This One Position Change, Changes Everything

[bubbaramfan]

As much as I don't care for the play of Nick Foles, the WR's not getting open and all the recievers dropping balls, the one position that screws it all up from the start is the CENTER. Time Barnes gets pushed backwards into the pocket almost every single snap. It all starts up front. It affects the OL continuity, they can't zone block, Foles has someone in his face. It affects the whole offense. If Rams had a center who could actually push the D, every other O-lineman would have an eaisier time doing their job. Foles would be a lot different QB if he could do his progressions without someone constantly in his face. WR's might actually get some separation.

It all starts up front. Rams will have 3 picks in th first 2 rounds of the next draft. They should pick the top rated center with one of them or go out and get the top FA center. Barnes is the beginning of what's wrong with Rams offense. Start with center and a lot of the rest will fix itself.

Ethan Pocic-- 6'7" 310 lbs. LSU 2nd rnd if he's still there. Dan Voltz 6;3" 312 Wis, late 2nd or 3rd rnd.

 

[woofwoofmo]

Sorry, have to say you are way far off base on this observation. Couldn't be farther from the truth if you tried. To blame Barnes for the problems on the OL shows a serious lack of knowledge as to how an OL operates. If anything, Barnes should be getting much more praise than he is for keeping things from being worse than they are. With revolving doors at both guard positions there is no continuity on the line. The center is almost always working with one of the guards against a DT or NT, rarely is it a 1 on 1 match-up. So far this year there have been 3 guards play with little of no experience, leading to numerous blown assignments that may look like the centers fault but in reality are misses by the guards. Throw in a LT who still hasn't a clue what he's doing in many circumstances and it's led to many breakdowns. The best OL right now would be to have Barnes at Center, Reynolds at RG and Havenstein at RT, to at least give one productive side of the line, but they can't do that because the LT needs so much help with his assignments and Reynolds has to help at LG. Wichman is going to be a good guard one day, but he's not there now. Missing most of training camp seriously delayed his progress, enough that he can't help with the call to the LT.

Again, this has to be one of the more ludicrous threads I've seen here.

 

[Alan]

While I don't think TB is one of the main problems, like you I've seen him pushed back into the pocket way too many times. An upgrade is certainly in order IMO. But...we have bigger needs at LT, WR, TE and QB that things would have to work out perfectly, or imperfectly, depending on your viewpoint, for that to be a viable option I would think.

 

[DCH]

Timmy Barnes is a mediocre-at-best center, and this is coming from his "official sponsor." I'd love to upgrade him, but at the same time, he's been consistent, healthy and not the problem with the O-line.

 

[12intheBox]

If we are only going to make one position change, then lets make it the QB.

 

[bubbaramfan]

My eyes aren't deceiving me woof, and I'm not the only one.

 

[jjab360]

Barnes is only mediocre, but the rest of the OL is downright abysmal.

 

[woofwoofmo]

I stand by my earlier comments, to blame the center for all the offensive woes is downright asinine. Recommend a good eye doctor, this offense has a lot worse problems than the center.

 

[CoachO]

My eyes aren't deceiving me woof, and I'm not the only one.

With all due respect, I couldn't agree more with Woof in his assessment. You have no idea the number of times the inexperience at RG has led to Barnes being isolated on a bigger DT when he is supposed to get help from the Guard.

If you watch any offensive line in football, at any level, the center just isn't asked to snap the ball and pass block one on one very often. The Guards are expected to handle the initial pressure and get assistance from the Center. All too often, Barnes is left to fend for himself and it will always look like he is getting manhandled. When in fact, it was a miscommunication that caused it in the first place.

Now add to this, the part about the LT, and how it affects the rest of the unit and you might understand how dysfunctional this has become. It started way back in training camp. People questioned why Boudreau waited so long to switch Saffold to RG and insert Brown at LG. Well they needed the vet lined up next to the former #2 overall pick to make sure he knew what to do on most any given play. Now they run into the same issue with needing Reynolds at LG. Think it's a coincidence that when they were forced to play Donnal at LG the whole thing imploded? And then Wichman and Rhaney in the same game?

They have played no less than TEN different linemen, and the one constant has been Barnes. He is the least of the issues on this unit and has been a noticeable upgrade over Wells.

 

[Gandalf]

The light needs to come on for our big, strong, athletic left tackle.

 

[Debacled]

I agree on the one position thing.

Disagree on which position. Starts with a Q and ends with a B. Heres another hint, its not the C.

 

[shaunpinney]

The first positional change I'd do is at HC, our offence is officially offensive, it's been "Fishered" there we go I've called it... the Rams have been Fishered!

 

[CoachO]

You point out that "new and inexperienced players" are going to need time and then suggest putting a less experienced Rhaney in at Center where experience is even more important than any other position. Rhaney lost the job in part because he doesn't make the proper line calls and is even more prone to be physically overmatched than Barnes.

IMO this has been the epitome of the "worst case scenario" for this unit. Place the blame if you want. But there was no way anyone could have any reasonable expectation that they would be down to the 10th and even 11th guy.

They lost BOTH starting Guards. BOTH RTs (Havenstien and Williams) and the one remaining swing player that had the benefit of an entire training camp (Donnal). Wichmann has the ability but is greatly limited due to missing a large portion of training camp with his injury.

The "plan" was to let guys like Wichmann, Donnal and Battle red-shirt this year and develop to compete for jobs next year.

When they are forced to play so many guys prematurely it impacts everything they do. The play calling is limited. The protections have to be very basic. I know how much people hate the term "vanilla" but that's what they are forced into when guys who just don't know what they are supposed to do are forced to play. And that includes Rhaney.

 

[thirteen28]

You point out that "new and inexperienced players" are going to need time and then suggest putting a less experienced Rhaney in at Center where experience is even more important than any other position. Rhaney lost the job in part because he doesn't make the proper line calls and is even more prone to be physically overmatched than Barnes.

IMO this has been the epitome of the "worst case scenario" for this unit. Place the blame if you want. But there was no way anyone could have any reasonable expectation that they would be down to the 10th and even 11th guy.

They lost BOTH starting Guards. BOTH RTs (Havenstien and Williams) and the one remaining swing player that had the benefit of an entire training camp (Donnal). Wichmann has the ability but is greatly limited due to missing a large portion of training camp with his injury.

The "plan" was to let guys like Wichmann, Donnal and Battle red-shirt this year and develop to compete for jobs next year.

When they are forced to play so many guys prematurely it impacts everything they do. The play calling is limited. The protections have to be very basic. I know how much people hate the term "vanilla" but that's what they are forced into when guys who just don't know what they are supposed to do are forced to play. And that includes Rhaney.

This is one reason I'm not as down on Boudreau as some people. Losing one guy, maybe two, it tolerable, but when you are scraping the bottom of your depth chart and pulling guys off the practice squad you are going to have an absolute mess. Expecting him to make a great OL out of this is expecting him to work miracles. And it seems like he's been in this situation a lot since he's been here ... and he doesn't get to choose the talent either.

 

[JonRam99]

Good posts. Helpful to understand what's really going on with the Rams' offense, being forced to simplify the playbook (and neutralize our playmakers) due to OL inexperience & rawness. smh.

 

[dieterbrock]

One position? HC

 

[fearsomefour]

Barnes has been solid in my estimation. One thing he has been better at than I expected is run blocking. It has been a bit hit and miss, but, he has been great at times run blocking. He is an upgrade over Wells and I would expect the Rams to resign him. If you want to bring in competition at C I have no problem with that at all. My concern with a guy 6' 7" playing C is letting shorter DT/NT under his pads and really getting pushed backward. There is a point where height is a negative for an interior lineman. A 6' 7" guy generally is going to have a problem playing low enough inside....maybe the guy you mentioned does this well, I have not seen him, I am speaking in general terms.
Some of the things that are discussed on this thread is what makes some of the player rankings so frustrating....there really is no way to accurately grade a lineman without knowing what his responsibilities are on a given play. I don't put a whole lot of stock in player rankings done by an outside source (like PFF or whatever it is).
To me, the area of focus for the O is QB, LT (is Robinson a LT or not), WR, TE.
In terms of salary and return I am letting Britt and Cook go this year. That leaves a lot of holes (along with Givens and possibly Bailey) in the receiving corp.

 

[LACHAMP46]

The line has been shaky at times....all the injuries...but the line is not the major problem with this offense....that drive vs the Cards says it all... zero coverage all over, minimal pressure, and still the misses...on 4th down, the money down...watch what Britt does after the ball sails by him...hell, look at Foles expression...He looks like...Bradford....And I was watching Sammy play Sunday night...and he looked like...somebody else....