When/if To Trade Our #2 Pick?

[ramfaninfla]

Do you think it will be a draft day trade or before? With Houston "thinking" about taking Clowney #1(smoke screen or not) That will leave Snead in a very nice position with all the qb's sitting there. Does Snead hold out till draft day? If Houston then takes Bridgewater instead does Snead lose some value by waiting?

 

[-X-]

Probably not for a few weeks before the draft, if at all.

 

[jap]

Whenever Snisher closes the bidding war, assuming there is one that provides the Rams with the assortment of picks they want.

 

[ChrisW]

I read somewhere that if the Texans shop their pick, the Rams would most likely wait to trade their pick until they are on the clock in the first round.

It's still early, so that that with a grain of salt.

 

[paceram]

I read somewhere that if the Texans shop their pick, the Rams would most likely wait to trade their pick until they are on the clock in the first round.

It's still early, so that that with a grain of salt.

I think the Rams will wait until they are on the clock before they make a trade (If, they do indeed make a trade). To be honest, I did not know the #2 pick could be traded before the Draft.

 

[Thordaddy]

I SERIOUSLY doubt the Rams wait until they are on the clock primarily because it eliminates the ability to involve negotiations with multiple suitors.
As the saying says you are "on the clock" and deals the magnitude this one has potential to be aren't usually the kind of thing people who make deals want to be shoot from the hip and in that time fielding offers from 4 or 5 possibles would be chaotic .
What is more we have a model to work off of that I expect to be replicated ,IOW I think they operate pretty well the way they did in the RG deal, even though the "fever" for the pick may not reach the magnitude the RG trade did , the principles of negotiation Snead utilizes have the same application.
Open the bidding on a date certain close the bidding on another date certain then accept or decline on the best offer.
IMO that process will get first shot we will only wait till we are on the clock if that process doesn't yield enough in Snead and Co's estimation.

 

[Alan]

paceram thinking correctly:
I think the Rams will wait until they are on the clock before they make a trade (If, they do indeed make a trade). To be honest, I did not know the #2 pick could be traded before the Draft.

You're correct in that assumption. Negotiations can begin at any time for any pick. They just can't be finalized. Only the first round pick can be manipulated before the draft starts. Even if the team holding the first round pick signs a player before the draft starts, which they are allowed to do, the team holding the second round pick still can't finalize a deal. Of course most, if not all, of the negotiations can already have taken place. It would be foolish to do a deal earlier than necessary. It would probably make much more sense to allow for the possibility for panic to set in at the last moment. Snisher didn't allow for last minute negotiations to take place when we did the RGIII deal. He gave a reason but it made no sense to me. Why stop an auction until the gavel comes down?

 

[tonyl711]

I don't think Snead will be turning down any calls, but really unless the Texans sign their pick before the draft how would any teams know who will be there? so IMO things don't get serious until the Texans make their move.

 

[nighttrain]

if /texas goes for Mallet it will bring some different players in the "who picks 2nd" derby
train

 

[Thordaddy]

I think the Rams will wait until they are on the clock before they make a trade (If, they do indeed make a trade). To be honest, I did not know the #2 pick could be traded before the Draft.

The RGIII trade was,this is the exact same draft position as that was and FWIW Washington traded for the pick and would have been as satisfied to have taken Luck had Indy decided to take RG.
Whoever would trade for this pick would be certain that their options 1 ,2 3 and likely 4 would be gone before they pick ,be willing to give up a premium to assure one of their top two choice would be theirs, SAME assurance Washington traded for.

 

[Alan]

tonyl711 obviously not a Boy Scout when younger:
I don't think Snead will be turning down any calls, but really unless the Texans sign their pick before the draft how would any teams know who will be there? so IMO things don't get serious until the Texans make their move.

I think teams will always have contingency plans. If Clowney is available I'll give you this... and so on.

 

[tonyl711]

Alan im sure that's true, but without knowing for sure who is off the board how could you know the value you place on the pick? just because there are a few good QBs doesn't mean that each team with a need for QB have them all rated that high. the year we traded the Skins Luck and RG3 were pretty much guaranteed to go first and second, this year there are to many question marks to know for sure who goes first or second.

 

[BigRamFan]

Alan im sure that's true, but without knowing for sure who is off the board how could you know the value you place on the pick? just because there are a few good QBs doesn't mean that each team with a need for QB have them all rated that high. the year we traded the Skins Luck and RG3 were pretty much guaranteed to go first and second, this year there are to many question marks to know for sure who goes first or second.

Agree with what you're saying here for the most part but if you're a QB needy team like MINN wouldn't you rather have your choice that to take what is available later? IIRC that's how they ended up with Ponder.

 

[Thordaddy]

Agree with what you're saying here for the most part but if you're a QB needy team like MINN wouldn't you rather have your choice that to take what is available later? IIRC that's how they ended up with Ponder.

Yeah that's the point trading into our spot guarantees Manzeil Bortles or Bridgewater,so in some ways it really is as attractive as the RG deal

 

[Alan]

tonyl711 responding with:
Alan im sure that's true, but without knowing for sure who is off the board how could you know the value you place on the pick? just because there are a few good QBs doesn't mean that each team with a need for QB have them all rated that high. the year we traded the Skins Luck and RG3 were pretty much guaranteed to go first and second, this year there are to many question marks to know for sure who goes first or second.

That's all true tony but you can't wait until the last moment to figure this stuff out. I'm pretty sure they war game every probable scenario ahead of time so that they're ready. Especially now that the time between picks has been greatly decreased (thank Bhudda!).

 

[tonyl711]

you guys aren't getting what I am trying to say.
take the Vikings for example, they are looking for a QB right? well what if they only think Bridgewater is worth trading up for, what if they don't value anyone else enough to trade for? so unless you value at least 2 players enough to trade for, then you really cant make that trade until you know your guy will be there.
and im not saying that they wont have went over every possible scenario, im sure every team will. but how can you know which scenario will play out until that first pick is written in stone?

 

[Alan]

tonyl711 trying to be understood:
take the Vikings for example, they are looking for a QB right? well what if they only think Bridgewater is worth trading up for, what if they don't value anyone else enough to trade for? so unless you value at least 2 players enough to trade for, then you really cant make that trade until you know your guy will be there.
and im not saying that they wont have went over every possible scenario, im sure every team will. but how can you know which scenario will play out until that first pick is written in stone?

I'm pretty sure I understand you perfectly tony. I think it's my fault we're miscommunicating.

So I'll take your example of the Vikes.
Plan A: We will give the Rams X for the second pick if the Colts take Clowney.
Plan B: We will give the Rams Y (or nothing) for the second pick if the Colts take Bridgewater (or Manziel).

So you're correct that as of now they don't know who the Colts will pick. But they have a plan in place for both eventualities. So they call the Rams tomorrow and they say hey, if the Colts take Clowney (or Manziel) we'll give you X (not our X of course) and if they take Bridgewater we'll give you Y or we don't want your pick. So now the Rams know what they can get from the Vikes for the second pick no matter what happens. They're all set as far as knowing what the trade parameters will be if they go with the Vikes offer. Of course no deals can be made until after the Colts make their decision AND the draft starts officially because any deal made now would be illegal. Although I'm not sure if illegal is the right word but in any case the NFL wouldn't accept it.

Now that's just one suiter that the Rams have a POTENTIAL deal with. The Jags call them and make them two offers that take into consideration all the possible choices the Colts might make with different offers depending on their choice.

So at this point, the Rams know what each team will offer for a trade up no matter who the Colts pick. The Jags and the Vikes know what they want to offer no matter who the Colts pick. All the groundwork is already done. Of course this isn't possible to do the farther down the draft you get because the possibilities of who is gone and who is left become way too large to compute.

Of course when the clock starts for the Rams and Snead calls the Vikes GM and tells them that the Jags offer trumps theirs they might change their minds and offer more.

 

[LesBaker]

This time it's much more of a poker game for Snead because there are so many moving parts where last time there was really just one option, who wants Griffin.

This is the deal, and draft, where Snead makes his bones.