, when Gurley left? He was the engine of the offense and he couldn't be replaced by any of the other rbs the Rams brought in to the team.

.

It was still a ridiculously high contract. I loved what he brought to the offense but that was too high.

And, the knee was already a thing in college. It had potential to rear its ugly head at any moment.

That aside, it’s not like every cent this team spends is a wise and calculated investment that always bears fruit.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Kind of heresay, they didnt know Adams was going to be released. They clearly had it in mind to ensure Tutu didnt test the market.
Not sure why folks are so invested in conjuring up hidden agenda.
I was as shocked as the next guy that they re-signed Tutu, thought he was good riddance. Obviously the Rams had other plans

What other options did you foresee in free agency? If Adams was not a part of the plan then this would be a shit plan and a rough season. We saw what man coverage did to the offense at the end of the season, and against the Saints as well. Was a receiver they already had on the team really the answer?

The report that they wanted to trade up for McMillan is another indication of them wanting more. They had Adams and Puka but were willing to trade up for another receiver.

And after four years of McVay not utilizing Tutu as much as some fans think he should, did he suddenly have an epiphany?

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

Kind of heresay, they didnt know Adams was going to be released. They clearly had it in mind to ensure Tutu didnt test the market.
Not sure why folks are so invested in conjuring up hidden agenda.
I was as shocked as the next guy that they re-signed Tutu, thought he was good riddance. Obviously the Rams had other plans

Adams was signed on March 9th and he said McVay had been texting him for two weeks.

Tutu was signed on the 10th.

Free agency officially begun on the 12th.

How was Adams not a part of the plan?

 

[dieterbrock]

Adams was signed on March 9th and he said McVay had been texting him for two weeks.

Tutu was signed on the 10th.

Free agency officially begun on the 12th.

How was Adams not a part of the plan?

I thought the subject was Atwell?
He was a priority for the Rams, they didnt let him touch FA
Adams is a completely separate conversation.
The Rams were done with Kupp back in February and surely they didnt know they could get Adams at that point.
Either way, I dont think acquiring Adams had an effect on Tutu, they had already committed to bringing him back
I know its a slow time of year but I dont see where things are any different now than when all the signings went down?
Rams decided to revamp their WR core. Told Kupp to pound rocks. Wouldnt let Tutu test the market, signed Devante. Allegedly were trying to trade up for an offensive player.
Not sure what the debate is about?

 

[dieterbrock]

What other options did you foresee in free agency? If Adams was not a part of the plan then this would be a shit plan and a rough season. We saw what man coverage did to the offense at the end of the season, and against the Saints as well. Was a receiver they already had on the team really the answer?

The report that they wanted to trade up for McMillan is another indication of them wanting more. They had Adams and Puka but were willing to trade up for another receiver.

And after four years of McVay not utilizing Tutu as much as some fans think he should, did he suddenly have an epiphany?

I dont understand what you are trying to get at. They had no idea who "might" be available, but they made sure Tutu wasnt going to be available to other teams. FA hadnt even started, the draft was months away. Even after signing both Tutu and Adams it surely didnt mean they were done looking

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

I thought the subject was Atwell?
He was a priority for the Rams, they didnt let him touch FA
Adams is a completely separate conversation.
The Rams were done with Kupp back in February and surely they didnt know they could get Adams at that point.
Either way, I dont think acquiring Adams had an effect on Tutu, they had already committed to bringing him back
I know its a slow time of year but I dont see where things are any different now than when all the signings went down?
Rams decided to revamp their WR core. Told Kupp to pound rocks. Wouldnt let Tutu test the market, signed Devante. Allegedly were trying to trade up for an offensive player.
Not sure what the debate is about?

I was replying to your post. You said they didn’t even know if Adams was going to be available. They already knew a few weeks before signing Atwell.

 

[RamFan503]

Isn’t the Van Jefferson role basically what Tutu has been playing? Field stretcher, deep threat?

That’s what I said.

 

[dieterbrock]

I was replying to your post. You said they didn’t even know if Adams was going to be available. They already knew a few weeks before signing Atwell.

When the Rams told Kupp he was no longer in the plans, they didnt know Adams would be available. Even when it became obvious that teams werent going to trade for him, and that he'd be released, they surely werent guaranteed he'd be a Ram. Tutu on the other hand never had an opportunity to test the market. Still and all, neither move was dependent on the other

 

[dang]

I’m hanging on to the reporting that McVay is looking for a more explosive offense. We can all agree we needed more juice. Atwell will be a tool in the toolbox. Hopefully Ferguson will be as well. That would give the Rams Nacua/DAdams/Atwell/Higs/Ferguson this year vs Nacua (hurt)/Kupp (hurt)/DRob/Atwell/Parkinson last year. Looks better to me.

 

[WestCoastRam]

What reporting? Players arent negotiating with other teams unless their team gives permission.
That's just not true
Teams have the chance to re-sign their own guys and the Rams used that time to ensure Tutu didnt go anywhere.
This came on the heels of signing Davante Adams

1st link on a google search, there are many more. Illegal talks at the combine and even before (I mean, teams that have been egregious about it have been docked picks!) have been going on forever. The Rapoports of the world don't talk about it much cause they don't want to burn sources but you'll hear whispers ever year about it.

Behind scenes of NFL Combine: Illegal chatter, secret meetings and big money | Sporting News Canada

www.sportingnews.com

NFL Combine week is here, and despite all the hype about more than 300 draft-eligible prospects participating in boring on-field drills, the most important activities are taking place away from the cameras and spotlight.

I'm talking about lots of conversations — legal and illegal under NFL rules — between general managers with their contract/salary cap guys often in tow; conversations with agents for soon-to-be free agents like Kirk Cousins and for players already signed but targeted for pay cuts or release. There also are trade talks among teams looking to move/acquire players or improve draft spots

While the most important aspects of the Combine for players are physicals and interviews, the priorities for GMs are the agent chats in hotel rooms, bars, restaurants, coffee shops and skyways of Indianapolis ... with greater privacy needed for the illegal discussions on other teams' players who will soon hit the free-agency market.

 

[RamFan503]

Yet, it’s the same exact logic I used.

McVay had 4 years to use what a few here (not you)think is an amazing weapon who is always open, but he didn’t. I don’t buy that some how this light bulb just went on for McVay and he saw the light. Atwell is who he is. This won’t be some new role that thrusts him into stardom. It’s likely just more of the same, especially if Ferguson (most likely), Allen, or Parkinson gets a grasp of the offense and plays well.

You keep saying or insinuating this “new role” theory. It’s not about a new role. It’s about more use and more targets. Tutu has improved each season and there’s no reason to think that is going to stop.

With just a couple more catches per game, he is up around 1,000 yards. That doesn’t make it a new role - just a receiver getting another 3-4 targets per game. Let’s say he gets 750-800 yards this season. That’s roughly 1 more catch per game. And none of this counts the long PIs TuTu receives like the 48 yarder against the Whiners.

Seems to me that is a decent net from a 3rd receiver. It also seems to me that is a pretty decent net from a $10 million contract.

Maybe it doesn’t happen. But I think it’s easily in reach. And it doesn’t only happen with some “new role”.

I think you misinterpret what a lot of us are saying. Tutu is certainly not the worst option for a 3rd receiver. And I don’t think ANYONE is saying he’s going to beat out Puka or Davante.

TuTu’s 562 yards ranked him 75th in the league with what most would acknowledge was a pretty anemic offense for most of the year. We were very limited on long pass plays with an O-line that was decimated at the beginning of the year and really didn’t hit its stride until mid season.

Bottom line IMO is that he was worth the investment. Obviously we can’t know for sure until we see the results.

 

[WestCoastRam]

Not so sure it’s “common sense”. The 12P has been bandied about since McVay has been hired. We also know the Rams have toyed/tried to replace Higbee over the same timeframe.

Let’s look at what is NOT speculative. Higbee has been difficult to unseat and the Rams are running out of time—Higbee is mortal and can’t play forever. Several TEs have been brought in but No one has forced Higbee off of the field. A good blocking WR offers more than a good blocking TE. Between Woods, Kupp, Nacua, and Whittington last season, the idea continues.

FWIW, I don't think the Rams have toyed/tried to replace Higbee since he's been here (though I agree, he's aged out after this year and they've been looking for a successor last two years).

I do believe the Rams have been consistently trying to replace Mundt and Everett since they've left (and hopefully find even better guys than them).

 

[WestCoastRam]

Actually, I was just addressing the annual 12P vs 11P discussion and how it relates to the rookie TE Ferguson.
As for the Atwell vs Ferguson discussion, I ignore terms like “starter”. I would look at snaps and probably targets (to a certain extent). Of course that criteria sets the stage for this topic to endure the season.

Agree, I think fans got lulled into a very static convo about offense given that Kupp was a guy who did everything so we didn't run/change formations and personnel that often. I suspect we'll still have one of the more static formation/personnel usages in the league next year due to McVay wanting everything to present similarly to the defense but I also expect a significant bump in formation and personnel change from last few years.

 

[Noregar]

Tutu's $10 mil is a much better cap bargain than the sunk cost $10 mil cap hit of Joe Noteboom.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

You keep saying or insinuating this “new role” theory. It’s not about a new role. It’s about more use and more targets. Tutu has improved each season and there’s no reason to think that is going to stop.

With just a couple more catches per game, he is up around 1,000 yards. That doesn’t make it a new role - just a receiver getting another 3-4 targets per game. Let’s say he gets 750-800 yards this season. That’s roughly 1 more catch per game. And none of this counts the long PIs TuTu receives like the 48 yarder against the Whiners.

Seems to me that is a decent net from a 3rd receiver. It also seems to me that is a pretty decent net from a $10 million contract.

Maybe it doesn’t happen. But I think it’s easily in reach. And it doesn’t only happen with some “new role”.

I think you misinterpret what a lot of us are saying. Tutu is certainly not the worst option for a 3rd receiver. And I don’t think ANYONE is saying he’s going to beat out Puka or Davante.

TuTu’s 562 yards ranked him 75th in the league with what most would acknowledge was a pretty anemic offense for most of the year. We were very limited on long pass plays with an O-line that was decimated at the beginning of the year and really didn’t hit its stride until mid season.

Bottom line IMO is that he was worth the investment. Obviously we can’t know for sure until we see the results.

A few people are saying he’s getting paid like a star and will sudddnly ascend to stardom. Thats how this all started and that’s what I initially replied to. But then others opposed my views. Then it snowballed.

You are saying what I’m saying. Tutu’s role doesn’t change. He moves up to the third receiver spot, but he plays the same position. Maybe gets a few more catches but he will be used the same. His strengths and limitations didn’t vanish with a 10 million dollar contract. He didn’t become Kupp.

I just added that, if Ferguson plays as well as McVay hopes, then that reduces Tutu’s usage. It won’t reduce Adams or Puka’s. So the new one year deal didn’t actually change anything, like some people suggested.

 

[Pupped]

You keep saying or insinuating this “new role” theory. It’s not about a new role. It’s about more use and more targets. Tutu has improved each season and there’s no reason to think that is going to stop.

With just a couple more catches per game, he is up around 1,000 yards. That doesn’t make it a new role - just a receiver getting another 3-4 targets per game. Let’s say he gets 750-800 yards this season. That’s roughly 1 more catch per game. And none of this counts the long PIs TuTu receives like the 48 yarder against the Whiners.

Seems to me that is a decent net from a 3rd receiver. It also seems to me that is a pretty decent net from a $10 million contract.

Maybe it doesn’t happen. But I think it’s easily in reach. And it doesn’t only happen with some “new role”.

I think you misinterpret what a lot of us are saying. Tutu is certainly not the worst option for a 3rd receiver. And I don’t think ANYONE is saying he’s going to beat out Puka or Davante.

TuTu’s 562 yards ranked him 75th in the league with what most would acknowledge was a pretty anemic offense for most of the year. We were very limited on long pass plays with an O-line that was decimated at the beginning of the year and really didn’t hit its stride until mid season.

Bottom line IMO is that he was worth the investment. Obviously we can’t know for sure until we see the results.

What I'm excited about is to see what all the elements of the pass game do to compliment one another.

I just see a significant increase in explosive plays all around.. and keeping Tutu's speed is a big part of that.

 

[Elmgrovegnome]

When the Rams told Kupp he was no longer in the plans, they didnt know Adams would be available. Even when it became obvious that teams werent going to trade for him, and that he'd be released, they surely werent guaranteed he'd be a Ram. Tutu on the other hand never had an opportunity to test the market. Still and all, neither move was dependent on the other

Off-season plans are always evolving. Just like when they didn’t sign Mike Evans, they pivoted to Parkinson and later tried to add Sutton. The Atwell decision isn’t likely to have been set in stone the day after the Rams season ended