Rams @ Vikes Pregame Thread

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A.J. Hicks

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Mods close it shut it down put me in my place if I am jumping the gun.

This game is going to be a slugfest.

The defense disguises things really well and it can leave the QB in a very vulnerable position. They have multiple ways of disguising and delaying pressures.

Let our special teams play a big role in dictating field position.

Protect the ball and take the ball away.

WE NOT ME!
 

TexasRam

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Elmgrovegnome

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I guess ya'll are as excited for this game to start as I am. I haven't been this pumped for a Rams game since Marc Bulger was the QB and SJ was running the ball.

Maybe it is because I now feel that the Rams have a good chance to win any game they play in, no matter how good the opponent is. And when it comes to opponents, well I have a thing for stomping on Zimmer and the Vikings.

Or maybe it is because they are actually in the playoff hunt
 

CGI_Ram

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https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/...-mike-zimmers-vikings-defense-is-must-see-tv/

Why Sean McVay's Rams offense vs. Mike Zimmer's Vikings defense is must-see TV

If someone had told you prior to the start of the season that the Week 11 matchup between the Rams and Vikings would pit two powerhouse 7-2 contenders against each other to determine which has a leg up on a bid for a first-round playoff bye, the proper response would have been to assume that you'd just woken from years-long hibernation and ask what year it was.

Las Vegas oddsmakers set the line for Minnesota's 2017 win total at 8.5 wins, while Los Angeles was way down at 5.5 wins. Neither team was necessarily expected to make a playoff push, let alone a run at one of the top two seeds. Instead, both teams have shocked (or at least surprised) the football world -- they each currently sit one game behind the Philadelphia Eagles for the best record in the NFL.

Both teams are getting it done with strong play on both sides of the ball. The Rams are the top team in Football Outsiders' overall DVOA ratings, ranked 11th on offense and first on defense. They lead the NFL in points per game, 30-point games, and expressions of surprise at how young their coach is. The Vikings aren't far behind the Rams, checking in fifth in overall DVOA, seventh on offense, and ninth on defense. The Vikes having a strong point prevention unit is not a surprise, given the talent on hand and the coaching strengths of Mike Zimmer, but Case Keenum is leading a top-10 offense definitely qualifies as a shocker.

Still, the intrigue in a Rams-Vikings game undoubtedly lies in the matchup between Sean McVay's offense and Zimmer's defense. The Rams becoming a Greatest Show on Turf-style juggernaut that can rain points quicker than any team in the league is probably the biggest surprise of the season, and seeing it go up against one of football's stingiest defenses is going to be quite a lot of fun.

Only two teams stopped L.A. from scoring at least 27 points this season: Washington and Seattle. Only two teams have scored more than 20 on the Vikes: Pittsburgh and Washington.

It's not a coincidence that the two teams that slowed down the Rams each have strong cornerback play on both sides of the field and defensive lines that can get pressure without resorting to the blitz. Not surprisingly given their defensive prowess, the Vikings are a team just like that (Xavier Rhodeshas been excellent for a while, and Trae Waynes has really come on over the last few weeks), and they also have one of the most athletic linebacker and safety groups in the league.

It's also not a coincidence that the two teams that pierced the Minnesota defense have passers that attack with throws deep down the field. Loosening up a defense over the top opens up the middle, the toughest area to cover. Fittingly, that has been one of Jared Goff's strengths this season; he's fourth in the NFL in passer rating on throws at least 20 yards downfield, per Pro Football Focus, a major leap forward from last year when he completed just 4 of 17 such passes.

McVay is scheming players open all over the field, but Goff has been at his most effective when attacking the middle of the defense. He's thrown 12 of his 16 touchdown passes and racked up 64 percent of his passing yards on throws to players between the painted numbers on the field.

The Vikings have defended passes to the deep middle very effectively -- no surprise with Harrison Smith lurking on the back end of the defense. He's having one of his best seasons. Where you've been able to attack them over the middle is with shorter passes, but even those have not yielded much in the way of big gains. The Vikings will allow you to complete those passes, but they rally to the ball and tackle as well or better than any defense in the league. Tight ends and slot receivers have been able to rack up targets and catch totals against the Vikes, but have not broken free for big yardage.

But the Rams don't really attack the middle with those types of players -- they mostly do it by getting their outside receivers working across the field or up the seams. Slot man Cooper Kupp actually only has 18 catches when lined up in the slot. He's got 14 when lined up outside. L.A.'s tight ends aren't intimately involved in the offense, and Tavon Austin has become exclusively a gadget player. Instead, the Rams run Robert Woods, Sammy Watkins, and whoever else lines up on the outside through lot of slants, posts, and crossers, oftentimes in combination with each other in order to make linebackers and safeties decide which threat is greater, then let Goff read the defender and make the correct call on where to throw.

They'll also sneak Todd Gurley out of the backfield on pivot routes in order to give Goff a second underneath option on occasion. Most running back routes are to the outside when the player comes out of the backfield because that's safer for check-downs, but you can catch the defense leaning the wrong way if you send the back on a route that looks like it's headed to the outside, only for him to snap it off back towards the middle.

The design of all these route combinations is the key -- McVay is opening up the widest possible lanes for Goff to throw through. According to the NextGen Stats on NFL.com, Goff makes fewer throws into tight windows than any other passer in the league. This should not be a surprise for the quarterback of a McVay-led offense; Kirk Cousins made the second-fewest tight window throws last season, when McVay was his offensive coordinator in Washington. By the way, Goff made the third-most tight window throws last season. So, yeah, McVay is making an impact.

Of course, you can't make throws into any window if you're not well-protected. Goff faced pressure on 44 percent of his dropbacks last season, per Pro Football Focus, the third-highest rate among 37 qualified passers. This season, he's only been pressured 34 percent of the time. Just like every other quarterback in the league, he's better when throwing from a clean pocket (110.0 passer rating compared to 82.3 when pressured), so the better protection has been a boon for his numbers. A lot of the credit has to go to free agent signings Andrew Whitworth and John Sullivan, who have stabilized what was previously one of the worst lines in the NFL.

They'll have their hands full on Sunday, especially if Everson Griffen suits up despite his week of limited practices. (He says he's ready to play.) The Vikes can get pressure by rushing only four, but they do their best work when bringing targeted blitzes. Anthony Barr, Eric Kendricks, and Harrison Smith are all extremely effective when Zimmer unleashes them in the rush. Minnesota's pressure rate shoots up from 34 percent to 42 percent when bringing five rushers instead of four, and skyrockets to 62 percent when they send six guys after the quarterback.

If the Rams can hold up in protection and give Goff adequate time, McVay will figure out a way to open up those wide throwing windows over the middle of the field eventually. It's up to Goff to exploit them. He's running up against a tough challenge in one of the better defenses in the league this Sunday. The last time that happened (against Seattle), he struggled. Whether he can show that he's taken a step forward will go a long way toward determining whether his team gains firmer footing in the race for one of the top seeds in the NFC, or falls back toward the pack.
 

den-the-coach

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From inferior to elite: How Jared Goff and Case Keenum got here

T
HOUSAND OAKS, Calif. -- The 2016 season ended and Case Keenum sat down with Les Snead, the Los Angeles Rams' general manager. It was your typical exit interview, the kind one would imagine after a woefully disappointing 4-12 season. By the end of it, Keenum felt it was "going to be in everybody's best interest to move on."

Keenum didn't know what was next, but really, neither did the Rams. They had Jared Goff, the young quarterback they took with the No. 1 overall pick in the most recent draft. But they didn't know what they had in him. Goff started for the last seven weeks and finished with an 18.3 Total QBR, which ranked last among those with at least five starts at quarterback. Keenum finished with a 37.5 Total QBR, last among quarterbacks with enough reps to qualify.

A year later, according to ESPN Stats & Information, Keenum and Goff represent the NFL's two biggest Total QBR improvements. They're leading two 7-2 teams, playing at their best heading into Sunday's highly anticipated matchup between the Rams and the Minnesota Vikings from U.S. Bank Stadium in Minneapolis.

"I'm pumped for him," Keenum said about Goff to L.A.-based reporters on a recent conference call.

"I couldn't be happier for the guy," Goff said of Keenum. "He deserves it all."

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Goff has completed 39 of 59 passes for 666 yards, seven touchdowns and zero interceptions in the past two games. He leads the NFL with 8.5 yards per attempt and ranks seventh with a 101.5 passer rating for a Rams team that is averaging a league-best 32.9 points per game. Keenum, still holding off Teddy Bridgewater for the Vikings' starting job, is coming off a four-touchdown performance and ranks third in the NFL with a 72.5 Total QBR for an offense that ranks seventh in defense-adjusted value over average (DVOA).

Keenum was asked whether he could have ever predicted this, he and Goff playing so well for offenses that are running so efficiently.

"I think you predicted that, right?" Keenum said, drawing a laugh. "It's a funny game and it's a crazy business, but that's what makes this so cool."

The success of Goff and Keenum seems, ostensibly, like an indictment on Jeff Fisher, the former Rams coach who oversaw ineffective, antiquated offenses for half a decade.

But there's more to it than that.

A new Goff
For Goff, Fisher's absence is only half of one answer.

First-year Rams head coach Sean McVay, who at 31 is already one of the game's sharpest offensive minds, has put a staff and a scheme around Goff that has set him up for success. But the Rams also have better players around him. Goff is taking snaps behind a significantly improved offensive line, thanks to the additions of left tackle Andrew Whitworthand center John Sullivan. And he's throwing to a far more talented collection of receivers, a group that includes a trio of newcomers in Sammy Watkins, Robert Woods and Cooper Kupp.

Goff himself has improved, too.

He went to work at the very beginning of the offseason, immersing himself in film at the Rams' facility by early January. He studied McVay's Washington Redskins offenses as soon as the Rams hired him later that month, then worked at the acclaimed 3DQB program in California when NFL rules kept him from being around the team. When new receivers joined, he scheduled workouts to throw with them immediately.

Some of that work ethic came from watching Keenum.

"He wasn't super highly touted coming out of college, and he made his career by working hard," Goff said. "That hard work is something I tried to grasp as much as I could."

The criticism toward Goff was intense and pointed after a rookie season in which he completed 54.6 percent of his passes, averaged 5.3 yards per attempt, threw five touchdowns to seven interceptions and lost all seven of his starts. But teammates quickly saw someone taking more command of this offense, of his career, heading into 2017. Woods, who came over as a free agent, saw a natural thrower.

"It started in the summer," Woods said. "He has a pretty ball. It's just shorts and a T-shirt, but I've seen him click in the season and in training camp. He's been in control and been dominant pretty much since I got here."

Goff heads into Sunday as the first quarterback in franchise history with back-to-back performances of 300-plus passing yards, three-plus touchdowns and zero interceptions. He has taken only 13 sacks, half the number he absorbed in two fewer games last season. Thanks to McVay's scheme, which marries the run and the pass in innovative ways, he has thrown 12 more touchdowns than interceptions and is on pace for 4,240 yards.

Goff's mental toughness draws constant praise -- Keenum volunteered that himself, while talking about how Goff handled a trying 2016 season -- but McVay also sees evolution in Goff's decision-making.

Todd Gurley, the NFC's leader in yards from scrimmage, isn't surprised by Goff's emergence in his second season.

"The guy went No. 1," Gurley said. "Dude don't go No. 1 for no reason."

Making his Case
Those were the circumstances under which Keenum entered the 2016 season. He was the incumbent starter, a man who performed well for a lifeless Rams offense in the final four games of 2015. But the Rams moved up 14 spots to take Goff the following April, and the focus never shifted away from him.

Keenum started the first nine games of the 2016 season, all of them amid incessant speculation about when Goff would take his turn. By Week 9, a home crowd was chanting "We want Goff!" whenever Keenum's passes fell incomplete. The following week, after a 9-6 road victory over the New York Jets, Goff was named the starter. Fisher made up his mind before that game even began.

"I wasn't happy," Keenum said then. "I want to play."

But Keenum remained a captain and vowed to keep his focus on the team, even with free agency months away. He promised to be there for Goff, which is why so many in the Rams' locker room are now happy to see Keenum succeed on his own.

"Everybody here has an abundant amount of respect for him," Rams left guard Rodger Saffold said.

"I think Case is a heck of a football player," defensive tackle Aaron Donaldadded. "Things happen how they happen, and they happen for the best, I guess, because he's playing good football."

Keenum, like Goff, is largely a product of better surroundings. He throws to arguably the NFL's best receiver duo in Stefon Diggs and Adam Thielen, and he also has a reliable tight end in Kyle Rudolph. He's supported by a running game that, with Jerick McKinnon and Latavius Murray, remains strong in the wake of Dalvin Cook's season-ending injury. The offensive line, meanwhile, has improved significantly with the offseason additions of tackles Riley Reiff and Mike Remmers.

But it starts with Pat Shurmur, the Vikings' offensive coordinator who has in some ways catered his offense to Keenum, a more mobile quarterback than Game 1 starter Sam Bradford, who now sits on injured reserve.

"I love the scheme," Keenum said.


But Bridgewater is healthy now, nearly 15 months after suffering a devastating knee injury during practice. Keenum's days as the Vikings' starter seem numbered. This is his cross to bear. Keenum went undrafted in 2012, and ever since then his leash as a starting quarterback has been short, his margin for error perpetually small.

In the meantime, though, Keenum -- and Goff, for that matter -- is proof that good quarterbacks can thrive in the right environments.

“That’s an outsider’s perspective; it’s not for me to say," Keenum said, deflecting the logic. "What I try to do is try to be the best quarterback that I can be and put my team in the best chance possible to win football games -- no matter what team I’m on, no matter what offense I’m in, no matter what play is called."

[www.espn.com]
 

den-the-coach

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Now FWIW's the way the Vikings are playing with Keenum at QB is how Jeff Fisher envisioned his Rams, problem is, Fisher hired the likes of Brian Schottheimer, Frank Cignetti & Rob Boras to run his offense, whereas Mike Zimmer hired Norv Turner & Pat Shurmur, big difference.

Now quite frankly I prefer an offensive coach because I believe it's easier to find quality DC's then Quality OC's, however, the hope is the guy you have won't be poached. For us Wade will not be hired away to be a Head Coach and IMO, neither will Pat Shurmur.
 

LACHAMP46

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Biggest game of the season....it's funny how, almost every few weeks....we run into a game like this.
 

VegasRam

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Recording the game tomorrow Read the blurb. Dumbasses!
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Mojo Ram

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Mods close it shut it down put me in my place if I am jumping the gun.
Not jumping the gun at all, but to be honest i think most(including myself) consider our weekly "what fans are saying" thread to be the official pre game discussion.

I mean, it is 16 pages of discussion about the up coming game. :)
 

A.J. Hicks

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  • Thread Starter Thread Starter
  • #18
Not jumping the gun at all, but to be honest i think most(including myself) consider our weekly "what fans are saying" thread to be the official pre game discussion.

I mean, it is 16 pages of discussion about the up coming game. :)

You are right. And I am in that thread daily and do not miss a post.

However, I meant to say gameday thread not necessarily pregame thread.

I have been watching a lot of Vikings film leading up to this game. This is going to be one hell of a matchup.

Our defense and special teams need to be ready to play spectacular.

Vikings disguise and play so cohesively on defense. We need to take care of the ball and trust the process. Don't get too down or too high. This is a We not Me team.
 

DaveFan'51

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How many did we lose in the 70's to the Vikes? That is about as relevant as the losing streak between two teams who are totally different even as compared to last year, and 40 years ago..
For the record The Rams are:
* 14-21-2 Life-time in the reg. season vs the Viqueens!
* 2-5 in the Playoffs!
And to answer your Question;
* In the 1970's/1970-79. The rams where 5-5-1 vs the Viqueens!

Sunday we Snap our 4 game Losing streak to them!!