Will Sam Bradford Become Elite in 2013? Via 101 ESPN

[ShaneG]

By Shane Gray

In St. Louis, there are a few things that people check off their calendars daily to ensure that the earth is still spinning and things are relatively normal: we open the shades to see if the sun again arose across the horizon, we glance to ensure that the Gateway Arch is shining beautifully from above and we look online to see if a certain Rams quarterback is still dominating the most hotly contested debates in fan forums everywhere. If so, it’s time to start another day.

Yes, if one thing is a given regarding the St. Louis Rams and the team’s corresponding message boards, it is this: analysis of the play and future projection of the 2010 NFL Draft’s No. 1 pick — former Heisman Trophy winner Sam Bradford — will be intense, cause division, occur constantly and seemingly never end.

In 2010, Bradford performed well enough to earn NFL Rookie of the Year honors despite playing with mostly marginal talent. His top receiver was undrafted wideout Danny Amendola. His leading tight end was another undrafted player, Daniel Fells. His blindside protector was an unproven rookie, Rodger Saffold, and his backup running backs were no-names Kenneth Darby and Keith Toston.

In 2011, Sam struggled with an ongoing ankle issue following an abbreviated offseason that included the implementation of a second offense in as many years.

(Full read with much more is available via link below. Hope you enjoy, my friends at Rams on Demand, even if you disagree with some of the points and analysis. I appreciate all the support over the past couple years):

http://101sports.com/category/misc-blog ... -in-2013?/

 

[nighttrain]

as always, a very good read and point on...
regards
train

 

[-X-]

Shane,

You're about to learn WHY there are these intense debates about Bradford across the internet.

Some still have questions about Bradford and his ability to not just improve as his talent level increases, but to seemingly raise the play of those around him. For example, some wonder why the likes of Donnie Avery, Laurent Robinson and Danario Alexander posted their most productive campaigns after leaving the Gateway City.

First, "raising the play of those around him" is a myth. It doesn't happen. I've posted a video of Aaron Rodgers in a 4th quarter situation - in the final seconds - and he failed to do that 'magic elevation' thing. Even WITH the talent he had at his disposal. It. just. doesn't. exist.

Secondly, Avery never played with Bradford. So you can blame Bulger for holding him back.

Danario Alexander had a successful year with Bradford, and then an even better one with Rivers. Why? Because he actually stayed on the field. Laurent Robinson was sandwiched between Austin, Bryant and Witten. OF COURSE he's going to have more targets and receptions. And what else? He, too, stayed healthy for once in his life. What did he do when he left that situation?

In fact, the Rams signal caller led four fourth quarter comebacks, tying for second in the league. To put that into perspective, New England Patriots quarterback Tom Brady has never bettered that number and Green Bay Packers QB Aaron Rodgers has yet to construct more than two such comebacks in a campaign.

That's another reason why there are so many debates. It's admirable what you pointed out there, and partially valid, but when you name Bradford in the same paragraph with those two, and expect it to mean something, people are going to flip their lids. That stat will stay on topic for all of 5 seconds before the numbnuts around the net begin to point out how much better those two are at everything else. And then the opposite side gets drawn into it trying to debunk their success (in those other areas) as relative to their longevity and support. After 10 minutes it's just a bitch fest full of bitchassness.

The article, in and of itself is solid. You make a lot of points that the more rational St Louis Rams fans try to make with regard to Bradford and the Rams. But just like any other rational, objective, and quantified view, this one is also going to be torn apart by the more "emotionally invested in being right" crowd. And you can take that to the bank.

Finally, this.

There is still an avenue to becoming a top-tier NFL team in this offensive era without an elite QB. The question is, will the Rams become an elite squad with an elite Sam Bradford, or will they have to attempt to get there the hard way, without a true franchise quarterback leading the way?

I don't think you're giving much latitude to Fisher's Rams here. You're making this QB-centric. The Rams have other options, as did MANY other Superbowl Winning teams. 3 solid phases of play (Offense, Defense, Special Teams) will produce just as much (if not more) than a team reliant upon the QB for their respective success. Bradford only needs to be very good. That's his job. The rest of the team ALSO needs to be very good. As would be THEIR jobs.

Again, good work. And thanks!

 

[nighttrain]

I don't think you're giving much latitude to Fisher's Rams here. You're making this QB-centric. The Rams have other options, as did MANY other Superbowl Winning teams. 3 solid phases of play (Offense, Defense, Special Teams) will produce just as much (if not more) than a team reliant upon the QB for their respective success. Bradford only needs to be very good. That's his job. The rest of the team ALSO needs to be very good. As would be THEIR jobs.

as always, a very good team surrounding a QB can elevate him to "elite" satus. Personally, i dont think a QB can make another player better, that would go to the coaches..
And the player himself putting forth the effort in practice
train

 

[SaneRamsFan]

Shane,

You're about to learn WHY there are these intense debates about Bradford across the internet.

Some still have questions about Bradford and his ability to not just improve as his talent level increases, but to seemingly raise the play of those around him. For example, some wonder why the likes of Donnie Avery, Laurent Robinson and Danario Alexander posted their most productive campaigns after leaving the Gateway City.

First, "raising the play of those around him" is a myth. It doesn't happen. I've posted a video of Aaron Rodgers in a 4th quarter situation - in the final seconds - and he failed to do that 'magic elevation' thing. Even WITH the talent he had at his disposal. It. just. doesn't. exist.

Secondly, Avery never played with Bradford. So you can blame Bulger for holding him back.

Danario Alexander had a successful year with Bradford, and then an even better one with Rivers. Why? Because he actually stayed on the field. Laurent Robinson was sandwiched between Austin, Bryant and Witten. OF COURSE he's going to have more targets and receptions. And what else? He, too, stayed healthy for once in his life. What did he do when he left that situation?

In fact, the Rams signal caller led four fourth quarter comebacks, tying for second in the league. To put that into perspective, New England Patriots quarterback Tom Brady has never bettered that number and Green Bay Packers QB Aaron Rodgers has yet to construct more than two such comebacks in a campaign.

That's another reason why there are so many debates. It's admirable what you pointed out there, and partially valid, but when you name Bradford in the same paragraph with those two, and expect it to mean something, people are going to flip their lids. That stat will stay on topic for all of 5 seconds before the numbnuts around the net begin to point out how much better those two are at everything else. And then the opposite side gets drawn into it trying to debunk their success (in those other areas) as relative to their longevity and support. After 10 minutes it's just a bitch fest full of bitchassness.

The article, in and of itself is solid. You make a lot of points that the more rational St Louis Rams fans try to make with regard to Bradford and the Rams. But just like any other rational, objective, and quantified view, this one is also going to be torn apart by the more "emotionally invested in being right" crowd. And you can take that to the bank.

Finally, this.

There is still an avenue to becoming a top-tier NFL team in this offensive era without an elite QB. The question is, will the Rams become an elite squad with an elite Sam Bradford, or will they have to attempt to get there the hard way, without a true franchise quarterback leading the way?

I don't think you're giving much latitude to Fisher's Rams here. You're making this QB-centric. The Rams have other options, as did MANY other Superbowl Winning teams. 3 solid phases of play (Offense, Defense, Special Teams) will produce just as much (if not more) than a team reliant upon the QB for their respective success. Bradford only needs to be very good. That's his job. The rest of the team ALSO needs to be very good. As would be THEIR jobs.

Again, good work. And thanks!

And here I thought I had a pretty decent vocabulary. You have to wait until just the right moment to use a great word like bitchassness.

 

[-X-]

And here I thought I had a pretty decent vocabulary. You have to wait until just the right moment to use a great word like bitchassness.

lol. I have that one holstered all the time now, but you're right. Timing is everything.

And of course, I can't take credit for the word itself. Brendon Ayanbadejo invented that one when describing the Patriots offense.

 

[SaneRamsFan]

I must be slipping-a whole thread on bitchassness and I missed it.

 

[ShaneG]

Shane,

You're about to learn WHY there are these intense debates about Bradford across the internet.

Some still have questions about Bradford and his ability to not just improve as his talent level increases, but to seemingly raise the play of those around him. For example, some wonder why the likes of Donnie Avery, Laurent Robinson and Danario Alexander posted their most productive campaigns after leaving the Gateway City.

First, "raising the play of those around him" is a myth. It doesn't happen. I've posted a video of Aaron Rodgers in a 4th quarter situation - in the final seconds - and he failed to do that 'magic elevation' thing. Even WITH the talent he had at his disposal. It. just. doesn't. exist.

Secondly, Avery never played with Bradford. So you can blame Bulger for holding him back.

Danario Alexander had a successful year with Bradford, and then an even better one with Rivers. Why? Because he actually stayed on the field. Laurent Robinson was sandwiched between Austin, Bryant and Witten. OF COURSE he's going to have more targets and receptions. And what else? He, too, stayed healthy for once in his life. What did he do when he left that situation?

In fact, the Rams signal caller led four fourth quarter comebacks, tying for second in the league. To put that into perspective, New England Patriots quarterback Tom Brady has never bettered that number and Green Bay Packers QB Aaron Rodgers has yet to construct more than two such comebacks in a campaign.

That's another reason why there are so many debates. It's admirable what you pointed out there, and partially valid, but when you name Bradford in the same paragraph with those two, and expect it to mean something, people are going to flip their lids. That stat will stay on topic for all of 5 seconds before the numbnuts around the net begin to point out how much better those two are at everything else. And then the opposite side gets drawn into it trying to debunk their success (in those other areas) as relative to their longevity and support. After 10 minutes it's just a bitch fest full of bitchassness.

The article, in and of itself is solid. You make a lot of points that the more rational St Louis Rams fans try to make with regard to Bradford and the Rams. But just like any other rational, objective, and quantified view, this one is also going to be torn apart by the more "emotionally invested in being right" crowd. And you can take that to the bank.

Finally, this.

There is still an avenue to becoming a top-tier NFL team in this offensive era without an elite QB. The question is, will the Rams become an elite squad with an elite Sam Bradford, or will they have to attempt to get there the hard way, without a true franchise quarterback leading the way?

I don't think you're giving much latitude to Fisher's Rams here. You're making this QB-centric. The Rams have other options, as did MANY other Superbowl Winning teams. 3 solid phases of play (Offense, Defense, Special Teams) will produce just as much (if not more) than a team reliant upon the QB for their respective success. Bradford only needs to be very good. That's his job. The rest of the team ALSO needs to be very good. As would be THEIR jobs.

Again, good work. And thanks!

Good point, X, on Avery.

As for DX and Robinson, I was merely posing questions of many Rams fans. I was in no way endorsing (nor dismissing) what has been said along those lines.

Finally, I think you misunderstood me somewhat, X, re: the Rams becoming elite with or without an elite No. 8. I tried to point out that above this team can become elite (because of all 3 phases) even if he is not. I think we essentially agree here. Thanks for all the great thoughts my friend. Hope all is well with you.

 

[GreeneCounty]

Bradford is making money of a elite Qb and that is where the issue lies.

 

[-X-]

Bradford is making money of a elite Qb and that is where the issue lies.

For whom? I don't care what he makes. If that rookie cap wasn't instituted in 2011, then Cam Newton would have signed a $85M contract, and Luck/Griffin would be making in excess of $100M. I fault the system, and not the man.

On the flip-side, if the rookie cap was put in place before Bradford was drafted, then nobody would have an issue with his development to this point? Or would they be more patient with him? I'm just talking out loud here, GC. About the salary issue. Not complaining about what you said. And I'll continue to defer to what Demoff said about Bradford's salary just recently (in the audio below). It makes sense, and if it doesn't bother him -- then it has no business bothering me.

"The cover charge right now for a QB is $10M plus. So just remember that when you look at contracts. We're not talking about a crippling contract. To me, that's the biggest misnomer about Sam Bradford, in the challenges in the contracts, and I don't lose sleep for one second over the decision we made."

[rp3]http://icestream.dev-cms.com:8000/stl/2013/01/01032013132616.mp3[/rp3]

 

[fearsomefour]

The hard part with Bradford is all the tools are there....but Trent Dilfer had all the tools also.
It seems he is slow going through reads and progressions, but, that is an assumption as none of us get to sitting in the meetings and hear them coach him.
Who knows how well he will progress? Working with the same O coordinator should help for sure. I also dont think the passing game issues have to do with the receivers at this point. Sam has got to grow.