Why Is Havenstein Being Switched To RG?

[bubbaramfan]

Only thing I've heard from coaching staff is "Hav is a smart guy". But I believe the change is for other reasons. I've heard lots of different speculation here at ROD and I have my own theary. I think some of it is due to his foot and toe injury he dealt with last year. After watching him in TC and last season He had issues with speed rushers. He's a bit slow footed and stiff at the waist. I think they want someone more stout and able to give the QB more time in the pocket.

I'm sure McVay Kromer and his staff have gone over every available video of the OL and have discussed how to make it better "ad nausem".

Maybe I've missed it ,but has the coaching staff given any other explanation?

 

[DCH]

They probably want someone with better mobility on the outside. Havenstein was your best OL the past two years, but he's not exactly a dancing bear, and he might go from Pretty Darned Good to Dominant on the inside.

 

[DaveFan'51]

IDK why, there could be a few scenario's as to why! But, If I remember correctly Hav. didn't allow one sack his 1st year and he was injured his 2nd year. There has to be some really nice talent there! JMHO.

My scenario, they knew they where going to bring in someone to play LOT and that they where going to move GRob to ROT. So logically, IF Havenstein is going to be a starter you have to move him to Guard. Just that simple! JMO!

 

[WestCoastRam]

Some posters (can't remember who) in the other forum did a great job discussing this. Kromer has installed a system ever since he's been with the Saints that values athleticism at guard higher than at tackle. His lines have been built from guard out (see how Chicago put Kyle Long at guard instead of tackle when they drafted him - he easily could have been one of their top tackles).

I think the idea is that by negating the pass rush up the middle, you can help the tackles with backs, formations and tight ends along with allowing the QB to step up into a developing pocket. Additionally, having your more dominate players at guard allows them to use their talent in the run game where devastating pull blocking becomes more of an option.

 

[ArkyRamsFan]

Some posters (can't remember who) in the other forum did a great job discussing this. Kromer has installed a system ever since he's been with the Saints that values athleticism at guard higher than at tackle. His lines have been built from guard out (see how they put Kyle Long at guard instead of tackle when they drafted him - he easily could have been one of their top tackles).

I think the idea is that by negating the pass rush up the middle, you can help the tackles with backs, formations and tight ends along with allowing the QB to step up into a developing pocket. Additionally, having your more dominate players at guard allows them to use their talent in the run game where devastating pull blocking becomes more of an option.

++1
Congrats WestCoastRam for the "Post of the day!"

 

[bubbaramfan]

Thx WCR. Kind of post I was looking for.:yess:

 

[jrry32]

The further you go inside on the OL, the more brain power you need. I expect that Kromer wants the best 5 on the field, and he believes Hav at guard allows that. Plus, the OGs in his scheme have tougher assignments mentally than the OTs do in the running game (the OGs are typically zone-blocking while the OTs are typically man-blocking).

 

[Merlin]

Agree with them wanting him inside, but I do suspect they were concerned about his feet after last season. While my assumption is that his dropoff was in large part due to injury, maybe they felt him holding it down at OG helped to prevent further issues as well idk.

More and more the RTs around the league have to have quick feet. And while I love Hav and think he has a bright future I admit he doesn't have quick feet. Even in his excellent rookie season he is more of a lumbering mover; effective but ugly as F doing it.

Brown is interesting out there though, because he does have some nimbleness to his feet. I wouldn't have thought of that, admittedly I'd have put Hav back out there at RT. But the more I think about it the more I suspect the two moves might be genius. We'll see.

 

[LACHAMP46]

They believe Hav is a player....but not suited for RT. Simple....I actually thought Jamon Brown would beat HIM out for the guard position.....It will be interesting competition in the summer for sure.

 

[Jacobarch]

I think at the end of the day Hav will end up at RT. While i agree he might be better than anyone we currently have at RG, I doubt anyone is better than him at RT. Maybe they see something in Brown at RT but i dunno at this point. I'm more interested to see where Grob ends up. Probably the bench.

 

[yrba1]

Pretty much the scheme. The real question is if other teams follow suit with valuing interior linemen more than tackles, will they be drafted in higher rounds, possibly even top 10?

 

[LACHAMP46]

Pretty much the scheme.

Did Buffalo run a zone scheme? I figured Washington ran power??? Atlanta ran a zone/power mix??? For the different backs? What's Kromer like to use?

 

[shovelpass]

Some posters (can't remember who) in the other forum did a great job discussing this. Kromer has installed a system ever since he's been with the Saints that values athleticism at guard higher than at tackle. His lines have been built from guard out (see how Chicago put Kyle Long at guard instead of tackle when they drafted him - he easily could have been one of their top tackles).

I think the idea is that by negating the pass rush up the middle, you can help the tackles with backs, formations and tight ends along with allowing the QB to step up into a developing pocket. Additionally, having your more dominate players at guard allows them to use their talent in the run game where devastating pull blocking becomes more of an option.

But is Hav athletic? Especially compared to GRob or even Brown, Robinson was a top prospect based off of athleticism and potential.. I know everyone says the injury is why he looked so bad last season, but he looked slow and stiff. His scouting report even says he's stiff and unathletic. And when McVay mentioned him moving to guard he never mentioned his athleticism as a reason. If anything were looking to get more athletic at RT.

 

[yrba1]

Did Buffalo run a zone scheme? I figured Washington ran power??? Atlanta ran a zone/power mix??? For the different backs? What's Kromer like to use?

Pardon me for wording that wrong, I mean scheme in a sense that he values interior linemen with higher football IQ than tackles, which is why their blocking assignments tend to be more demanding.

 

[bubbaramfan]

The "Shovel" hits the nail on the head.:headexplosion:

 

[WestCoastRam]

But is Hav athletic? Especially compared to GRob or even Brown, Robinson was a top prospect based off of athleticism and potential.. I know everyone says the injury is why he looked so bad last season, but he looked slow and stiff. His scouting report even says he's stiff and unathletic. And when McVay mentioned him moving to guard he never mentioned his athleticism as a reason. If anything were looking to get more athletic at RT.

I misspoke or misswrote there. I think athleticism was my word choice. I think we might want to replace that with Kromer wanting his better, more dominant players at guard. That's probably a combo of athleticism, power, IQ and whatnot.

 

[shovelpass]

I misspoke or misswrote there. I think athleticism was my word choice. I think we might want to replace that with Kromer wanting his better, more dominant players at guard. That's probably a combo of athleticism, power, IQ and whatnot.

Yeah, I agree with the rest of your first comment. Power, technique, IQ at the guard position.

 

[BonifayRam]

The further you go inside on the OL, the more brain power you need. I expect that Kromer wants the best 5 on the field, and he believes Hav at guard allows that. Plus, the OGs in his scheme have tougher assignments mentally than the OTs do in the running game (the OGs are typically zone-blocking while the OTs are typically man-blocking).

Agree with this....then boiling it on down from what jrry32 posted then We should expect that the Rams right side is well fortified with Good young vets that Kromer has at his disposal to work this right side out.

WHen Rob was drafted the Rams had one big hole @ RT. HE was drafted to be that RT for Boudreau. Rob began with Saffold as his right side mate, then it was Jamon Brown, then Cody Wichmann plus some Garrett Reynold's sprinkled in too. In the end it was Rob who was able to remain healthy while the others had injury issues.

What I do know Rob was able to play RT and pass protect very well as a rookie. Did Rob loose his rookie RT abilities? OR is there some serious damage done to Rob due to having played on that badly injured lower limb? OR is big Rob really a very unusual smart coach able OL'er who Kromer has ID'd as his perfect Kromer styled RG?

 

[Soul Surfer]

(Rob) was drafted to be that RT for Boudreau.

Rob began with Saffold as his right side mate,

then it was Jamon Brown, then Cody Wichmann

plus some Garrett Reynold's sprinkled in too.
In the end it was Rob who was able to remain healthy while the others had injury issues.

What I do know Rob was able to play RT and pass protect very well as a rookie.
Did Rob loose his rookie RT abilities? OR is there some serious damage done to Rob due to having played on that badly injured lower limb?

The first part of your post, if you are referring to his rookie season, would usually be a recipe for disaster for a rook.

However Havenstein had a very strong rookie year.

I think Havenstein had a bad year in '16 because he was forced to learn a new offense without the benefit of a Camp or a Preseason and then forced to play injured.

 

[LACHAMP46]

But is Hav athletic?

Simple answer, no.